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Thunderbird Club

#19,241
Just idle thoughts, no immediate prospects.

What is the finish differences between the Epi Classic Pro and the Epi Pro IV (active) ?

Could the Classic be 'treated' to get the striped neck thru look of the Pro 'easily' ? Or, would it be more efficient to find an unloaded Pro body and add the parts to make it a Classic ?
Or a bad job all round to think of either approach, just leave them alone ?
 
#19,242
That's a clear finish over the wood, and is characteristic of the neck through construction of that bass. The short answer is no, not easily. you'd need to refinish, which to do right would mean sanding all the finish off the body. That's a big job and would cost enough that you'd be better off finding what you want already finished.

Drop tuning the TBird is no big deal; it's in the string selection to avoid the rubber band feel. I use Dunlop Heavy Core and have been very happy with them. I did need to widen the nut to accomodate the larger top two strings.
 
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#19,245
Mike A said:
Interesting read, although I don't understand everything it contains... it certainly doesn't sound like things are going well at Gibson:
Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...

Junk bonds are so called because they are below "investment grade". Investment grade only means that certain regulated funds (such as insurance pools) are allowed by law to buy them. A bond rated below those legally allowed to be held by those pools is then considered "junk". But junk bonds are not necessarily bad. Default risk is actually still very low - single digit percentages (the complement, the repayment rate, is over 90%). So, the vast majority of "junk" bonds are repaid in full.

Should you worry about the coming repayment obligations? No, bonds, lines of credit, asset back securities are routinely refinanced. Which is to say, the borrower borrows new money to repay the old. Think of it like your mortgage. It is amortized for a longer period than your actual term (say a 3 year mortgage with a 25 year amortization); the underlying assumption is that, at the end of the term, the mortgage will be refinanced.

Is Gibson facing business difficulties? Maybe (hard to know with a private company).
Is Gibson going away? Not likely, even if the bonds fall into default (unpaid), the company can likely reorganize either with or without bankruptcy protection to sell off non-core assets to satisfy those obligations.
 
#19,250
Dadagoboi said:
Junkier than junk and getting worse. Bonds being resold for half of what the original buyers paid.
Click to expand...

Actually, according to the webpage referenced, it is not nearly that bad. According to what was posted there, the last trade was $76. Bonds are always quoted on a $100 face value, so trading at 76% of face. Most bonds are sold at a discount to face (typically $95-$98 for face of $100), so they have not lost anywhere close to half of their value.
 
#19,252
PillO said:
Taking a quite look at recent default data, default rates across corporate bonds recently peaked at 2%. So 98% of corporate bonds are redeemed at full face value.
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In a range of 21 possible long-term bond ratings by Moody's, Gibson is now at the 4th lowest, the lowest being bankruptcy, the second lowest indicating imminent bankruptcy. They are at "extremely speculative" now, the next downgrade will see them at "default imminent with little prospect for recovery".

I think they might be getting close to that 2%...but I'd be happy to take your order if I was selling junk bonds.
 
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#19,253
RedVee said:
Just idle thoughts, no immediate prospects.

What is the finish differences between the Epi Classic Pro and the Epi Pro IV (active) ?

Could the Classic be 'treated' to get the striped neck thru look of the Pro 'easily' ? Or, would it be more efficient to find an unloaded Pro body and add the parts to make it a Classic ?
Or a bad job all round to think of either approach, just leave them alone ?
Click to expand...
The laminations on the pro and classic are very different, the classic has a 9 ply lamination very like the Gibson whereas the pro has the 7 chunky ply neck. So one could never be made to look like the other so I think for your purposes if I read them right it would be better to strip a pro and add the passive classic pups and pots
 
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#19,254
Dadagoboi said:
In a range of 21 possible long-term bond ratings by Moody's, Gibson is now at the 4th lowest, the lowest being bankruptcy, the second lowest indicating imminent bankruptcy. They are at "extremely speculative" now, the next downgrade will see them at "default imminent with little prospect for recovery".

I think they might be getting close to that 2%...but I'd be happy to take your order if I was selling junk bonds.
Click to expand...

I am no longer in the investment business. And those that invest in junk bonds do so with a portfolio approach for risk management. There is money in junk bonds because the price premium for increases in risk is far in excess of the added risk.

I will point out that in my first post on the topic, I said:
PillO said:
<excess deleted>
Is Gibson facing business difficulties? Maybe (hard to know with a private company).
Is Gibson going away? Not likely, even if the bonds fall into default (unpaid), the company can likely reorganize either with or without bankruptcy protection to sell off non-core assets to satisfy those obligations.
Click to expand...

Is Gibson having difficulty? Don't know. Can they satisfy their financial obligation? Probably. But perhaps not without pain (a reorganization under bankruptcy protection).

I haven't even looked enough to know if there are cross default covenants. Bond(s) in default does not automatically result in bankruptcy. And bankruptcy does not automatically result in liquidation.
 
#19,256
RedVee said:
Just idle thoughts, no immediate prospects.

What is the finish differences between the Epi Classic Pro and the Epi Pro IV (active)?
Click to expand...

Saw one of the natural finish PRO IVs in ABH Pitt St @ the weekend (a little Aria 80s for my taste). Doesn't have the gloss finish like my trans-black. If you want to turn one into a classic you'll need to fill some potholes. The controls are very close together on the stock config, which is why the V-V ended up mounted diagonally on mine. Also need a little work enlarging the pup cavities for the Chinabuckers (ie Gibsons).
 
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#19,257
Christine said:
The laminations on the pro and classic are very different, the classic has a 9 ply lamination very like the Gibson whereas the pro has the 7 chunky ply neck. So one could never be made to look like the other so I think for your purposes if I read them right it would be better to strip a pro and add the passive classic pups and pots
Click to expand...

Hi ColinLP, yeah I think it's a shame that the neck thru stripes are hidden as much as they are on the Classic. I know you can see them if you look.
Compare the Sunburst (not even the natural) of Pro to Classic, I just like the look better. Just aesthetics :) .

Anyway, just idle thoughts. But it doesn't hurt to keep an eye out :) ..
 
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#19,258
Haji said:
That's a clear finish over the wood, and is characteristic of the neck through construction of that bass. The short answer is no, not easily. you'd need to refinish, which to do right would mean sanding all the finish off the body. That's a big job and would cost enough that you'd be better off finding what you want already finished.
.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was thinking that I could refinish just the neck & neck thru portions on the sunburst.

kat888 said:
Saw one of the natural finish PRO IVs in ABH Pitt St @ the weekend (a little Aria 80s for my taste). Doesn't have the gloss finish like my trans-black. If you want to turn one into a classic you'll need to fill some potholes. The controls are very close together on the stock config, which is why the V-V ended up mounted diagonally on mine. Also need a little work enlarging the pup cavities for the Chinabuckers (ie Gibsons).
Click to expand...

Yup. Prob too much to do for my skill set. Unless I found an empty (unloaded?) body for cheap cheap cheap to start from. Hmmm.

Looking unlikely.
 

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