the underlying force behind the change to the site

[Lowbrow]

I'm also level 24. I'm looking forward to learning what that means. It sounds interesting.

What is this level thing you’re talking about?

 

[/\/\3phist0]

I could live happily with all the feature tweaks, and get used to finding stuff all over again.
What REALLY rubs me the wrong way is the plethora of huge and annoying ADS. Is this the drive to push everyone onto the ad-free tier?

My next logical account upgrade will cost Five Hundred Bucks American... that would buy me a few sets of strings

Just use a browser with an adblocker.

 

[Patrice B]

Well, all forums are skewing older. It's a format that just isn't used as much anymore.

There are a lot of younger bass players/musicians of all kinds, but they have more resources available now and other ways of talking to each other. They practice, they ask for tips and learning materials, they record themselves and share videos within those places for critique, all kinds of stuff.

Plus this forum, in particular, has a rep as being full of stodgy old people. The sort who are resistant to change, complain too much, trash talk anything new in music/production/etc, and so on. You get the idea. Depending on who you ask, mentions of this place will induce eye rolling, warnings about picking through the crap, even advice to stay away and go somewhere more useful. It's not 100%, but it's there.

I am still young at 51 and learning from this site… !

 

[Prodigus Filius]

With any luck TB might morph into Tiktok Bass /sarc
Have all the new 'influencers' doing challengers, like playing your bass whilst train surfing. Yeh, that's the ticket

 

[TheArchitect]

Honestly with data seemingly copied and all of the 1 time conversion stuff done its seem to be pretty much back to normal

 

[Space Pickle]

wait now i'm level 28

 

[Prodigus Filius]

How can you turn off this gaming shite?

 

[Derry Murbles]

A few observations:

2) We can recognize change for the sake of change (99% of UI "updates") versus change for functional reasons.

I’m less certain, since you seem to be under the impression that the UI change that’s been so challenging was the result of a nefarious and totally optional initiative to change for the sake of change… oh, and to push out the olds. It’s been stated several times that the update and platform switch was NECESSARY in order to continue the operation of the site.

So when you (not YOU, personally, probably, but whoever decides to change not just the stuff back there in the engine room but also to put the clutch on the right, gas in the middle, brake on the left, and make it so you turn the steering wheel left to go right ) change up the user interface, which did not need to be changed, yep, we get a bit salty.

The site looks, conservatively, 85% the same to my eyes and functions as similar before making any adjustments to display/filter options. A few things were relocated, but you can set the site to look, conservatively, about 90% or more like the old format. Take a few breaths, almost everything functions substantially similarly to how it used to function.

"....We know 90% of the negative feedback come from resistance to change..." No, 90% of the negative feedback comes from resistance to UNNECESSARY change that makes our tasks harder, more time-consuming, and buggier.

Again, change was necessary. I mean what are we talking about here? Three more seconds and an extra keystroke here and there if you can’t figure out how to set a new default homepage or something?

Harder? Hardly.
More Time-Consuming? Negligibly, and likely only temporarily.
Buggier? Sure, for about 2 days before most of the bugs got ironed out.

No, the oldies will rush to adopt change when it is actually change for the better. Just fiddly-dicking around with stuff so it looks different and works different? NAAAAHHHH.

Do you consider a website that actually operates and provides modern security as “better" than a website with a user experience and functionality that will inevitably degrade over time, unable to be maintained and with imminent eventual obsolescence?

fiddly-dicking

I love me some good ole’ fashioned fiddly-dicking. But I feel that if folks spent less time fiddly-complaining about things they don’t fully understand and more time fiddly-dicking with the site and figuring out how to make their experience about 95% the same as it was previously, they’d find that the site is basically the same.

 

[ProbablyTooLoud]

I love it.
Much improved.

 

[CoughSyrup]

With any luck TB might morph into Tiktok Bass /sarc
Have all the new 'influencers' doing challengers, like playing your bass whilst train surfing. Yeh, that's the ticket

 

[squarepeg]

 

[pepj]

Its a chat site with varying levels of useful content for people with the same sort of interest.
No one forcing people to post and if its not your thing, you likely wont.

 

[bholder]

You're right, but it sucks. I still prefer long form content on a large screen, but the world wants everything dumbed down

"Make something idiot proof, and Nature merely builds a better idiot."

Sigh.

 

[turf3]

A few observations:

I’m less certain, since you seem to be under the impression that the UI change that’s been so challenging was the result of a nefarious and totally optional initiative to change for the sake of change… oh, and to push out the olds. It’s been stated several times that the update and platform switch was NECESSARY in order to continue the operation of the site.


The site looks, conservatively, 85% the same to my eyes and functions as similar before making any adjustments to display/filter options. A few things were relocated, but you can set the site to look, conservatively, about 90% or more like the old format. Take a few breaths, almost everything functions substantially similarly to how it used to function.


Again, change was necessary. I mean what are we talking about here? Three more seconds and an extra keystroke here and there if you can’t figure out how to set a new default homepage or something?

Harder? Hardly.
More Time-Consuming? Negligibly, and likely only temporarily.
Buggier? Sure, for about 2 days before most of the bugs got ironed out.


Do you consider a website that actually operates and provides modern security as “better" than a website with a user experience and functionality that will inevitably degrade over time, unable to be maintained and with imminent eventual obsolescence?


I love me some good ole’ fashioned fiddly-dicking. But I feel that if folks spent less time fiddly-complaining about things they don’t fully understand and more time fiddly-dicking with the site and figuring out how to make their experience about 95% the same as it was previously, they’d find that the site is basically the same.

Well, you're intentionally misunderstanding what I wrote.

A software update to eliminate security concerns is totally justified. No one, surely, disputes that.

But most of the changes in user interface we're seeing have NOTHING to do with security. Let's be clear. The moderators and administrators of this site did NOT program the software. At most, the site owners chose from amongst a few options presented by the company that writes and sells the software.

What I'm referring to as "change for the sake of change", AND YOU KNOW PERFECTLY WELL THIS IS WHAT I'M REFERRING TO, is the user interface garbage, the "gotta look more modern to appeal to younger people, the "achievements" and "levels" - and, heck, even typeface changes - though those are small. Also things like relocating all the buttons, adding keystrokes to get to the lists of forums, etc., etc., etc. Of course, none of this is catastrophic; we'll all adapt; but none of it was necessary to improve site security, either. All that stuff was imposed by the software company, as the price of getting improved security. About all the site owners could do would be to select from among a list of options.

That's what I'm referring to; you know it, though you're intentionally misunderstanding me; the people who're complaining about the new format know it. I have not seen ONE post where someone said "I WANT to go back to the security weaknesses of the previous version!" That's a straw man you've set up to make yourself look lke the one that's "with the program" and make those who complain look like those "old men yelling at clouds" you're all so obsessed with.

 

[bholder]

 

[Derry Murbles]

Well, you're intentionally misunderstanding what I wrote.

A software update to eliminate security concerns is totally justified. No one, surely, disputes that.

But most of the changes in user interface we're seeing have NOTHING to do with security. Let's be clear. The moderators and administrators of this site did NOT program the software. At most, the site owners chose from amongst a few options presented by the company that writes and sells the software.

What I'm referring to as "change for the sake of change", AND YOU KNOW PERFECTLY WELL THIS IS WHAT I'M REFERRING TO, is the user interface garbage, the "gotta look more modern to appeal to younger people, the "achievements" and "levels" - and, heck, even typeface changes - though those are small. Also things like relocating all the buttons, adding keystrokes to get to the lists of forums, etc., etc., etc. Of course, none of this is catastrophic; we'll all adapt; but none of it was necessary to improve site security, either. All that stuff was imposed by the software company, as the price of getting improved security. About all the site owners could do would be to select from among a list of options.

That's what I'm referring to; you know it, though you're intentionally misunderstanding me; the people who're complaining about the new format know it. I have not seen ONE post where someone said "I WANT to go back to the security weaknesses of the previous version!" That's a straw man you've set up to make yourself look lke the one that's "with the program" and make those who complain look like those "old men yelling at clouds" you're all so obsessed with.

If you say so

Best of luck to you.

 

[dune]

Well, you're intentionally misunderstanding what I wrote.

A software update to eliminate security concerns is totally justified. No one, surely, disputes that.

But most of the changes in user interface we're seeing have NOTHING to do with security. Let's be clear. The moderators and administrators of this site did NOT program the software. At most, the site owners chose from amongst a few options presented by the company that writes and sells the software.

What I'm referring to as "change for the sake of change", AND YOU KNOW PERFECTLY WELL THIS IS WHAT I'M REFERRING TO, is the user interface garbage, the "gotta look more modern to appeal to younger people, the "achievements" and "levels" - and, heck, even typeface changes - though those are small. Also things like relocating all the buttons, adding keystrokes to get to the lists of forums, etc., etc., etc. Of course, none of this is catastrophic; we'll all adapt; but none of it was necessary to improve site security, either. All that stuff was imposed by the software company, as the price of getting improved security. About all the site owners could do would be to select from among a list of options.

That's what I'm referring to; you know it, though you're intentionally misunderstanding me; the people who're complaining about the new format know it. I have not seen ONE post where someone said "I WANT to go back to the security weaknesses of the previous version!" That's a straw man you've set up to make yourself look lke the one that's "with the program" and make those who complain look like those "old men yelling at clouds" you're all so obsessed with.

While you may not be one of them, the majority of the complaints I have seen here are absolutely "old men yelling at clouds" and worse. Accusatory, adversarial and vitriolic, including a few implying that this was done only to make more money and one even implying that he was being deliberately messed with in real time. Now, THAT'S yelling at clouds. Of course, this is to be expected given that this is the internet, as many people default to "filters off/gloves off" and have no problem whatsoever ranting and raving about something they know nothing about. This is of course their right, and kudos to the staff here for inviting and encouraging it.

In my experience as a former IT professional, "change for the sake of change" is almost never the reason for anything. No one undertakes something like this changeover if it can be avoided because it's most often a nightmare, even before factoring in the vitriol they're inevitably going to face from the end users. Other minor annoyances, like buttons being in different places, etc. is likely just the new platform defaults and may or may not be changed going forward. It's not always easy or possible to customize a platform 100% and if this is the full-time job of any of the admins here, I'd be surprised, and if any of them are getting rich from it I'd be utterly amazed. Personally, I hope they're getting something out of it as I get a lot of value from Talkbass and I value the effort they put in to provide that.

 

[bholder]

In my experience as a former IT professional, "change for the sake of change" is almost never the reason for anything.

In my 43 years of working for Da Man, I've found this to be mostly true for the company's products and their customer's experience. However, in the case of the corporation's internal tools they inflict on the internal customers (us, the employees), they have no such qualms about disruptive changes and incompatibilities. There's an excessive amount of "reinventing the wheel" with poorer wheels, the "upgrades" being all in current corporate flight magazine fantasy-land UI fads.

 

[pepj]

Yep, its the opposite generally because change generally costs, in hardware, software, licenses etc etc...so what generally happens is the End of Life forces it.

 

[bholder]

Oh and Paul (or whoever did it) thanks for fixing the "partial quote" function I just used (selecting a piece of text and using the "Quote" or "Reply" popups). That wasn't working for me yesterday, but is now, thanks!