Very elementary question re: scales

[BakerStreetMuse]

Hi, TB

Just picked up the bass in January/February of this year, so please excuse the (probably) dumb question. I generally do a search first but I am at a loss how to even look for the answer to this so I'm reaching out for help.

Recently completed 8 weeks of lessons to get me started on the right path. Since I'm already beginning to feel overwhelmed, I decided to take a break from the lessons so I can better absorb what I've been taught before I get even more over my head.

Anyway, on to what I need clarification about, 'cause I'm really confused.

I recently learned major and minor scales.

My teacher taught me the following pattern for the major scales:

G|--|--------|---E---|---F---|-------|---G---|
D|--|--------|---B---|---C---|-------|---D--|
A|--|---F----|-------|---G---|--------|---A---|
E|--|---C----|-------|---D---|--------|---E---|

However, when I looked online to help reinforce what I learned, the major scale pattern is as follows:

G|--|---D----|-------|---E---|---F---|
D|--|---A----|-------|---B---|---C---|
A|--|---E----|---F---|-------|---G---|
E|--|---------|---C---|-------|---D---|

This is a different pattern/shape, with the third closer to the headstock than the root.

Now, I totally understand that both of these are the C Major scale and I am in no way implying that my teacher was wrong. I'm sure there are loads of different patterns. I'm just wondering if there is there any pro or con to using one or the other, especially since I couldn't really find anything about the 1-3-5, 1-3-5, 2-3-5, 2-3-5 pattern I was taught.

Thanks in advance to anyone willing to help me in putting some pieces of the puzzle together. Hopefully what I'm asking is written clearly and the terminology is close enough.

 

[bholder]

Hi, TB

Just picked up the bass in January/February of this year, so please excuse the (probably) dumb question. I generally do a search first but I am at a loss how to even look for the answer to this so I'm reaching out for help.

Recently completed 8 weeks of lessons to get me started on the right path. Since I'm already beginning to feel overwhelmed, I decided to take a break from the lessons so I can better absorb what I've been taught before I get even more over my head.

Anyway, on to what I need clarification about, 'cause I'm really confused.

I recently learned major and minor scales.

My teacher taught me the following pattern for the major scales:

G|--|--------|---E---|---F---|-------|---G---|
D|--|--------|---B---|---C---|-------|---D--|
A|--|---F----|-------|---G---|--------|---A---|
E|--|---C----|-------|---D---|--------|---E---|

However, when I looked online to help reinforce what I learned, the major scale pattern is as follows:

G|--|---D----|-------|---E---|---F---|
D|--|---A----|-------|---B---|---C---|
A|--|---E----|---F---|-------|---G---|
E|--|---------|---C---|-------|---D---|

This is a different pattern/shape, with the third closer to the headstock than the root.

Now, I totally understand that both of these are the C Major scale and I am in no way implying that my teacher was wrong. I'm sure there are loads of different patterns. I'm just wondering if there is there any pro or con to using one or the other, especially since I couldn't really find anything about the 1-3-5, 1-3-5, 2-3-5, 2-3-5 pattern I was taught.

Thanks in advance to anyone willing to help me in putting some pieces of the puzzle together. Hopefully what I'm asking is written clearly and the terminology is close enough.

Lots of fingering choices, no wrong or right, use what's most comfortable or leads to the next part.

 

[BakerStreetMuse]

Lots of fingering choices, no wrong or right, use what's most comfortable or leads to the next part.

I'm glad to know it's as simple as that. I do think that the second one might serve me a bit better since my hands are on the small side. I'll try to keep both in mind, it can't hurt, I suppose.

Thanks!

 

[two fingers]

I'm glad to know it's as simple as that. I do think that the second one might serve me a bit better since my hands are on the small side. I'll try to keep both in mind, it can't hurt, I suppose.

Thanks!

Yeah the ultimate goal is to play the proper notes in a way that sounds pleasing and works for YOU. So, use the teacher's advice as a guide, but not the law. Lots of famous bass players play "wrong".

 

[Pilgrim]

I must not understand the question. The notes are not shown in their proper positions.

What the OP posted (2nd time) is:
G|--|---D----|-------|---E---|---F---|
D|--|---A----|-------|---B---|---C---|
A|--|---E----|---F---|-------|---G---|
E|--|---------|---C---|-------|---D---|

But the note positions are as follows:

There is (for example) no C-note on the 3rd fret of the E string.

I don't understand.

 

[BakerStreetMuse]

Yeah the ultimate goal is to play the proper notes in a way that sounds pleasing and works for YOU. So, use the teacher's advice as a guide, but not the law

This is really good to know and it helps a lot, thank you. It's slowly starting to make some sense, due in no small part to the great posts in this section of the forum.

Lots of famous bass players play "wrong"

Yeah, I think of that every time I see videos of Chris Squire fretting with his thumb on the E string.

I'm trying to learn things the standard way to start off with, then adapt that later on when I have the experience to realize what works best for me.

 

[BakerStreetMuse]

I must not understand the question. The notes are not shown in their proper positions.

What the OP posted (2nd time) is:
G|--|---D----|-------|---E---|---F---|
D|--|---A----|-------|---B---|---C---|
A|--|---E----|---F---|-------|---G---|
E|--|---------|---C---|-------|---D---|

But the note positions are as follows:

There is (for example) no C-note on the 3rd fret of the E string.

I don't understand.

The badly-illustrated thing I posted is the C on the 8th fret. Sorry for the confusion, the first part |--| wasn't meant to be the first fret, just an "ellipsis" of sorts. It's meant to be the 7th through 10th fret block.

 

[Pilgrim]

The badly-illustrated thing I posted is the C on the 8th fret. Sorry for the confusion, the first part |--| wasn't meant to be the first fret, just an "ellipsis" of sorts. It's meant to be the 7th through 10th fret block.

Cool.
As you were.........

Edit: I figured there was something basic I was missing....

 

[Sid s]

I think you should practice both patterns.

Note that your C major scale is pretty far up the neck. You'll have to stretch or move your left hand more if you start a major scale lower on the E string.

Also, a few scales can only be executed with one of the patterns, e.g. an F major scale starting at the first fret on the E string.

 

[BakerStreetMuse]

I think you should practice both patterns.

Yes, I will definitely do this!

Note that your C major scale is pretty far up the neck. You'll have to stretch or move your left hand more if you start a major scale lower on the E string.

OK, this makes sense and is very helpful, thank you for pointing it out!

Also, a few scales can only be executed with one of the patterns, e.g. an F major scale starting at the first fret on the E string.

Got it, I see this too!

So, a C major scale could be played straight across on the A string, but it's not practical to do this because of all the movement, am I getting this right? And all of the natural notes (in black on the helpful image posted by Pilgrim) are all part of the C major scale, but the scale patterns essentially group them together for efficiency's sake?

 

[bholder]

So, a C major scale could be played straight across on the A string, but it's not practical to do this because of all the movement, am I getting this right? And all of the natural notes (in black on the helpful image posted by Pilgrim) are all part of the C major scale, but the scale patterns essentially group them together for efficiency's sake?

Yup, you've got it. You can even use the pattern Pilgrim posted and come up with your own variants. It's often interesting to play the same thing in different positions, leads to different sorts of adds and fill-ins, depending on "what's convenient nearby".

 

[BakerStreetMuse]

Yup, you've got it. You can even use the pattern Pilgrim posted and come up with your own variants. It's often interesting to play the same thing in different positions, leads to different sorts of adds and fill-ins, depending on "what's convenient nearby".

Me right now:

This has been so helpful, I can't thank you all enough!

 

[BadSanta1281]

Thanks for posting this thread.
I'm just as new at this as you and it wasn't clear to me either.

My teacher is 70 and has been playing since electric bass was a new thing. He's pretty adamant that there's not just one way to do things. He showed me a video of a student playing Sunshine of Your Love fretting with only one finger. She had pretty long fingernails that she refused to give up. The price of fashion...

 

[BakerStreetMuse]

Thanks for posting this thread.
I'm just as new at this as you and it wasn't clear to me either.

Yes, I remember you from your reply on my first/intro post on TB! I'm glad my question helped you out too. (Well, the answers did all the helping, haha.)

My teacher is 70 and has been playing since electric bass was a new thing. He's pretty adamant that there's not just one way to do things. He showed me a video of a student playing Sunshine of Your Love fretting with only one finger. She had pretty long fingernails that she refused to give up. The price of fashion...

Wow, and I feel like I'm all over the place sometimes when I play a song! I can't imagine fretting with one finger only, I'd be a total mess.

How has it been going for you so far?

 

[Stumbo]

Thanks for posting this thread.
I'm just as new at this as you and it wasn't clear to me either.

My teacher is 70 and has been playing since electric bass was a new thing. He's pretty adamant that there's not just one way to do things. He showed me a video of a student playing Sunshine of Your Love fretting with only one finger. She had pretty long fingernails that she refused to give up. The price of fashion...

Take a look at Rocco Prestia of Tower of Power and how he gets around the neck. Probably not the way you want to do it.

 

[BadSanta1281]

Wow, and I feel like I'm all over the place sometimes when I play a song!

You can play a song already?

How has it been going for you so far?

See above. It's been a humbling experience so far. Old dog, new tricks and all that. My fingers don't always wind up where I'm telling them to go. Wish I would have started much younger but at least I'm living the dream now.

 

[Cousin Iggy]

depending on "what's convenient nearby".

This phrase right here needs to become 'a thing'.

 

[BadSanta1281]

Take a look at Rocco Prestia of Tower of Power and how he gets around the neck. Probably not the way you want to do it.

Tower of Power is one of my all time favorite bands. Rocco is incredible. The Oakland Stroke is not something I'm going to try until I can do my scales properly.

Bump City!

 

[BakerStreetMuse]

You can play a song already?

Cream's "Sunshine of Your Love" and Nirvana's "About a Girl" so far; currently working on The Cranberries' "Zombie." I'm not playing "Heart of the Sunrise" or anything.

See above. It's been a humbling experience so far. Old dog, new tricks and all that. My fingers don't always wind up where I'm telling them to go. Wish I would have started much younger but at least I'm living the dream now.

Yes, totally relate to all of this! Especially the fingers not doing what I want them to!

Better late than never, from one late starter to another.

 

[tjh]

.. the second illustration with the C on the 8th fret is the finger pattern I started with, and use all the time unless a song requires something different for ease of access … in essence you are starting the pattern (root note) with your middle finger, and play one finger per fret without moving the hand (depends on hand size probably, mine are huge) .. and to transition to the minor scale, the pattern uses the pointer finger on the root note … I always teach beginners to start fingering this way, as OP said, it can be overwhelming with OPTIONS … keep it simple to start, and once ingrained in your mind, then it is time to expand on options … it is whole world of 'oh wow!' moments when shown 'alternatives' when they are actually ready for them … for now, pick one and stick to it, you will know when it is time to expand, everybody advances at a different rate …

JMHO … as always …