Thunderbird Club

[GBassNorth]

Since I brought it up I'll also jump in and say - different strokes for different folks.

Just because I dislike the traditional vocal style of Death Metal and call it Cookie Monster Metal doesn't mean it should be banned or eliminated as a genre. There's tons of talent in those bands, from rapid fire drummers to screaming riff guitarists to overdriven heavy fret bassists and yes even the singer who somehow can sing an entire concert like this without blowing out his vocal chords. It's all more talent than I've got to offer so kudos to them. It's just not the direction I intend to take my musical talents and doesn't really appeal to me from an entertainment standpoint.

I'd agree with @vdub75 and say it would be narrow minded to take a lack of personal tolerance for this music and expand it to the position of it shouldn't exist. The over used cliche "Diversity is our friend" applies here, not only in the diversity of the types of music available but also diversity in the personal likes and dislikes of each listener.

So, if you perform this type of music - that's cool. I probably won't be attending your concerts but I'm sure not gonna take a shut it down stance either. Now, let's all grab our TBirds and join in a rousing round of Polka!

 

[Gaolee]

...Now, let's all grab our TBirds and join in a rousing round of Polka!

Uh, gosh. We gotta draw the line somewhere...

 

[marko57]

At the risk of perpetuating this line of discussion, I'd like to say first that I support everybody's right to hold their opinions. There's a big difference between debating about ideas and denigrating the people who hold them. I love a good academic debate, but I abhor and reject ad hominem attacks. Sometimes my enjoyment of the former begins to appear like the latter, but it's never intentional.

And, for the record, I am not "an ignorant"; rather, I am an "overeducated s#!£head"! (Obligatory daily Zappa reference)

I wish I was smart enough to be an "overeducated s#!thead"!

 

[Haji]

Extreme metal only appeals to me on a very narrow band. That said, there's no denying its hugely popular. There are extreme bands playingn the main stage at Download Festival and the other big ones; there are about a dozen. If you're not familiar, the main stage at those fests draw 60,000+ fans. I'll probably never get to play a show for that side crowd.

That said, if I ran Gibson, you can get your ass there would be a William Murderface Signature Model TBird.

 

[Stevis]

That said, if I ran Gibson, you can get your ass there would be a William Murderface Signature Model TBird.

But then you would be thinking like a bass player (and of bass players). That doesn't seem to be a big part of their business model does it?

 

[RedVee]

I wish I was smart enough to be an "overeducated s#!thead"!

I'm not overeducated

 

[Haji]

But then you would be thinking like a bass player (and of bass players). That doesn't seem to be a big part of their business model does it?

t
There are quite a lot of Metalocalypse fans in the world with disposable income.

Gibson does A LOT of bass ackwards things and gets away with it because of the cachee of their name. At some point it's gonna lose its shine and they'll have to build build quality product for the price, but that hasn't happened yet...even though their finish work has been well below industry standards for a couple decades.

 

[Korladis]

OK, now I think I have a grasp on the subtleties of CMM (cookie monster metal). Now how does this differ from 'd'jent'?

Djent is kind of an offshoot of death metal. Usually involving ultra low tunings and lots of syncopated rhythms. Vocal style varies.

Guys! Keep the good tone... This is getting alarmingly close to sounding like the discussions in the "general population" here on TB...

Well, call someone's music "not music," and that tends to happen.

t
There are quite a lot of Metalocalypse fans in the world with disposable income.

Gibson does A LOT of bass ackwards things and gets away with it because of the cachee of their name. At some point it's gonna lose its shine and they'll have to build build quality product for the price, but that hasn't happened yet...even though their finish work has been well below industry standards for a couple decades.

Indeed.

I mean, I guess I understand that devoting resources to basses takes away from resources to make $5000 Les Pauls for blues lawyers, but I don't think they're a particularly well run company. I think it's unwise of them to essentially surrender the bass market.

 

[Haji]

Especially when the only big competitor to the Thunderbird is their sister company. If they did ANY marketing the TBird alone would easily outsell every mandolin they make.

 

[Gaolee]

They make $5000 Les Pauls for aging lawyers, but they also make much less expensive guitars (and with the EB and now EB-T bass guitars). The are more diversified than Rickenbacker, but they just don't make any sense to me. Making a signature Thunderbird for a metal bass player makes perfect sense to me. Perhaps Henry J. is an aging blues lawyer and forgets that there are other people out there. It wouldn't surprise me a bit.

 

[Korladis]

Especially when the only big competitor to the Thunderbird is their sister company. If they did ANY marketing the TBird alone would easily outsell every mandolin they make.

Indeed. And honestly, allowing things to get to the point where Epiphone's t-birds were almost as good as (or in my opinion, better than) theirs was stupid.

They make $5000 Les Pauls for aging lawyers, but they also make much less expensive guitars (and with the EB and now EB-T bass guitars). The are more diversified than Rickenbacker, but they just don't make any sense to me. Making a signature Thunderbird for a metal bass player makes perfect sense to me. Perhaps Henry J. is an aging blues lawyer and forgets that there are other people out there. It wouldn't surprise me a bit.

He probably is. If he's even a musician.

And yeah, their business model is very different from Rickenbacker's. The latter only makes a few things, but the bass side of their production does seem to matter quite a bit to them. There are a couple things I'd change about that company, but not nearly as many as with Gibson.

 

[Count Bassie]

I dunno. When I think of Thunderbird I think of Overend Watts, or Glenn Cornick, or the guy from Nazareth, and that Nikki Sixx character (a little jab there for you Crüe fans!). Those are all hard/glam rockers from the old school (even Crüe). But I'm not that hip to the metal thing, so take it for what it's worth from a real-deal geezer. Tell you what, I've never seen Robbie Shakespeare or Family Man wielding a Bird. But I do!

Now, about that polka thing...

I once harped in jest at a drummer that a trite, hackneyed drum fill he'd just played had no place in music. It was a beautiful, very funny and disruptive moment. Yes... yes... thank you.

 

[Haji]

Good friend of mine left Gibson recently. he said the middle management is really bad and only concerned with getting boxes out the door. Take a look at the company reviews at The Glass Door website and that statement is corroborated by several other people. I get the impression there aren't many players at Gibson Brands anymore. Same thing happened at Gerber when Fiskars bought them; there aren't any knife guys there anymore.

 

[marko57]

Good friend of mine left Gibson recently. he said the middle management is really bad and only concerned with getting boxes out the door. Take a look at the company reviews at The Glass Door website and that statement is corroborated by several other people. I get the impression there aren't many players at Gibson Brands anymore. Same thing happened at Gerber when Fiskars bought them; there aren't any knife guys there anymore.

I wonder if the guys at Heritage (former Gibson factory before the move to TN) would build Firebirds and Thunderbirds? They seem to still have honor for the old products they used to build under the Gibson name. Looked at their current models and no sign of FBirds and TBirds (or Explorers, FV's, etc.) Mainly the old standards. Would be nice if they could revive FB and TB.

Heritage Guitar

 

[Nocturnal]

Good friend of mine left Gibson recently. he said the middle management is really bad and only concerned with getting boxes out the door. Take a look at the company reviews at The Glass Door website and that statement is corroborated by several other people. I get the impression there aren't many players at Gibson Brands anymore. Same thing happened at Gerber when Fiskars bought them; there aren't any knife guys there anymore.

I believe Fender has a less than stellar employee opinion rating on Glassdoor as well. They are local and I've spoken to people that have worked there. Most did not recommend them as an employer, but you can find that with any company.

 

[Count Bassie]

I believe Fender has a less than stellar employee opinion rating on Glassdoor as well. They are local and I've spoken to people that have worked there. Most did not recommend them as an employer, but you can find that with any company.

Unfortunately it's quite common now.

 

[Korladis]

I dunno. When I think of Thunderbird I think of Overend Watts, or Glenn Cornick, or the guy from Nazareth, and that Nikki Sixx character (a little jab there for you Crüe fans!). Those are all hard/glam rockers from the old school (even Crüe). But I'm not that hip to the metal thing, so take it for what it's worth from a real-deal geezer. Tell you what, I've never seen Robbie Shakespeare or Family Man wielding a Bird. But I do!

Now, about that polka thing...

I once harped in jest at a drummer that a trite, hackneyed drum fill he'd just played had no place in music. It was a beautiful, very funny and disruptive moment. Yes... yes... thank you.

I tend to think of Entwistle mostly. And Aaron from Yob. And the dude from Noothgrush. Was never a fan of any glam rock.

Good friend of mine left Gibson recently. he said the middle management is really bad and only concerned with getting boxes out the door. Take a look at the company reviews at The Glass Door website and that statement is corroborated by several other people. I get the impression there aren't many players at Gibson Brands anymore. Same thing happened at Gerber when Fiskars bought them; there aren't any knife guys there anymore.

Sad.

Gerber always makes me think of baby food.

I wonder if the guys at Heritage (former Gibson factory before the move to TN) would build Firebirds and Thunderbirds? They seem to still have honor for the old products they used to build under the Gibson name. Looked at their current models and no sign of FBirds and TBirds (or Explorers, FV's, etc.) Mainly the old standards. Would be nice if they could revive FB and TB.

Heritage Guitar

I wish they'd make basses.

 

[Haji]

I worked at Taylor Guitars for six months, which was probably three months longer than they should have kept me. If I could have done that job well I'd still be working there. I did find that I SUCK at production work from my time there.

 

[Count Bassie]

Not a glammer myself, but I like Mott the Hoople- hence the reference to Mr Watts there.

Meanwhile I'm now officially looking for a drummer and a guitar player for some good ol stomp-in-the-guts rock N roll. Soon as I get that slab poured and some walls in our basement I want to set up a small band and do it to it. Got a singer, I think. If not, I'll just do it.

What would Lemmy do... he'd do that.

 

[GBassNorth]

Good friend of mine left Gibson recently. he said the middle management is really bad and only concerned with getting boxes out the door. Take a look at the company reviews at The Glass Door website and that statement is corroborated by several other people. I get the impression there aren't many players at Gibson Brands anymore. Same thing happened at Gerber when Fiskars bought them; there aren't any knife guys there anymore.

No denying Gibson has morale problems and a lot of it clearly stems from the senior management starting with the CEO. That said, I've talked to guys that have left Fender recently and they make the same claim. Seems every multi national company has bean counters that constantly remind senior management that instruments made in xyz country have a better profit margin than those made in the USA. In the past the Quality Control guys could counter argue that the xyz products are inferior and not up to USA standards. That argument continues to diminish as xyz countries get better at making instruments. This all leads to USA employees constantly looking over their shoulders while their bosses remind them their jobs could be moved over seas. Not a great working environment to be in. Interestingly enough, some of those same xyz countries are just now starting to see their labor and manufacturing costs rise so they will eventually be in a similar boat as the U.S. Builders.

In the meantime we all continue to harp on overly expensive gear and demand sub $1000 basses with tons of options and perfect quality control. Good news is, Eppiphone delivers this in spades and IMHO even better than Squier does (which says a lot, Squier is pretty darn good in my book). I think Fender MIA and Gibson are pretty close in pricing with Gibson ahead in features and Fender ahead in QC and obviously market share. Of course I'm holding out for a stellar market launch from Gibson on their bass line up. If that doesn't happen in the next year then it's going to be hard to deny they've abandoned their Bass brethren.