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What's with all the live auditions?

#21
If that is the only way a club hires bands and you want to play at that club, you do it. You can argue all day about whether it is right or wrong, but sometimes that's the way it is. You can always choose not to play the club.

In my old age I don't have many hard and fast rules. If it's a cool club and I wanted to play I would do it.
 
#22
lfmn16 said:
If that is the only way a club hires bands and you want to play at that club, you do it. You can argue all day about whether it is right or wrong, but sometimes that's the way it is. You can always choose not to play the club.

In my old age I don't have many hard and fast rules. If it's a cool club and I wanted to play I would do it.
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Agree with this a million percent. I can't wrap my mind around any other position. A couple examples:

When I first started out in a bar band around Philly/South Jersey many moons ago, our band had reached a point where we wanted to gig much more that we had been. We got involved with Apollo Artists, a well known (at the time at least) booking agent for cover bands in the area. They started us at mostly dives, and occasionally (like twice a year) asked us to play "showcases" for free at much better clubs. These showcases involved 2-4 bands, doing a set each on an off-night. Was probably mostly about the club having a decent crowd on an off-night without paying for a band. But in the end, for doing about 4-5 of these things we got at least two full week long gigs (back then it was common to play 4-5 night stands) at cool clubs out of the deal. On top of that, as the months and years rolled by Apollo gave us more nights at better places, we had a great relationship with them that really helped fill out our schedule and personally gave me some invaluable experience playing around at different venues and learning to be a professional performing musician. The handful of times I played for free at their request (in addtion to the booking percentage we paid them) were a small price to pay for what we got in return.

Here's one more recent. A start up band I was in was trying to get in to a popular waterfront bar/restaurant. The guy who booked the bands there had no interest in listenting to a tape, or of arranging his schedule to come hear us. Basically, the way they did it was the free, live audition. We sucked it up and played it. Within a month we had an every Sunday afternoon gig there, at decent pay, for the next two years. Afew hours for free for two years of work? Yeah, I'd say it was worth it.

I'd speculate the folks on here telling you they would never play for free are those who already have all the work they want or can handle. If you are in that situation too, then sure why play for free? But if you want/need more gigs than you have, to reject out of hand a live audition just because you aren't paid seems foolish to me. My last thought on this-if you were in a band that played free live auditions 2-3 times a month for several months and got no paying gigs out of it, the issue would not not be one of a band getting the shaft from greedy scumbag clubowners...the issue is your band needs to improve.
 
#23
Bullitt5135 said:
Sitting here in my car waiting to go into a bar for a mini-audition with my band. Apparently, club owners around here don't care to look at your website/YouTube to check you out. So I get to invest roughly 4+ hours, a bunch of gas, and getting to bed after 1am on a week night in hopes of landing a full gig for $300-ish down the road. I know its not about the money, but this kind of blows. We'll he lucky if they give us time for 6 songs. Oh well... Such is life for the weekend warrior, I suppose.

How do you TBers view these auditions? Necessary evil?
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Live audition? No, what you describe is a free performance. Not a chance I'd bite at that.
 
#24
Bullitt5135 said:
I know its not about the money,
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Well, it is and it isn't.

If you and your band have invested in gear, your time developing the band, gas and other expenses, it's about money.

It's fine from a philosophical perspective that we do it because we have a passion for performance and we share that with our peers.

However that is something I wouldn't want to share with club owners.

Blue
 
#25
MonkeyBass said:
Just a way for clubs to get free entertainment. I won't do it anymore and neither should anyone else.
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+ one

playing for free is a no win proposal for bands. I am sure a few of you have generated paying gigs from free bees, but that's the exception.

I say, don't do it.
 
#26
lfmn16 said:
If that is the only way a club hires bands and you want to play at that club, you do it. You can argue all day about whether it is right or wrong, but sometimes that's the way it is. You can always choose not to play the club.

In my old age I don't have many hard and fast rules. If it's a cool club and I wanted to play I would do it.
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I say no, my band wanted to play some cool club around here and it was one of those play for free first deals.

I convinced the band to play hard ball, because we have a strong local following we can leverage.

They called the venue, explained our terms and why we bring value.

They had an opening in may, they booked us at our full rate.

Blue
 
#27
The most I would ever do on an audition gig would be 1 set. There's no need to do an all-nighter for free.

IMO, the best way to do one of these is to "open" for a band that's already playing that night, or play a few tunes during their set break. You probably need to be friendly already with the band playing there, but at least you can audition without having to lug all your gear and take up too much time, while the other band gets paid the same while not having to play as much, and possibly getting new fans from your crowd.
 
#28
Here's a question - do you think they'll ever pay you for a gig once you've shown that you're willing to play their place for free? They probably audition 4 or 5 new bands every week and never hire a single one of them for a legit gig...

That said, there is a necessary evil and it's usually playing on an off night like a Tuesday or Wednesday for a reduced rate. That's not unheard of in building a relationship with a legit venue. But if they're wanting you to play for free then yeah, they're screwing you over and have no intentions on bringing you back.
 
#29
OP Update: So the place turned out to be just a sleepy neighborhood bar and grill. Besides the staff and the house band, there were no more than 10-15 customers in the place -- and none of them appeared to be there for the music. We played 6 or 7 songs and got a decent response from the small crowd. I’m not sure I’d even want to be asked back for a full gig if this is their typical Thursday night (they book bands on Thursday and Saturday). I suppose if they booked us for a Saturday, the band has a lot of friends and family in the area so I’m sure we could pull some kind of a crowd.

I have only recently started playing out. The other guys have been doing it for decades. I think I need to have a talk with the drummer so he doesn’t keep setting up these freebies. To his credit one of them turned into a Saturday bar gig in June, although from the beginning, we all agreed that we don’t really want to play the bar scene -- we’d prefer to play community festivals and special events. I like the fact that I’m getting some live/stage experience, but I think four hours of our time would be better spent rehearsing 25 songs instead of waiting half the night to play 6.

Lots of good comments here. Thanks for sharing your insights.

JH
 
#30
My band have done a few of these 'live auditions'. We charged of course: a lower rate than normal. Just as a quick 'Hello' from the band.
A few bar/club owners take the piss and say, I can't pay more than I paid for the next gig.
We usually say, that's the going rate... take it or leave it. The ones that 'leave it' just ain't worth the bother, and they are the ones missing out.
 
#31
How does people feel about playing open mic/stages for auditions?

Here in Denver, it's seems a lot of bars will hire you after playing their open mic and prove your stage presence and playing ability. For us, this a good option as we build up our fans base and get to meet other bands/musicians. These are during the week and we generally play with 4-5 other acts. Last week we played an open stage and possibly got 2 jobs from it. (This was our 6th time playing live and an original band too! We have played twice paid and 4-5 times at open mics.)

Here in Denver, there is a big craigslist movement that flared up this week about not playing for free, which I agree with. Besides a good press kit, how else can we get our music out?

p.s. I'm not trolling, I'm learning!!:help::bassist:
 
#32
Bullitt5135 said:
OP Update: So the place turned out to be just a sleepy neighborhood bar and grill. Besides the staff and the house band, there were no more than 10-15 customers in the place -- and none of them appeared to be there for the music. We played 6 or 7 songs and got a decent response from the small crowd. I’m not sure I’d even want to be asked back for a full gig if this is their typical Thursday night
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I light of this, I want to slightly revise my opinion that I gave above. I don't think I have ever played a free audition gig at a venue that I hadn't been to at least once and knew our band WANTED to play there for whatever reason (cool room, cache, good pay, etc).
 
#33
I wouldnt agree to do a full show for free, no way. The couple of places that asked us to do it only asked us to play 5-6 songs max. And, they provided the sound guy and PA (which we normally provide) so we agreed to do it a couple of times. We have plenty of examples of our songs and recordings, so I wouldnt do it unless I thought it was worth it. And I do like the drink analogy.
 
#34
phatbass said:
"Give me 6 beers for nothing. If I like the beer, and I like the bar staff's attitude, I might come back in a month or so and buy some drinks."
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Okay, to make this analogy work we have to be talking about some new or homemade beer that no one has tasted. In that case his beer may taste better than some bands sound but it may suck, so doing a free set is kind of like a food company giving out free samples to get people to like their new food idea.

All kinds of companies give out free products and reduced rate services when they're trying to boost sales. It's just business. Do they give away their stuff for free all the time? No. So, playing free gigs all the time? No. Working a deal with a certain venue for the right reason? Why not?

Personally, I would normally say no as it's usually just an attempt by a bar owner to get free entertainment. But if the situation was right and I was trying to get a start-up band off the ground, eh, maybe.
 
#36
Bullitt5135 said:
OP Update: we all agreed that we don’t really want to play the bar scene -- we’d prefer to play community festivals and special events.

JH
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Get you political shoes on. Festival, high profile summer fairs, it's all about who you know, not how good you are.

Blue
 
#37
Back in the day (1970's) bar owners had a great system (for them) unless you were known to them, they expected you to play the first gig for free, and then they'd tell you if you were worth paying to play a second time.

No excuse today for a live audition, unless the band in question doesn't have any existing material to share.
 
#38
This is from a Vancouver Craigslist ad someone linked on my Facebook. Enjoy!



Craigslist Ad :

We are a small & casual restaurant in downtown Vancouver and we are looking for solo musicians to play in our restaurant to promote their work and sell their CD. This is not a daily job, but only for special events which will eventually turn into a nightly event if we get positive response. More Jazz, Rock, & smooth type music, around the world and mixed cultural music. Are you interested to promote your work? Please reply back ASAP.

My Reply:

Happy new year! I am a musician with a big house looking for a restauranteur to promote their restaurant and come to my house to make dinner for my friends and I. This is not a daily job, but only for special events which will eventually turn into a nightly event if we get positive response. More fine dining & exotic meals and mixed Ethnic Fusion cuisine. Are you interested to promote your restaurant? Please reply back ASAP.
 
#39
spc said:
This is from a Vancouver Craigslist ad someone linked on my Facebook. Enjoy!



Craigslist Ad :

We are a small & casual restaurant in downtown Vancouver and we are looking for solo musicians to play in our restaurant to promote their work and sell their CD. This is not a daily job, but only for special events which will eventually turn into a nightly event if we get positive response. More Jazz, Rock, & smooth type music, around the world and mixed cultural music. Are you interested to promote your work? Please reply back ASAP.

My Reply:

Happy new year! I am a musician with a big house looking for a restauranteur to promote their restaurant and come to my house to make dinner for my friends and I. This is not a daily job, but only for special events which will eventually turn into a nightly event if we get positive response. More fine dining & exotic meals and mixed Ethnic Fusion cuisine. Are you interested to promote your restaurant? Please reply back ASAP.
Click to expand...

Funny, and right on. Clubs are forever wanting to get something for nothing, but it almost always applies to the folks - musicians - who have the most time, energy, passion and money invested in the service they provide to the clubs.

And on a related note: when was the last time a club hired a bartender - or a hostess or a clean-up crew -- on the basis of the services they would provide AND what kind of a crowd they'd bring?
 
#40
While I'd never commit my band to an "audition" gig for free, we do occasionally contribute our time and talent to benefit concerts for worthwhile causes, and we will occasionally play for less than ideal, particularly the first time at a club we'd like to play at regularly.

But we won't play for a free at a place where everyone else is being compensated for their services.
 

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