What happened to funk?

[bluewine]

Yep, that pretty much defines funk IMO too.

"I Got a New Pair of Roller Skates" has been used in several commericals over the years.


You may be serious, I don't know. Clinton's music has been used in lots of product placement... not that that proves anything other than it was popular.

At this point I'm just enjoying the ride.

Don't get me wrong, I am just not big on George Clinton.

I have no idea why sly even hangs out with him.

 

[bluewine]

I don't know what's going on with this thread. The Bar-Kays' "Holy Ghost" not funk? Earth, Wind & Fire not funk,


They did some funky things here & there.



Larry Graham didn't play bass on "Thank You".

No, he didn't.

What's next I wonder. How is Earth, Wind & Fire not a funk band? "Shining Star"? "Jupiter"? "Serpentine Fire"?

I forgot about serpentine, I'll give you that one.

Sly And The Family Stone? While those guys were a very relevant group in the history of funk they were just as much a rock/pop/R&B band as they were a "funk" band.

Agreed

 

[bluewine]

All hail Bluewine.

You know, I wish you guys wouldn't say stuff like this.

 

[Kwesi]

I'm just messin' man. I'll tone it down.

 

[D.M.N.]

Alright, I just read this whole thread. Interesting stuff. Can't say I'm as big an aficionado of Funk as some people on here, but I like Funk and funky music. Lots of the posted material has been cool, I've enjoyed listening to it, and I've enjoyed reading a lot of the posts, been pretty informative. I wasn't there, I didn't grow up with this music, I'll admit that. However, what has been said over the last few pages, especially from Bluewine, is absolutely absurd. Sly & The Family Stone were absolutely funk, maybe proto-Funk, but in what way can you deny Sing a Simple Song or You Can Make it if You Try or Thank You weren't the early beginnings of the genre. The Bar-Kays? How is Too Hot To Stop not funk? E,W,&F? How is Shining Star not funk? What of Brick by Dazz?Seeing as I'm younger, I guess some of my perception of funk is probably "diluted" by Disco and by funky R&B, but some of what has been said here completely contradicts what I know and what I was taught (I just took a course on the history of popular musics from the 30s-80s, all these bands were defined as Funk). What about say Billy Preston's Struttin'? Flashlight or Give up the Funk by P-Funk are totally Funk. Would you consider the Temptations Shakey Ground Funk, or just funky? And if not Funk, would you simply classify it as funky R&B? If that's the case, then where is the distinction made between funky R&B and Funk? This is what I really want to know, partially just for my own knowledge. How do you define Funk, what are it's characteristics that determine if a song is Funk or simply funky R&B?

Can the mummies play, yes.

Are they funk, no.

Are they a corn ball show band, yes.

For the younger TBers, don't confuse what their doing with funk. If anything their mocking funk and black folks.

Stay away from stuff like that.

Blue

Again the question arises, how are you defining Funk? What is it that makes something Funk or just funky. But the real reason I quoted this is because of the bolded part. Excuse me? How are they mocking, not just Funk, but Black people? They don't appear to be any form of minstrel show to me. They seem like musicians playing music and fully enjoying themselves. Are they mocking Funk with the costumes and the show they put on? Because to me, that's a big side of Funk: the showmanship. Ridiculous stage attire, nearly bombastic performances. Mind you, that's not necessary to qualify something as funk, but it was an element that was greatly integrated with the Funk genre. So please, whether you think they're Funk or not, I'd like to know your reasoning behind saying they're mocking Funk and Black people.

 

[Jhengsman]

I don't know what's going on with this thread. The Bar-Kays' "Holy Ghost" not funk? Earth, Wind & Fire not funk, Larry Graham didn't play bass on "Thank You". What's next I wonder. How is Earth, Wind & Fire not a funk band? "Shining Star"? "Jupiter"? "Serpentine Fire"? If the criterion for a band being a funk band is that all they played was funk then I can't name one "funk band". Find me a James Brown album that's nothing but funk. Sly And The Family Stone? While those guys were a very relevant group in the history of funk they were just as much a rock/pop/R&B band as they were a "funk" band.

You see it in all genres of music. The fan will declare something popular as not real funk, metal, bluegras, jazz.....and the list is endless. It happens outside of music too as someone drops more knowledge on the truth as he sees it, accusing the vast majority of being fooled by a false prophet

 

[lbanks]

I knew this thread would deliver!











I just wasn't sure as to what it would deliver.






Interesting.

 

[DWBass]

I knew this thread would deliver!











I just wasn't sure as to what it would deliver.






Interesting.

LMAO! I'm speechless at this point!

 

[bluewine]

Excuse me? How are they mocking, not just Funk, but Black people?

They might not be mocking funk or blacks. Or they are and just don't realize it.

There was nothing real or genuine about their act and it just hit me as a mockery.

 

[Jhengsman]

They might not be mocking funk or blacks. Or they are and just don't realize it.

There was nothing real or genuine about their act and it just hit me as a mockery.

Drugs are a terrible thing to abuse.

 

[KCLRbass]

I find this idea of defining what funk isn't to be really exhausting (not that anybody wanted my opinion, but still). The OP's question gave some people a good opportunity to share some new funk, which they did, and the OP was happy. As an added bonus, in the process, Kwesi has now given my band 2 shout outs (thanks Kwesi)!

Here's my gripe, with where this conversation has gone, though. Since when is it important to figure out exactly which bands from what years are allowed to fit into a genre? All of the great classic funk bands had a powerful direct or indirect influence on hundreds, maybe thousands of bands after them who integrated what they learned into their own music. Some of it still sounded like classic funk and some of it didn't. I'm not saying anything new - everyone knows things change.

BUT, why can't it be called "funk"? I mean, what does it matter? Most of us call medieval, baroque and renaissance music "classical" music, even though it's not from the "classical" period, right? Many people call my band a "funk" band. Sure, we're equally influenced by funk, rock, hip hop, electronic, etc. But "funk" is what people get from it (maybe it's the horns...), and as a result I now call it a "funk" band because that's what resonates with people. And it's a descriptor that fits because we play funky music!

Funk LIVES, folks! I promise!

 

[DWBass]

Funk is funk! I just prefer mine old school style! Dirty, gritty and sweaty! The days of costumes, horn sections and choreography! Where cats really put in work!

See above. I quoted myself. Back then, cats were 'just' funky! It's just what came outta them! No agenda other than to put on a good show!

S/N: I gotta give props to Nate Phillips (funk bass legend) who is still layin' it down today and is playing with some of the best contemporary jazz musicians!

 

[lucas vigor]

I don't know what's going on with this thread. The Bar-Kays' "Holy Ghost" not funk? Earth, Wind & Fire not funk, Larry Graham didn't play bass on "Thank You". What's next I wonder. How is Earth, Wind & Fire not a funk band? "Shining Star"? "Jupiter"? "Serpentine Fire"? If the criterion for a band being a funk band is that all they played was funk then I can't name one "funk band". .

of COURSE they are funk! Not only classified as such in a record bin (when they actually still had record stores) but all the bands I posted clips from were also real "funky" bands.

It's true, the Bar-Kays were a bit derivitave, as Bluewine pointed out...but they are still a funk band, with all the classic funk stylings.

I like what one poster a few pages used to describe funk bands....horn sections, crazy costumes....that is a hallmark of funk, as is science fiction themes.

That's why I said before that I hate to agree with Bluewine...he is right about a lot (Totally agreed, Red Hot Chili Peppers are NOT a funk band) but he also appears to be wrong about a lot. Or too set in his ways.

 

[fenderphil]

I dislike how these threads become regurgitation of other threads.

Was a good thread until certain people got involved, as is the case with most of the other cool things on this site.

 

[bass12]

Alright, I just read this whole thread. Interesting stuff. Can't say I'm as big an aficionado of Funk as some people on here, but I like Funk and funky music. Lots of the posted material has been cool, I've enjoyed listening to it, and I've enjoyed reading a lot of the posts, been pretty informative. I wasn't there, I didn't grow up with this music, I'll admit that. However, what has been said over the last few pages, especially from Bluewine, is absolutely absurd. Sly & The Family Stone were absolutely funk, maybe proto-Funk, but in what way can you deny Sing a Simple Song or You Can Make it if You Try or Thank You weren't the early beginnings of the genre. The Bar-Kays? How is Too Hot To Stop not funk? E,W,&F? How is Shining Star not funk? What of Brick by Dazz?Seeing as I'm younger, I guess some of my perception of funk is probably "diluted" by Disco and by funky R&B, but some of what has been said here completely contradicts what I know and what I was taught (I just took a course on the history of popular musics from the 30s-80s, all these bands were defined as Funk). What about say Billy Preston's Struttin'? Flashlight or Give up the Funk by P-Funk are totally Funk. Would you consider the Temptations Shakey Ground Funk, or just funky? And if not Funk, would you simply classify it as funky R&B? If that's the case, then where is the distinction made between funky R&B and Funk? This is what I really want to know, partially just for my own knowledge. How do you define Funk, what are it's characteristics that determine if a song is Funk or simply funky R&B?

A guy I know wrote his PhD dissertation on funk. One of the things he discussed in that dissertation was the idea that once something is created (speaking specifically in musical terms here) is remains in it's "original" form (I'm not quoting directly) for only a very short instance. People often talk about musical genres as if they exist in some kind of vacuum and have a particular and rigidly defined identity with un-expandable parameters. But this is rarely, if ever, the case. Once music is "out there" it is subject to interpretation and, hence, subject to change. When James Brown brought the idea of funk into the mainstream (or relatively mainstream) consciousness in the mid-to-late 1960s it was of incredible social significance (keeping in mind the civil rights and black power movements of the era). James Brown was one of the biggest (if not the biggest) figures in "black" music during that time and his influence on up-and-coming, as well as already established, bands was huge. So immediately, countless musicians were "interpreting" a certain (funk) approach to music. Three of the bands/artists most often cited as the prime innovators of funk are James Brown, Sly And The Family Stone and Parliament/Funkadelic. But really, could you have three groups of artists that were any more different (within a given genre)? So all of these guys are out there under the "funk" banner influencing musicians not only in the U.S. but all over the world. As far as funk vs funky R&B is concerned, pretty much every R&B/soul act of the 70s worth its salt was incorporating funk. But, as I mentioned in an earlier post, it's not easy to find albums that are "hardcore" funk from beginning to end. Whether you're talking Slave, Tower Of Power, Sly, James Brown, Parliament, Ohio Players, Kool & The Gang - any of the classic acts associated with funk - you're going to get material on the albums that isn't what most people would consider funk. And any of the bands that stuck it out long enough went through stylistic changes - that was just a reflection of the times. That's why I find it strange when people will, for example, suggest that Earth, Wind & Fire weren't funk. Why, because they made some disco records? So did James Brown! So as much as some folks might like to insist that funk is THIS and only THIS it's simply not that cut and dried.

 

[JAUQO III-X]

This is Funk.

 

[bluewine]

That's why I find it strange when people will, for example, suggest that Earth, Wind & Fire weren't funk. .

I agree with all of your lengthy post.

I don't consider ew&f a funk band, however someone pointed out to me they had several funky songs and I agree.

 

[DWBass]

I agree with all of your lengthy post.

I don't consider ew&f a funk band, however someone pointed out to me they had several funky songs and I agree.

I will say that in their current incarnation, they are not a funk band but when they started, they were absolutely a progressive funk band with jazz & world music influences! They can still bring it though!

 

[FilterFunk]

You most likely won't care, bluewine, but I've got to revoke your "Defender of the Funk" card after your last several posts. I get that some folks view funk as being super-tight with little or no synths or effects, but EWF, P-Funk and the Bar-Kays didn't play funk?! As someone else in this thread put it, funk can be tight or loose. James Brown knew it, which is why he did funk jams as tight as "Superbad" and as loose as "Make It Funky." And "loose" doesn't mean sloppy; it just means that funk doesn't have to be as sharp as TOP's "What Is Hip". Is "Dr. Funkenstein" not funk? The Bar-Kays' "Holy Ghost" (there are a couple of different versions; I'm talking about the one that came out around '77-'78, with the timbale-featured breakdown) isn't funk to you? George Clinton's a joke whose unworthy to hang out with Sly Stone?! Sly doesn't seem to think so. I can understand not digging the elaborate stage show, but so many mid-to-late '70s P-Funk tracks too numerous to mention were not just funky; they were, indeed, The Funk! The mid-to-late '70s bands didn't dilute funk; they expanded the possibilities of what funk could be.

 

[lucas vigor]

Often overlooked: