Unlined or Lined: Irrelevant?

[Dr. Cheese]

I was playing that Tony Franklin again. My teacher really discouraged unlined fretless, but I am confident that I could be competent on an unlined fretless if I bought one. Once I thought about some more, I really thought why am I worried about lined or unlined fingerboards? Fretless depends on a good ear and muscle memory whether a bass has lines or not. I just need to practice on the basses I own already. I do not want to fall into the trap I was in when I was young of worrying about a 24 fret bass instead of buckling down and learning the fretboard and theory. That Tony Franklin is sweet, but someone else can have it.

 

[Bass]

A double bass doesn't have lines.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

A double bass doesn't have lines.

Google Image Result for https://stringclubimages.blob.core.windows.net/images2/2017/10/Four-Tapes-Straight-198x300.jpg

 

[Dr. Cheese]

A double bass doesn't have lines.

True 98% if the time, but really, why should that matter to me? Getting better at playing what I own is what matters. Who ever cared if Jaco had lines on his bass but Alphonso Johnson or Percy Jones did not?

 

[Dr. Cheese]

The TF is out of the picture which means Geddy is coming home soon and very soon!

 

[JTE]

I have both. I prefer the unlined because I can't really see the fretlines while playing, but I can see the side dots. And on my lined fretless (Lakland 44-94) the side dots are in the same place as on a fretted bass- between the stops. My unlined has the side dots AT the stops.

It could also be that I've played my unlined (Fender Jazz Bass Special) one since '88 and have only had the lined o e since about 2008.

 

[Samatza]

I like unlined for two reasons;

1. you can't really rely on those lines to help your pitch, you need to develop your ears.
2. They are usually made of contrasting wood and can cause buzzing when the board shrinks in dry climates.

So after only a short while you get used to the unlined and you kind of use positions and 'muscle memory' to get you to the right spot and your ears to fine tune.

 

[Inara]

I've played both lined and unlined extensively. I enjoy both. I do find it easier to play chords high on the neck on a lined fingerboard, and I do prefer the aesthetics of an unlined board, but otherwise I just don't care. Right now I own two lined basses, and I'm building an unlined one.

And I like your attitude of playing what you have, Doc. There's nothing whatsoever wrong with a lined fingerboard. Especially when it's a Pedulla.

 

[WillyW]

I think it’s completely irrelevant, but I prefer unlined.

I do use the properly placed side dots.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

I've played both lined and unlined extensively. I enjoy both. I do find it easier to play chords high on the neck on a lined fingerboard, and I do prefer the aesthetics of an unlined board, but otherwise I just don't care. Right now I own two lined basses, and I'm building an unlined one.

And I like your attitude of playing what you have, Doc. There's nothing whatsoever wrong with a lined fingerboard. Especially when it's a Pedulla.

I think you get where I am coming from. I love the look of unlined fretless, especially a dark ebony fingerboard, but I want to focus on improving much more than gear. Lord knows I could run off and buy whatever and still have the same issues if I don’t put in the work.

 

[bassbenj]

I like unlined for two reasons;

1. you can't really rely on those lines to help your pitch, you need to develop your ears.
2. They are usually made of contrasting wood and can cause buzzing when the board shrinks in dry climates.

So after only a short while you get used to the unlined and you kind of use positions and 'muscle memory' to get you to the right spot and your ears to fine tune.

I have both lined and unlined and I agree with this. However...

1. I bought my first fretless lined because I thought the lines would be a help learning. "Training wheels" they call it. And yes it is true. But it's not as big a help as you think because you really only see the edge of the neck easily and so your lines must be clear and well defined at the edges. Side dots in the fretted positions will drive you nuts in no time. But I also discovered that the help the fretlines gives you quickly disappears with experience and practice. so they quickly become irrelevant.

2. But I really like the look of plane fretless necks. And even though the help of fretlines quickly goes, the look of fretlines remains forever! This is why I wish my first bass was not purchased with fretlines.

3. There are two main helps you get from fretlines. One is that since there is an indicator on every fret position you don't have to learn to judge between the dots on the side of the neck. And the other is that you'll have a tendency when playing across the neck (especially relevant on 5 and 6 string basses) to play at an angle which makes you out of tune as you play from string to string. The lines are great for training to not play at an angle.

But mostly this is small change. My main Axe G&L L2500 fretless is lined. Was bought used so not my choice. I'd prefer unlined, but it's no biggie to me. Audience in general (if they care at all) tend to see the lines and think it's a fretted bass, but most think it's a guitar anyway.

[Avatar is my 6 string SX fretless Jazz clone with the Ebony board I installed..Totally killer bass. Great sound. Great looks. no lines]

 

[Dr. Cheese]

I have both lined and unlined and I agree with this. However...

1. I bought my first fretless lined because I thought the lines would be a help learning. "Training wheels" they call it. And yes it is true. But it's not as big a help as you think because you really only see the edge of the neck easily and so your lines must be clear and well defined at the edges. Side dots in the fretted positions will drive you nuts in no time. But I also discovered that the help the fretlines gives you quickly disappears with experience and practice. so they quickly become irrelevant.

2. But I really like the look of plane fretless necks. And even though the help of fretlines quickly goes, the look of fretlines remains forever! This is why I wish my first bass was not purchased with fretlines.

3. There are two main helps you get from fretlines. One is that since there is an indicator on every fret position you don't have to learn to judge between the dots on the side of the neck. And the other is that you'll have a tendency when playing across the neck (especially relevant on 5 and 6 string basses) to play at an angle which makes you out of tune as you play from string to string. The lines are great for training to not play at an angle.

But mostly this is small change. My main Axe G&L L2500 fretless is lined. Was bought used so not my choice. I'd prefer unlined, but it's no biggie to me. Audience in general (if they care at all) tend to see the lines and think it's a fretted bass, but most think it's a guitar anyway.

[Avatar is my 6 string SX fretless Jazz clone with the Ebony board I installed..Totally killer bass. Great sound. Great looks. no lines]

I have been having issues with holding my hand at angle lately and it is making me sharp.

 

[thabassmon]

Either way is fine, notes are in the same place as they have always been.

i don't even look at the dots, mine are in the wrong place anyway.

 

[WillyW]

I catch myself doing this too, I use a slippery strap (Ace re-issue) and reposition the bass often to keep my fretting/fretless hand in the correct position.

 

[JimmyM]

I love how many fretless snobs hate the idea of lines, yet most of them love a bassist who used a lined fretless.

Irrelevant. Play what you want, be happy.

 

[juancaminos]

I bought a lined fretless many tears ago and played it exclusively for a long time But ended up going back to my fretted Jazz because the over all sound fit the music I was playing better. Then I put together another lined fretless and started getting back into it. Next I made the jump to an unlined fretless, I have the unlined neck setting for a year because I just thought that I could never play it well. It turns out that I like the unlined neck much, much better!

I will say that maintaining good neck and hand positioning is a lot more critical but there is nothing wrong with that. Also I agree that the lines can fool you depending on where you are on the neck and which string your on. Some places require you to be on the line while others maybe slightly behind or before the line. A slight roll of the finger and you are no linger on the line anyway. Press a little harder and now your finger spreads sharp blah blah blah

 

[Joebone]

Gonna argue that side dot placement is more important than whether or not there are lines...on fretless, I can't stand dots that mimic fretted bass placement.

 

[jerry]

I think you made the right decision Cheese, you already have a killer fretless.

 

[IamGroot]

I started on a unlined Hohner, and have used several lined since then.

Lines are largely irrelevant, but they dont hurt anything. Some audience members noticed when i played the unlined, but i am not into that.

Setup and correct technique are everything. If you are not willing to put in the hours to get credible intonation and maintain that skill, steer clear of fretless. If you play with bad hand form, tbe intonation probably wont be there. Nothing sounds worse than a hack fretless player to my ears.

Jimmy Haslip got away from the fretless for a while and really had to woodshed to get back.

 

[Inara]

I've never understood the whole dot position thing. On an unlined fretless I play on the dot. On lined I play on the lines. If I can't see the edge of the lines on a lined bass well enough on stage, I paint the edge of the lines with a tiny bit of fluorescent paint. But I've only felt the need to do that on one lined bass I've owned.

But as often as I see this complaint, I know it's a genuine problem for some, and I'm not saying that it's not, or contradicting anyone's experience. But not everyone shares that experience. Two of the best fretless players in the world, Gary Willis and Bunny Brunel, swear by lined fingerboards, and we can throw Mark Egan in there as well. Of course, Michael Manring, Pino in the 80s, and Mick Karn, play or played unlined. Amazing players all, who made different choices. I don't think either is truly superior to the other.