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Tribulations finding others to play with

#41
landrybass said:
What’s some advice for playing with people who have a really hard time playing IN time? I can’t seem to find anybody who doesn’t rush or drag. Do you adjust to the tempo drifts or do you inform them they are out of time? I’ve tried the second, it doesn’t seem to work, so I’m usually stuck with the first.
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I've played with lots of different kinds of drummers, including some that were REALLY bad. This is what I've gotten from those experiences.

First, I always do my best to suggest in the nicest way possible that they consider practicing with a metronome. I make sure that they KNOW they're all over the place.

Unfortunately as in your experience, I don't think that's ever worked - but I put it out there.

Second, I learned to be a lot more accepting that I used to be. There are some great drummers who have tempo issues. I played with a guy for a while who was awesome, even played in one of the most happening local funk bands in NYC for a while. He constantly sped up and slowed down. I don't really let it get to me, as I feel it can almost be an OCD thing. There was a guy here about a year ago who posted some clips about how "off" his drummer was, and with all due respect to that guy - it was something many here didn't even notice. The drummer wasn't "dead on" but it was nothing that was going to bother anyone other the bass player who was complaining about it. It certainly wasn't a deal breaker, IMO.

And when the drummer or other member just plain sucks, as in they're all over the place and make the whole band look bad... fixing them is not going to happen. It comes down to what the gig is worth to me. I've only hung onto gigs like that if they were paying, but what I've gained from it most are these 2 things.

Those people REALLY help us with our listening and groove skills. Its a challenge to make the music sound good when playing with a sloppy, crappy drummer, and its our job (if we're getting paid) to do our best to make that happen. With one particular guy I had to find a middle ground and make second by second decisions on where I was going to sit in the groove. I really think playing with him helped my playing immensely. It gave me a lot of practice in working as a team. The goal was to make the songs sound the best they possibly could.

The other thing it honed my chops with is what I think I mentioned in my earlier post. It helped learn to smile and act professional in all situations. And I learned that the hard way, with a band I did some short tours with. The girl had money and was able to pay me well to travel with her, but she AND the rest of her band were really REALLY bad. And I was a jerk. At the gigs I taped notes to the floor that were in plain site of the audience (making clear that I was new to the situation), and when off stage I talked openly with people about the other projects I was involved in. Told them I was only doing that gig for pay. She caught me, reamed me (very professionally) in a super serious way - fired me, and I learned my lesson. I was a lot younger, and stupid... but yeah, what I got from that experience was I learned to smile, keep my mouth shut, and make it seem like I'm playing in the greatest band in the world. Even what I know its one of the worst. Not an easy thing to do.
 
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#42
comatosedragon said:
I too am early 40's (41 in a month). So finding people my own age to play with is a problem. And most of the people my age assume I have been doing this my whole life and just automatically I think I am on the same level as them. People my age don't want to work with someone who is still learning. Every single person/group I have talked to have always given me some excuse why they won't play with me, before meeting me. And (most) younger people have vastly different goals/ideas than me. Geography plays a much larger part in finding bandmates than most people are willing to admit. I'm just pointing out a fact here, but the people who always post "just get out and play with someone! anyone!" are more than likely living in California USA, New York USA, or some other large metropolitan center.
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You’re not wrong. It’s not like I have a long list of people looking and I’m ticking them off going “nope... nope... nope...”. I feel like, partly due to geography that there’s not many opportunities here. There’s the occasional cover band looking, but the problem there is there’s already a few very well known cover bands here who have been playing together 10+ years, and because everyone here seemingly knows everyone else, they have the advantage of “X pub owner went to school with Joe the guitarist”, so I’ll just hire my mate. It’s that sort of mentality.
 
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#43
Tazziedevil said:
You’re not wrong. It’s not like I have a long list of people looking and I’m ticking them off going “nope... nope... nope...”. I feel like, partly due to geography that there’s not many opportunities here. There’s the occasional cover band looking, but the problem there is there’s already a few very well known cover bands here who have been playing together 10+ years, and because everyone here seemingly knows everyone else, they have the advantage of “X pub owner went to school with Joe the guitarist”, so I’ll just hire my mate. It’s that sort of mentality.
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I pulled up a map online but really couldn't get a sense of it. How big/many people live there? Then factor for people your age, etc. Just hard for me from a big metro area to understand.
 
#44
3Liter said:
I pulled up a map online but really couldn't get a sense of it. How big/many people live there? Then factor for people your age, etc. Just hard for me from a big metro area to understand.
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Well, the Hobart area (capital and largest city, where I live) the metro area has about 175,00 people. It’s an island, there’s no ferries per se and it’s an hour and a bit plane ride to get to big cities on the mainland.

Demographically speaking, there’s a lot of young kids and elderly and very few 25-45. It’s aging the fastest of any Australian city. There’s a a University (University Of Tasmania) and afternoon graduation a HUGE percentage move away after graduation, and many come back to retire because its so small and sleepy.
 
#45
Tazziedevil said:
Well, the Hobart area (capital and largest city, where I live) the metro area has about 175,00 people. It’s an island, there’s no ferries per se and it’s an hour and a bit plane ride to get to big cities on the mainland.

Demographically speaking, there’s a lot of young kids and elderly and very few 25-45. It’s aging the fastest of any Australian city. There’s a a University (University Of Tasmania) and afternoon graduation a HUGE percentage move away after graduation, and many come back to retire because its so small and sleepy.
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That's bigger (or more people) than I got a sense for from Google maps. Of course I was supposed to be working. ;)
 
#47
jamro217 said:
I... you may be able to form a virtual band online.
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I do this and it's great fun. I actually have an ongoing project with a guy in London (I am in Chicago - you can hear our thing, scumble, linked below) and will be doing our 4th or 5th or sompin' bandcamp release imminently (like, this week). Over the years I've had projects with guys in England, Canada and around the USA - curiously, there were 3 or 4 guys from Texas, a couple from Cali, one from Portland WA and one from Ohio, and many of those projects resurrect from time to time (most on the page linked below).

Lest you think it's not good, a Canadian guy and a Cali and a Texas guy are professional musicians ... altho' all became same after retiring. A couple are multi-instrumentalists, one guy is a professional steel guitarist, one guy fronts a pro duo on guitar and vocs but gives me drum tracks he also does, etc.

It ain't got the thrills and chill of in-person collab and live performance, but it ain't bad and is in many ways more, eh, convenient. :D
 
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#49
Go here:
Vlayman
search the page for " scumble ".

We work in *.wav, but use *.mp3 tracks for reference, typically emailing tracks under 10 megs, using dropbox or wetransfer to move bigger files. The key thing is to have an alignment point on exchanged tracks, something like a stick-hit or similar to be sure it's all lined up, and be aware of the file format (we otherwise use use 16 bit 44.1 *.wav). I'm the primary writer, so I generally kick a ruff mix 320kps *.mp3 bass/drums/vocals track at my guy, he does multiple overdubs and sends each one individually as a *.wav to me, as I do the final mixes. We then exchange reference *.mp3's until we agree it's done, and move on to the next one. (I hope this post is OK ...)
 
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#50
vvvmmm said:
I do this and it's great fun. I actually have an ongoing project with a guy in London (I am in Chicago - you can hear our thing, scumble, linked below) and will be doing our 4th or 5th or sompin' bandcamp release imminently (like, this week). Over the years I've had projects with guys in England, Canada and around the USA - curiously, there were 3 or 4 guys from Texas, a couple from Cali, one from Portland WA and one from Ohio, and many of those projects resurrect from time to time (most on the page linked below).

Lest you think it's not good, a Canadian guy and a Cali and a Texas guy are professional musicians ... altho' all became same after retiring. A couple are multi-instrumentalists, one guy is a professional steel guitarist, one guy fronts a pro duo on guitar and vocs but gives me drum tracks he also does, etc.

It ain't got the thrills and chill of in-person collab and live performance, but it ain't bad and is in many ways more, eh, convenient. :D
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That actually sounds like an AWESOME idea! How do you find a group like that?
 
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#52
Well even as a singer here -in the best of situations you were playing for about 50 people for a paltry sum.
In the worse you were playing for about 10 for even a less paltry sum.
Motivation is quickly lost. Better to spend your time elsewhere I say until and if that motivation returns.
Good luck!
 
#54
pappabass said:
Any open mics in the area? Good place to meet other musicians. Sounds like you are very talented. But, (don't take this wrong) don't come across as being talented. Knowing a lot of music is a little intimidating. Also, be willing to vary what you play
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can you explain what you mean by ‘don’t come across as being talented?’
I’m not trying to come across as the second coming of Jamerson but just let people know I’m not a complete hack
 
#56
pappabass said:
Any open mics in the area? Good place to meet other musicians. Sounds like you are very talented. But, (don't take this wrong) don't come across as being talented. Knowing a lot of music is a little intimidating. Also, be willing to vary what you play
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:) That was sort of what I was saying earlier.

I play with one keyboard player at the blues jams. He's a pro of some sort. But he cannot let a jam go by without dropping some knowledge in a condescending way. I said the song was in C with a quick IV. It has a riff that goes over and over one the I. The bass follows it and the bass player did fine. He has to let me know it's a really more "Cminor". But it never comes off as helpful, just "I know more than you..."
 
#57
comatosedragon said:
Sounds a little bit like me. I started taking bass seriously in 2014 (after having owned basses since 1997). So I have been playing by myself for the past 5 years, trying to get better. I use Rocksmith a lot (whatever your personal thoughts on the software, it is a good tool for learning muscle memory if nothing else). I too have posted on CL and Bandmix, with no results.

I too am early 40's (41 in a month). So finding people my own age to play with is a problem. And most of the people my age assume I have been doing this my whole life and just automatically I think I am on the same level as them. People my age don't want to work with someone who is still learning. Every single person/group I have talked to have always given me some excuse why they won't play with me, before meeting me. And (most) younger people have vastly different goals/ideas than me. Geography plays a much larger part in finding bandmates than most people are willing to admit. I'm just pointing out a fact here, but the people who always post "just get out and play with someone! anyone!" are more than likely living in California USA, New York USA, or some other large metropolitan center.
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I've lived I pretty small, non metro areas... and I could always find an open mic, or a community orchestra, or some old folks playing nursing homes, or something.

I might not love the music, the other players might be beginners, etc. - but I can always find SOMEONE to play with.
 

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