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Venting - LS can't handle playing in a bar that serves shots.

Just read a similar situation on another thread. I not going to repeat it here because most of it has been stated already. I had a recent bad experience recently, also involving lead singer. Almost destroyed the band. If I were in the band I’d make it clear that this was his one screw up. Next time, he’s out. Not the least bit concerned about hurt feelings, he completely disrespected the band, so he doesn’t get to feel sorry for himself.
 
If you guys rehearse between gigs, you handle it there. If not, you handle it however you do group communication (text, email, whatever).

I would be calm, but firm. Let's say "business like". This isn't a nice situation he put you in. So it doesn't call for a nice tone to the conversation.

There wouldn't be a second time if I were in that band. He would he made so fully aware of how much I won't tolerate that behavior that he would be turning down shots even when he's hanging out with friends and I'm not there.

What an idiot.
 
Not sure how to word it so that LS doesn't get his back up. Will word it so that it's in keeping with my signature here, but also want to make sure the message gets through...

I'm calling BS to that. If I were the BL, I'd call a face to face band meeting, call him out on it, and tell him if it ever happens again his pay is forfeit and take all his equipment with him after the gig, because he's out. I'd also mention something about his family, because it sounds as if they were pretty wild and caused him to drink so heavily, and that's usually not OK with owners.

The thing that's never registers with musicians is the professionalism aspect of it - regardless of venue size, someone is paying for a service. How about if a plumber being paid to replumb the place got rip-roaring during the job and screwed up everything? That's what the singer did. It's a wonder you got paid. I wonder if you'll get a call-back.

And, I'd keep an eye open for another singer as a backup.
 
If you guys rehearse between gigs, you handle it there. If not, you handle it however you do group communication (text, email, whatever).

I would be calm, but firm. Let's say "business like". This isn't a nice situation he put you in. So it doesn't call for a nice tone to the conversation.

There wouldn't be a second time if I were in that band. He would he made so fully aware of how much I won't tolerate that behavior that he would be turning down shots even when he's hanging out with friends and I'm not there.

What an idiot.
I agree, but I DO believe in second chances. As a practical matter, it's more work to replace a guy than to let him correct errant behavior on his own. So giving him a second chance is actually in the best interests of the band, rather than the singer.
 
Guy screws up once, probably because his family's there goading him on so you automatically assume he's going to be like that at every venue that serves hard liquor? One-time happenstance and you rule out any place that sells hard liquor as a potential venue? Myopic.

For all you know his family could show up at another gig and nobody has shots, or if they do he reins it in and lets his family go their own inebriated way.



The world would be a wwwwaayyyyyy F'd up place if everyone held to the ZERO TOLERANCE stance so many are keen to espouse.
I'd definitely get it across to the guy it was a bit much, joke with him that "next time you're fired" or find some way of getting the sentiment across, and getting his side of the story.

Case-by-case, try it, you might find it works... most of the time.
 
There are some people for whom music is the only party they get to have, and when presented with the opportunity to party hard, they will. I deal with someone like this but generally he will only cross a line at rehearsals, and then only sometimes. I think if this happened at a show it would happen only once and there would be a discussion. I am not big on telling people how they should behave. What I tend to do is say what I'm willing to tolerate and that if that line is crossed I will walk. Then it's really up to that person to decide if they want to continue down that road, but it won't be my problem anymore.
 
So, one of the bands I'm in is made of up older guys, two of which are in the health care industry (so are all about taking care of their bodies) and the other three of us are retired. I'm the youngest, at 56. Needless to say, we've all experienced enough of life that I thought we all would be mature enough to know that when we are gigging, we are working, and keeping your alcohol consumption at a manageable level is required. We have played at other venues where this has never been a noticeable issue.

Apparently I was mistaken.

We had a gig last Saturday at a small bar, which can comfortably seat about 80 people. I had previously booked a gig with my other band that went well, so I booked a gig for this band, expecting things to be even better, since the musicianship in this one is of a higher calibre.

LS has a table of family members at the gig. First set went off well. A little bit of weirdness where the LS called some audibles to the set list, but, if his voice can't handle a song that night, then that's cool, nothing we haven't done several times in the past. But, the way he was acting seemed a bit strange...

Second set is getting a bit loose. Unbeknownst to me at the time, LS's family table is starting into the shots. In hindsight, he has probably partaken before the start of the second set. He's rambling into the mic, getting in my face when I'm trying to focus on my playing, missing his queues, etc... I am getting a bit frustrated, but oh well, things are still basically OK. After the second set, the bar owner gave us the max bonus for the night, since we essentially sold out the place. Everybody's happy.

Second break sees the shots come fast and furious. One of LS's family members is INSISTING on EVERYONE at their table having shots.

LS obliges.

Third set is a bit of a trainwreck. LS is stumbling around on stage, slurring his words, making incoherent statements into the mic, totally f'ing up his lines and missing his queues all over the place. He now thinks that he's the star of the show and everyone in the room is there solely to see him, and we are just supporting his wanking. To top it off, his drunk wife yells out that she wants to hear the song that he didn't want to sing in the first set, so of course now he wants to do it. We shut that down quick, thankfully. All of this has the LG and I (just one guitar and me on bass, plus drummer and keys) trying to compensate, sometimes more successfully than others. I thought I had my frustration in check, but I was gobsmacked by his behaviour. What are we, 19 year olds? I spend the rest of the set just trying to hang on, stay focused and get through it. We hit midnight, our time commitment for playing, and I was off the stage as soon I could. Managed to hold my tongue that night, since telling a drunk guy that he's drunk rarely ends well.

So far, this situation is a one off. Up until now we have just played venues where only beer / wine were served. Seems that LS needs to stay away from venues that serve hard liquor. It may be the charitable thing to give him another chance, but I really didn't like having to compensate for his unprofessionalism. In my books, if you can't tow your own weight, then I'm not going to carry you... Will be making a general statement at some point about the fact that we need to treat gigs like work, and not cross the line with alcohol consumption.

Not sure how to word it so that LS doesn't get his back up. Will word it so that it's in keeping with my signature here, but also want to make sure the message gets through...

How would you all handle it? Or, how have you handled similar situations in the past?

grr... senior citizens acting like teenagers... WTAF?!?




First issue......your LS is an ALCOHOLIC!

There will be some at TB that disagree, but when the only way your LS can complete a gig is to remove alcohol from the venue, another way of saying that is your LS is not responsible for HIS actions.

His family might be welcome to the club owner because of their bar tab, but you need to cut this guy loose, now.

Someone who fesses up to his problem, you might be able to work with, but this guy's family are his enablers and if you were to talk to him, he would surely talk to them, who would talk him out of it, why?

If he has a drinking problem, that would mean they likely have a drinking problem, and they won't admit that.....safety in numbers.

FIRE HIM! Don't waste your time pushing the rock uphill.
 
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So, one of the bands I'm in is made of up older guys, two of which are in the health care industry (so are all about taking care of their bodies) and the other three of us are retired. I'm the youngest, at 56. Needless to say, we've all experienced enough of life that I thought we all would be mature enough to know that when we are gigging, we are working, and keeping your alcohol consumption at a manageable level is required. We have played at other venues where this has never been a noticeable issue.

Apparently I was mistaken.

We had a gig last Saturday at a small bar, which can comfortably seat about 80 people. I had previously booked a gig with my other band that went well, so I booked a gig for this band, expecting things to be even better, since the musicianship in this one is of a higher calibre.

LS has a table of family members at the gig. First set went off well. A little bit of weirdness where the LS called some audibles to the set list, but, if his voice can't handle a song that night, then that's cool, nothing we haven't done several times in the past. But, the way he was acting seemed a bit strange...

Second set is getting a bit loose. Unbeknownst to me at the time, LS's family table is starting into the shots. In hindsight, he has probably partaken before the start of the second set. He's rambling into the mic, getting in my face when I'm trying to focus on my playing, missing his queues, etc... I am getting a bit frustrated, but oh well, things are still basically OK. After the second set, the bar owner gave us the max bonus for the night, since we essentially sold out the place. Everybody's happy.

Second break sees the shots come fast and furious. One of LS's family members is INSISTING on EVERYONE at their table having shots.

LS obliges.

Third set is a bit of a trainwreck. LS is stumbling around on stage, slurring his words, making incoherent statements into the mic, totally f'ing up his lines and missing his queues all over the place. He now thinks that he's the star of the show and everyone in the room is there solely to see him, and we are just supporting his wanking. To top it off, his drunk wife yells out that she wants to hear the song that he didn't want to sing in the first set, so of course now he wants to do it. We shut that down quick, thankfully. All of this has the LG and I (just one guitar and me on bass, plus drummer and keys) trying to compensate, sometimes more successfully than others. I thought I had my frustration in check, but I was gobsmacked by his behaviour. What are we, 19 year olds? I spend the rest of the set just trying to hang on, stay focused and get through it. We hit midnight, our time commitment for playing, and I was off the stage as soon I could. Managed to hold my tongue that night, since telling a drunk guy that he's drunk rarely ends well.

So far, this situation is a one off. Up until now we have just played venues where only beer / wine were served. Seems that LS needs to stay away from venues that serve hard liquor. It may be the charitable thing to give him another chance, but I really didn't like having to compensate for his unprofessionalism. In my books, if you can't tow your own weight, then I'm not going to carry you... Will be making a general statement at some point about the fact that we need to treat gigs like work, and not cross the line with alcohol consumption.

Not sure how to word it so that LS doesn't get his back up. Will word it so that it's in keeping with my signature here, but also want to make sure the message gets through...

How would you all handle it? Or, how have you handled similar situations in the past?

grr... senior citizens acting like teenagers... WTAF?!?

First off, congrats at retirement at 56. Secondly, I think in this situation, I think I’d like for the LS, now sober, to explain his actions at the gig. If there is remorse, and apology with repentance, hopefully it’s a one off. But I would let him know in no uncertain terms that this will not be tolerated if it happens again.
 
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grr... senior citizens acting like teenagers... WTAF?!?

I have been playing in bars since 1985 and one thing has never changed: the worst drunks are the guys in their fifties and early to mid-sixties. Worst as in "drink until they pass out, start fights, aggressively and physically hit on girls too young to be their daughters." Then as a finale they usually get in a cop's face and explain why they can't be arrested. That happens a lot less often than I'd like, because it always ends the same way and gets me laughing to the point of tears.
 
I agree, but I DO believe in second chances. As a practical matter, it's more work to replace a guy than to let him correct errant behavior on his own. So giving him a second chance is actually in the best interests of the band, rather than the singer.

I’m inclined to agree with that. You need to be firm on this, but don’t be an a-hole. It’s a first and only offense right now. If he does it again, switch him to drums and then fire him.
 
If it happened just the one time that's just a party that broke out on the spur of the moment since his family was there to cheer him on and buy shots. if it happens at every gig then you have two options as I see it: either get rid of the LS or find a new band. I'd hate to think the guy is an alcoholic but if that is the case then you're in for a hard road with the guy and no amount of trying to fix it will fix it.