Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Venting: Potential big gig ends up being a freebie
- Thread starter FirewalZ
- Start date
This is true but it doesn't tell the whole story. This is a simple matter of supply and demand. In the old days (pick your decade) there were simply far fewer bands, per capita, in any given locale.
FF to now, with the instrument companies selling far more gear than they EVER have, plus all the existing instruments still in circulation, literally everyone and his hamster is in a band.
To say these issues are simply the fault of bands undercutting the "pros" is not fully accurate. Simple supply and demand.
jdthebassman
play to live live to play
So true. When I see accomplished talented musicians relegated to playing for tips it is heartbreaking.
Just keep in mind that many in the upper echelons of the bigger charities are taking down six-digit salaries.
By all means support charities. (I do.) But keep your eyes open, and be a little selective about which charities you get hooked up with.
Tell them you'll play the gig and then on the day of the event, don't show up. If they ask why, tell them you were offered a paid gig at the last minute and chose to do that instead. What are they going to do? Not pay you? Maybe that will teach them that they get what they pay (or don't pay) for.
Edited - After reading more into this thread I see that I wasn't the first one to suggest this.
Edited - After reading more into this thread I see that I wasn't the first one to suggest this.
Last edited:
There was this brilliant guy who put a great idea into practice...I’m thinking it was Kid Rock...he insisted on cheap concert tickets for his fans (to attract a bigger crowd)...and made the venue guarantee him a cut/percentage of all concessions. My understanding it was a big risk that really paid off for him and the band. So might the racetrack give you a cut of the concessions for the crowd you attract?
This whole post couldn't be further from the truth. There is less and less equipment being sold in general. Electric guitar sales have been dropping significantly and are down 33% from about 10 years ago. People spend more time inside and on the internet and less time going outside and engaging socially face-to-face.
You have zero citations other than your own assumption about what you think is going on out there. Facts tell another story. It's not supply and demand, it's that venues just don't care about having about having live music, IMO.
Link Removed
Okay maybe sales of new instruments are falling, in the last 10 years. I am thinking a much longer time frame.
Add them all up, and today there are more instruments in circulation than, say 20, 30 years ago. Because, except for the really cheap ones, they are a hard asset and they last.
But quibble all you want with my errant "instruments in circulation" theory, my point was and still is: there are way more "bands" available for hire, per capita, now than ever before. And, the demand for live music is down.
The true numbers of new instruments, which you may be right on, doesn't change the fact that the problem is one of simple supply and demand.
Yes, people are there to see races. You might notice that NASCAR hires big name country and Southern rock bands to play at all their races. And I'll bet all those folks get paid...
A good friend made his living for 2 years playing with a band called Driving Sideways, opening for national acts at NASCAR races around the country.
Last edited:
You might be better off if you setup outside the venue and play for tips. You get the exposure and with the tip money you can rent your own camping space.
Glad to hear he did. Smart move on his band’s part finding a market niche for themselves. That’s clever use of positioning to get yourself gigs. Kinda like a band I heard about that specialized in medical conventions and trade shows. Called themselves The Orderlies, or something like that. Word was they were doing extremely well for themselves.
However, opening for national acts at major sporting events is a different gig than what the OP is talking about. He was talking about playing three hours post races at the track’s campground if I understood him correctly. That’s a whole different thing. The only commonality I can see between your friend’s gig and the OP’s is that there’s racing going on. And your friend’s band is getting paid.
yup. it's primarily supply and demand. Far too many bands chasing fewer and fewer venues willing to pay for live music.
It makes me wonder if The Bodysnatchers and Madness started out at medical conventions...
buldog5151bass
Kibble, milkbones, and P Basses. And redheads.
Question for OP. Is this the first year they have had live music? If so, may just be a trial balloon to see what they get. Rather than all the usual snarky comments like we usually get, my advice to anyone in a situation like this is to calmly tell them that even a decent band, with a decent PA, will cost a decent amount of money. Tell them your minimum fee, and that you would be happy to do it for that price.
If it's NOT the first year, they've done this, they already know what they can get.
If it's NOT the first year, they've done this, they already know what they can get.
I also think one of the things that contributes to the glut are the number of people and “bands” that are willing to take the stage when they are completely unqualified to do so.
Possibly it’s the new participatory mindset which consider it bad form to call something inadequate or just plain bad no matter how inadequate or just plain bad it may actually be. Or maybe it’s just a general lowering of standards leading to lower expectations on the part of listeners. (And a reduced willingness to pay for it because of that.) But whatever the reasons, I’m continually amazed by the number of people willing to get up on stage or post a video (performace, demo, review, etc.) that’s completely cringeworthy.
Apparently there’s a growing number of people who have absolutely no issues with sharing their inadequacies in public. It sometimes seems like there’s very little sense of pride (or shame) in being clueless or half-assed about what you do for some people.
I don't know if it the first year for them trying this or not, but the only compensation they were offering was free services/tickets. I of course explained that we are professionals, have a large "concert" sized PA, etc, so we could not accept those terms. I left on a good note, they understood and agreed to keep our contact.
buldog5151bass
Kibble, milkbones, and P Basses. And redheads.
About all you can do. If they do this more often (check their website), a little down the road, hit them up with an email with links to your website or other ways to see you in action).
Actually not that much different, I don't think. There is no glory in opening for national acts if you don't get paid. My point was that the excuse that racing is the reason for people being there, so there is no need to pay the band, is not valid. Whether it's NASCAR or the local dirt track, the musicians do the same amount of work. I've known plent of musicianss who played in opening acts at major concerts (Farm Aid and others) and didn't get paid. That doesn't pay the electric bill either way.
