WARNING: Oscar Prat Basses

[Williethedummy]

I commissioned a 10 string bass and sent a deposit to him ($2.5k) back on 1/17/17. 10 month delivery time, but it’s been 2 years now. I have seen some pictures of the body, top and fretboard (ziricote top, macassar ebony fretboard) but I’m pretty sure at this point there no chance of ever seeing it completed.

I asked for about 10 months ago as I hadn’t heard from him/seen any progress (although he did get right back to me when I sent him an email from a different address pretending to be a new customer) and he sent me some pictures finally and assured me it’d be done by July of 2018. July came and passed, no word from him. No responded to messages. I sent him another message on December 8th, no responce. I’m sad as I love his designs and at the time he seemed like a very reputable dealer, but at this point I feel like he straight up stole from me.

Just so you know....similiar situation with a bass I ordered from Bee Basses. Website, Youtube videos and they been around a while. I checked those Basses out for a couple years. Guy is for real. I put a $1,000 deposit on it with an 8 month build....in February 2017. In fact there is a thread from other Bee Bass hopefuls. It seems these smaller cats are unreliable. Not saying they are crooks because Bee Basses has been to the NAM trade show...but the risk is wasted time. If it will take 5 years instead of 8 months...tell us! LOL! I feel your pain man. Fact is in my case...I really REALLY want that bass! Hahaha? Good luck with yours. I don’t think I’ll ever see mine. Ignores calls and emails and texts!

 

[soulman969]

Tough to figure out why so many want to do business with poorly financed private builders of mostly one of a kind basses. Is it a vanity thing owning one and if so is it worth the risk. These stories abound.

 

[Williethedummy]

Tough to figure out why so many want to do business with poorly financed private builders of mostly one of a kind basses. Is it a vanity thing owning one and if so is it worth the risk. These stories abound.

I came across a couple videos of his on his Basses and one in particular...5 string fretless in 2014. It’s on YouTube. That sound....HAD to have it. About 3 years later I went ahead and contacted him. He never returned calls then either! Very hard to get a hold of. I should have figured this will be a long time then but you know man gotta have it! I have a few recording projects on hold waiting for that ...but now it is 2 years later so likely buy a fretless 6 string elsewhere. Not a vanity thing with Bee Bass........the tone!

 

[Clark W]

Just so you know....similiar situation with a bass I ordered from Bee Basses. Website, Youtube videos and they been around a while. I checked those Basses out for a couple years. Guy is for real. I put a $1,000 deposit on it with an 8 month build....in February 2017. In fact there is a thread from other Bee Bass hopefuls. It seems these smaller cats are unreliable. Not saying they are crooks because Bee Basses has been to the NAM trade show...but the risk is wasted time. If it will take 5 years instead of 8 months...tell us! LOL! I feel your pain man. Fact is in my case...I really REALLY want that bass! Hahaha? Good luck with yours. I don’t think I’ll ever see mine. Ignores calls and emails and texts!

Just googled them, their website is gone and no Facebook posts since Nov 2016. Unfortunately just cause someone goes to NAMM doesn't make them legit. It just means they had enough money to pay vending fees for a spot in the show. See Oscar Pratt.....

I just don't get it.
Darrin Huff, been almost 20 years for some of his customers.
Oscar Pratt
Dr Bass/Marc Serio
and now Bee Basses.

I've seen this very thing happen in another part of my life, skydiving. There was a guy in Australia who was selling skydiving rigs cheaper than anyone else, then one day he just up and disappeared. That was over 10 years ago, with at least 10 orders for custom rigs that cost between 5 and 10 grand.

I check in on the threads about Huff, Pratt, and Serio from time to time, hoping to see orders being resolved, but as everyone knows, it ain't happening. And most likely will never happen.

What I don't understand the most though, is why people let it go so long that legally they can't do anything about it? In the skydiving situation, people didn't let it go, they got together and got with law enforcement and the courts, filed reports, etc... Now the guy has never turned up in over a decade, but if he ever does, he has a lot to answer for, somewhere north of 70 grand that I know about, there may be more. Those people will never see their money or their gear. But at least they might see some justice meted out, maybe, but I doubt that at times too.

All I know is I probably will never order a custom anything, be it skydiving gear, bass cabs, or a bass guitar, from a one man operation, which is sad. There are some people out there that are really good at making unique, quality gear, you just have to find them. But then you have to worry, am I going to get burned? It has to hurt those in business who are legit.

 

[alanolynn]

I've never taken part in the ERB circuit and the extensive build process that ensues, but I just want to extend my condolences to you. This kind of thing can really wear on a person on the inside. I hope you eventually achieve peace after this ugliness. Best of luck.

 

[Rob Martinez]

It's one thing to take deposits then disappear into the darkness.

But Huff has some balls. To actually continue making guitars and taking new orders for guitars is beyond ridiculous.

And these people ARE criminals.

 

[Clark W]

It's one thing to take deposits then disappear into the darkness.

But Huff has some balls. To actually continue making guitars and taking new orders for guitars is beyond ridiculous.

And these people ARE criminals.

Yep, and Huff is "taking orders" on his current "batches" of guitars, with "no money down", until "construction" starts, then a "deposit" is required, on his Zeller Guitars FB page now. From this past November...


Going to be interesting to see how long before those "orders" start piling up, undelivered, after "construction" has started. He's been getting away with it for almost two decades. Why change his modus operandi now?

And even if he delivers on his current orders, the people buying them are unknowingly supporting a thief. But I'd be willing to put up money that says before it's over with, there are going to be some who will wind up never seeing their guitars just like those who are still waiting on basses from over a decade ago.

 

[soulman969]

I came across a couple videos of his on his Basses and one in particular...5 string fretless in 2014. It’s on YouTube. That sound....HAD to have it. About 3 years later I went ahead and contacted him. He never returned calls then either! Very hard to get a hold of. I should have figured this will be a long time then but you know man gotta have it! I have a few recording projects on hold waiting for that ...but now it is 2 years later so likely buy a fretless 6 string elsewhere. Not a vanity thing with Bee Bass........the tone!

I can fully understand that part but if you never get the bass you never get the tone either and even after paying a hefty deposit you end up having to spend even more money for something to take it's place.

These deals sound an awful lot like Ponzi scheme to me. The builder is using your money to complete a previously ordered bass while waiting on yet another hefty deposit to arrive to supply the funds to finish yours.

This would seem to be a more rational explanation for the lengthy build times, missed completion dates and lack of communication than delayed parts, shop moves, illnesses, etc. If that last buyer never comes along I would not want to be that last order received. You'll never get your instrument.

 

[smperry]

Please, let’s keep this thread more on Prat and less on Zeller and others. Thanks

 

[Williethedummy]

Just googled them, their website is gone and no Facebook posts since Nov 2016. Unfortunately just cause someone goes to NAMM doesn't make them legit. It just means they had enough money to pay vending fees for a spot in the show. See Oscar Pratt.....

I just don't get it.
Darrin Huff, been almost 20 years for some of his customers.
Oscar Pratt
Dr Bass/Marc Serio
and now Bee Basses.

I've seen this very thing happen in another part of my life, skydiving. There was a guy in Australia who was selling skydiving rigs cheaper than anyone else, then one day he just up and disappeared. That was over 10 years ago, with at least 10 orders for custom rigs that cost between 5 and 10 grand.

I check in on the threads about Huff, Pratt, and Serio from time to time, hoping to see orders being resolved, but as everyone knows, it ain't happening. And most likely will never happen.

What I don't understand the most though, is why people let it go so long that legally they can't do anything about it? In the skydiving situation, people didn't let it go, they got together and got with law enforcement and the courts, filed reports, etc... Now the guy has never turned up in over a decade, but if he ever does, he has a lot to answer for, somewhere north of 70 grand that I know about, there may be more. Those people will never see their money or their gear. But at least they might see some justice meted out, maybe, but I doubt that at times too.

All I know is I probably will never order a custom anything, be it skydiving gear, bass cabs, or a bass guitar, from a one man operation, which is sad. There are some people out there that are really good at making unique, quality gear, you just have to find them. But then you have to worry, am I going to get burned? It has to hurt those in business who are legit.

I just checked the website and yep....gone like you said. That’s the second or third time I’ve seen that. When I placed the order I told the guy....” Ill pay full price upfront!”. He said....” Oh no no no no. I won’t have any incentive that way. I have a tendency to stop for very long periods.” Haha! I could not believe he told me that! I’m taking this as a loss. I only put down $1,000. Whatever. If he needs that more than I do...it’s all good. I ordered a custom case for this thing too from Rock Hard Cases at his suggestion. I’ve been in communication with them too. They said once in a while this guy falls off the planet. So he is floating around in space I guess. If you go to YouTube and put in Bee Bass...Acces fretless...there is a video ( I just checked now and it’s up) and a couple others but they are like 6 or 7 years old. I watched those many many times and that is what made me order one. There is a very old thread on here about Bee Bass owners club. This is like the Twilight Zone! I’m only in it for $1000. I’m likely going with Carl Thompson, but that’s even a longer wait! LOL! Thanks for the replies by the way friend.

 

[Clark W]

I just checked the website and yep....gone like you said. That’s the second or third time I’ve seen that. When I placed the order I told the guy....” Ill pay full price upfront!”. He said....” Oh no no no no. I won’t have any incentive that way. I have a tendency to stop for very long periods.” Haha! I could not believe he told me that! I’m taking this as a loss. I only put down $1,000. Whatever. If he needs that more than I do...it’s all good. I ordered a custom case for this thing too from Rock Hard Cases at his suggestion. I’ve been in communication with them too. They said once in a while this guy falls off the planet. So he is floating around in space I guess. If you go to YouTube and put in Bee Bass...Acces fretless...there is a video ( I just checked now and it’s up) and a couple others but they are like 6 or 7 years old. I watched those many many times and that is what made me order one. There is a very old thread on here about Bee Bass owners club. This is like the Twilight Zone! I’m only in it for $1000. I’m likely going with Carl Thompson, but that’s even a longer wait! LOL! Thanks for the replies by the way friend.

Only a grand, you're a lot more of a forgiving soul than me.

 

[Nevada Pete]

I almost got stiffed the same way when I purchased a Rife Machine from a guy in Florida. The trap with these guys is, of course, the deposit. My guy finally came through when I told him I was going to fly down there and talk to him about the matter personally.

As far as I'm concerned, if someone can't come up with their product when I'm ready to purchase it, it's no deal. It's not my job to finance a wanna be hopeful or a ponzi scheme, as someone already mentioned.

Some states have what they call handshake agreements that allow you to take legal action against someone like this even though you are not a resident of the state where the vendor burned you. If you are going to send a deposit, at least make sure you have some recourse available. But better yet, just don't do business with anyone who doesn't actually have their products available for sale. Obvious? Yes. But I learned my lesson the hard way too.

 

[Williethedummy]

I almost got stiffed the same way when I purchased a Rife Machine from a guy in Florida. The trap with these guys is, of course, the deposit. My guy finally came through when I told him I was going to fly down there and talk to him about the matter personally.

As far as I'm concerned, if someone can't come up with their product when I'm ready to purchase it, it's no deal. It's not my job to finance a wanna be hopeful or a ponzi scheme, as someone already mentioned.

Some states have what they call handshake agreements that allow you to take legal action against someone like this even though you are not a resident of the state where the vendor burned you. If you are going to send a deposit, at least make sure you have some recourse available. But better yet, just don't do business with anyone who doesn't actually have their products available for sale. Obvious? Yes. But I learned my lesson the hard way too.

I know now! Carl Thompson however....they build after the fact for what you want though they have Basses available but likely what you don’t exactly want. I’m done with these guys. It does indeed appear to be a Ponzi scheme.

 

[FrenchBassQC]

For those looking for a reputable builder, I highly recommend Pete Skjold and Skjold design guitars. I have ordered three basses and other accessories from him and have never been disappointed. Pete is A consummate craftsman, and a highly conscientious businessman. I have never waited longer than a year for completion of my instruments, and every single email and phone call is returned.

Same for Brady Muckelroy, Keith Roscoe, Fodera (I'm listing the ones I have bought from) , .... There are many of them out there I'm sure.

 

[eottjake]

This is all very true, but part of the allure with Prat was that the price was too good to pass up. I was suspicious, but I got in before things started getting hairy. He had a good client base who all sang his praises (at the time), he was consistently going to NAMM, trade magazines were interviewing him...I felt comfortable enough to give it a shot.
Sure, I'd love to be able to buy an MTD, Fodera, Roscoe, or others of my own design, but the money just isn't realistic.
With a lot of these smaller builders wanting to make a name for themselves, the thought of a deal for a custom instrument that actually looks and sounds good (if/when delivered) is very enticing.

 

[nostatic]

the price was too good to pass up.

This is the beginning of pretty much every scam since the dawn of history.

 

[Chace90]

I don't personally think Oscar Prat set out to intentionally steal money from anyone. And I don't think that's his intent now. But it seems pretty clear that he doesn't have a handle on his finances or his work load, whatever the reasons may be. From what I've observed here on this thread, I don't expect that to change any time soon.

 

[MEKer]

This is the beginning of pretty much every scam since the dawn of history.

And even before that.

<snicker..had to say it>

 

[eottjake]

I don't personally think Oscar Prat set out to intentionally steal money from anyone. And I don't think that's his intent now. But it seems pretty clear that he doesn't have a handle on his finances or his work load, whatever the reasons may be. From what I've observed here on this thread, I don't expect that to change any time soon.

Exactly this. It's sad, frustrating, whatever. I hope he gets everything together because they aren't bad instruments.

 

[Chace90]

Exactly this. It's sad, frustrating, whatever. I hope he gets everything together because they aren't bad instruments.

That last point is debatable. I've had 2 Prats. You can read my prior posts about it in this thread. But the gist is that one was fine and the other has a severe neck issue. Pretty? Yes. Usable? No. I sold the one that was useable and definitely haven't looked back.