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Double Bass Using two pickups

Bob Magnusson

Bob Magnusson

Dec 17, 2007
9
0
#1
Can anyone help ?
I"m not knowledgeable about electronics and relatively new at computers. I have both the "Underwood "and the "Realist" pickups on my bass. I want to use the "Underwood"for pizz. and the "Realist" for arco.
I first tried an A/B switch but found the volume of the realist much lower than the underwood plus a popping sound when I switched. A student told me about the "Radial- Tonebone" it has vol. and tone settings for the B pickup and takes the A pickup unaltered. I'm using an "Acoustic Image"amp and I have a loss of vol. and bottom end thru the "Tonebone." Any ideas? I'd appreciate any help you can give me.

Thanks, Bob Magnusson
 
#2
Bob Magnusson said:
Can anyone help ?
I"m not knowledgeable about electronics and relatively new at computers. I have both the "Underwood "and the "Realist" pickups on my bass. I want to use the "Underwood"for pizz. and the "Realist" for arco.
I first tried an A/B switch but found the volume of the realist much lower than the underwood plus a popping sound when I switched. A student told me about the "Radial- Tonebone" it has vol. and tone settings for the B pickup and takes the A pickup unaltered. I'm using an "Acoustic Image"amp and I have a loss of vol. and bottom end thru the "Tonebone." Any ideas? I'd appreciate any help you can give me.

Thanks, Bob Magnusson
Click to expand...

The Tonebone Bassbone (which I assume you are using) is not intended for use as a preamp. It is a unity gain device (when set flat, with volume controls at maximum input volume = output volume)

The input impedance of the Bassbone is lower than most piezo pickups needs to see; when I use my Bassbone with my URB I am using a preamp between it and my pickup. See my article addressing the piezo impedance issue at http://www.gollihurmusic.com/faq/11-PREAMPS_DO_YOU_NEED_A_PREAMP_WITH_YOUR_URB_PICKUP.html and addressed many times on this board.

You will likely be able to achieve the results you seek by employing a suitable preamp (one with an input impedance of 1 megohm or higher) for each pickup prior to plugging them into the Bassbone.

FYI, for those not requiring two pickups, but still would like separate pizz and arco settings, the Bassbone can be a great tool. If only one device (pickup w/preamp) is plugged in you can toggle it between Channel 1 and 2, using their different settings to set the character of arco and pizz separately.
 
#3
Bob, I've been a fan of yours for a long time!

As far as blending those two pickups, you might be interested in this link to the K + K blender preamps. Not to expensive, good quality, and will do the job. Here's the link, just click on it.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
 
#4
Thanks Bob,

Yes, I am trying to use the "Tonebone-Bassbone" sorry I didn't make that clearer. Thanks for your knowledgeable help. I'm new to all of this(website / tech talk, just joined today) ... I'll go to your web address and read your recommendations. Your FYI is also something I didn't know. I'll try just the "Underwood" with no highs for the arco setting.

Thanks again for your reply, Bob Magnusson
 
#6
Good advice from Bob. He is the guru, IMHO. :smug:

You might also want to keep an eye out for a (now discontinued, sadly) Raven Labs MDB-1. This little box lets you take three inputs (10 MegOhm) and blend them together, with individual volume controls for each.

Summit Audio and Fishman also have products which will accomplish your goal, I believe, but I do not have firsthand experience with them.

Best of luck, Tom.
 
#7
I agree that the Underwood doesn't sound all that good for arco and the Realist is great at it. Also the Realist can get pretty muddy pizz depending on the environment which is where the Underwood's strength in cutting through lies.

The Fishman Full Circle straddles the line between the Underwood and the Realist. It's got the deepness of the Realist and the punch of the Underwood. I can't remember if you have adjusters on your bass or not but if you do I'd audition that pickup as a single source arco/pizz solution that doesn't require a bunch of other stuff to sound good. It's not for everyone but it may work for you.

Of the two pickups you have I'd say the Realist could be EQ'ed to have a better pizz tone than the Underwood to have a good arco tone.

Every bass is different and every player is different so there is no one size fits all thing. One thing I know for sure is the more junk I bring to the gig the less I'm playing bass and the more I'm putzing with stuff.

Keep it simple.
 
#8
Hey Bob... I can't remember exactly how I did it, but at one point, I used a cheapo Radio Shack y-connector to to combine the signals from my Underwood and my Realist... no blender, no nuthin', straight into my old Contra. (long time ago). Not pretty, but it worked pretty well for pizz and arco at the time. About as low tech as you can get, I suppose. Of course I now use a variety of expensive methods of debatable merit.. ;)

Great to see you posting here.... welcome.
 
#9
Hi Bob - another longtime fan here. Welcome to TB. If you had a two channel AI amp, you'd be able to blend the two together, but I doubt you would be able to switch back and forth. I do know that there are A/B switches that do not "pop" when you go between them, but it may take a little research to find out which ones they are. Sounds like you'll want one of those plus a preamp on the Realist side of things to even the volume levels out. If there's a two channel switchable amp out there for DB, I haven't heard about it yet.
 
#10
Chris Fitzgerald said:
Hi Bob - another longtime fan here. Welcome to TB. If you had a two channel AI amp, you'd be able to blend the two together, but I doubt you would be able to switch back and forth. I do know that there are A/B switches that do not "pop" when you go between them, but it may take a little research to find out which ones they are. Sounds like you'll want one of those plus a preamp on the Realist side of things to even the volume levels out. If there's a two channel switchable amp out there for DB, I haven't heard about it yet.
Click to expand...

:D

Forgive the direct link, but it's still not on EA's web site yet.[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

FYI, I got the final factory prototype last week and kicked it around for a couple days, and subjected it to my GFI Electrical Outlet From Hell that can disturb some amps (and some earlier Micro 300s), and it was dead quiet. Based on past experience I'll say only one thing about availability of the revised Micro 300: soon, they say.
 
#11
Hi Bob,
I must add that I am a fan too. Last time I checked, a friend of mine has a "Whirlwind Selector AB Box" that works well. You can switch between the 2 pickups (that is what he does, one for pizz one for arco) or you can run both pickups together. You can't alter the levels of the two inputs, its just an AB box. It is very quiet, there is no "pop" when you AB and there seems to be no loss of signal. I think it is less than $100.
David
 
#12
Bob Magnusson said:
I first tried an A/B switch but found the volume of the realist much lower than the underwood plus a popping sound when I switched...Any ideas? I'd appreciate any help you can give me.

Thanks, Bob Magnusson
Click to expand...

Bob -- I use an A/B switch made by Morley, that doesn't pop at all when switched, and to my ear there's no discernible loss of volume. It allows you to switch between A or B, and it also lets you use A and B together (so if there was ever a need you'd be able to use both pickups). It cost either $49 or $69, I can't quite remember.
 
#13
Sounds like you're wanting to use one pickup OR the other, not a blending of both simultaneously. If so I'm thinking the boss LS2 line selector would be just what you need. Most boss stuff has an input impedance that actually works well piezo pickups. This one has a 1 Meg input. Can serve as an A/B, but an A/B w/ individual volume controls.

$79 from Musician's Enemy

Invalid Link Removed
 
#14
Johnny Atomic said:
Sounds like you're wanting to use one pickup OR the other, not a blending of both simultaneously. If so I'm thinking the boss LS2 line selector would be just what you need. Most boss stuff has an input impedance that actually works well piezo pickups. This one has a 1 Meg input. Can serve as an A/B, but an A/B w/ individual volume controls.

$79 from Musician's Enemy

Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...

I hadn't seen one of those before. That looks pretty slick. :cool:
 
#17
Hello Bob from Apex, NC. Welcome.

The Radial PZ-Pre is a fairly new product I think, and I don’t know how much info there is yet in this forum regarding it. But it would seem to handle all of the key features listed above (like A/B switching and A/B blending), and then add some more like phase reversal, a notch filter, and a high pass (lo-cut) filter. It looks like each of the two input channels can be independently switched to a high impedance setting. That might eliminate the need for a separate outboard preamp.
 
#19
Johnny Atomic said:
Sounds like you're wanting to use one pickup OR the other, not a blending of both simultaneously. If so I'm thinking the boss LS2 line selector would be just what you need. Most boss stuff has an input impedance that actually works well piezo pickups. This one has a 1 Meg input. Can serve as an A/B, but an A/B w/ individual volume controls.

$79 from Musician's Enemy

Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...
Johnny Atomic,
Thanks for your input !! I went today and bought the Boss LS2 Line Selector. I tried it out with my bass and amp and it's exactly what I was looking for. The Underwood sounds normal (no drop off of low end) and with the vol. control on the pedal I can match the Realist arco output to the pizz. level. It's also about a 1/4 of the size of the Tonebone Bassbone. I'm going to sell the Radial Tonebone Bassbone.

You solved my problem ! Thanks, Bob Magnusson
 

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