What's Wrong with Scooping the Mids?

[AceOfBassFace]

It really depends on the music and the rest of the mix. The guys in the trio I play in (guitar/bass/drums) prefer a scooped tone, so the bass can be loud while not drowning out the guitar. Another band I'm in I have to boost the mids to be able to hear any kind of character from the bass (loud drummer, percussionist, 2 guitars, 4 horns, keys).

 

[littlebun]

I'm not well acquainted with the amps forum, so bear with me here.

I was trying out the sample settings in the Mesa WD-800's manual today with a drum track and my favourite with my Precision and Jazz was: bass at 1, passive mid at 9 and treble at 11.

Now, when I started playing bass in the early 2000s, mid-scooping was all the rage, at least in acid jazz, jazz fusion, funk and funk rock.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel like mid-scooping has since fell out of favour. I'm worried I've become a product of my time, like how James Jamerson was left behind in the 70s because he refused to switch his Precision strung with flats for an active bass with rounds. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but I'm wondering why mid-scooping fell out of favour. Am I missing something?

Fingerstyle is sometimes better served with some mids because of the added clarity and note definition. Scooping is cool for thumbing especially.

 

[chadds]

Well by the comments around here you would think scooping your mids is akin to dating your sister but I don't find it "old fashioned" or "out of favor".

Depends on the level of "scooping" of course but remember the midrange is where your ear hears best which is why backing off the mids often makes the sound more balanced. The midrange being dominant in human hearing is why you see "smiley faced EQ" on PA rigs and such.

It also depends a lot on the style of music you play, some styles sound better with the mids dialed back others need more mids into the mix. Also the cabinet(s) you are using plays a huge part into what EQ settings work best.

The entire reason amps have controls on them as opposed to just a master volume is to dial the sound into the taste of the user.

If scooping the mids works for you, well it works for you.

I'd not worry about it not "being in style" quite frankly.

Analogeezer

Dating your sister is "old fashioned" or "out of favor?" Anyone else not get the memo?
What's next? P basses and Tort!?

 

[ryco]

Dial in what sounds good to you and leave the rest up to the sound guy.

stand out a ways on the dance floor or out in the room during sound check run thru and adjust.
If you are just dialing in for yourself as a stage monitor, just make sure you are hearing everything out of your axe & rig you want to hear.

 

[LanEvo]

Mid-scoop still sounds good with overdrive and a pick (lots of metal guys do this) or slapping and popping with a bunch of compression (Marcus Miller, etc).

For the most part, when playing fingerstyle in a typical rock, pop, blues, jazz, context a little mid bump sounds great.

 

[JazzyJacuzzi]

IIRC, Jamerson was "left behind" because a) his drinking got to be too problematic, and b) Motown's move to LA made him ... redundant. In other words, inability to repair himself and adapt to new challenges.

Seems it's all of the above, according to Ed Friedland in R&B Bass Masters

 

[micguy]

Scooping mods can be, and in my world is a useful thing. The thing is, there's a lot of real estate in the middle - what you scoop and how much (hint - not a lot) is key to making it work. My typical eq is a 5 dB dip at 270 Hz, with a low q of .5 or so. That takes away some of the mud pile-up that often happens with electric guitars. The upper mids I don't scoop - I have a bit of boost at 1.6 kHz.

Essentially, I leave a lane for the guitars, and poke out above and below them.

 

[CallMeAl]

Totally depends on the situation. My blues/rock band gets more mids than my county band. I use more mids when the drummer brings the kit, vs the cajon. Just a few examples.

 

[Watchootognbout]

What sounds good in your bedroom does not necessarily translate to a great tone when playing with a band.

Assuming we all play the same music.

 

[Chickenwheels]

It sounds like the general consensus is that you should trust your own ears and instincts when setting up your stage sound. Good advice.

 

[hrodbert696]

I learned the lesson this way:

Years ago I joined my first gigging band with a much more experienced guitarist as BL. For whatever reason I had gotten to using my EQ set about 7-7-4 (of 10, low-mid-high). One practice he asked if I minded if he adjusted my EQ. I was hesitant but agreed, figuring he was more experienced. So I played (solo) while he fiddled with knobs and pronounced my tone much improved. The new setting was about 9-2-8. Classic scoop.

So we have a gig soon after and start playing the first song, using the new EQ setting. In the middle of it he shouts across the stage at me, "Turn your amp down!"

I'm a bit surprised because I didn't have my volume up all that high. "Turn it down, are you sure?"

"Yeah, turn it down... it sounds BOOMY!"

I think, "boomy," ...huh. Go to my amp, leave the volume where it was, and change my EQ back to 7-7-4.

"How's that?"

"Much better, perfect!"

 

[themickster]

I scoop the mids on my active SR600E. It gives me low end and clank at the top. Blackstar infinite shape filter is a mid scoop.

 

[39-Bassist]

ANY tone will be dependent on where the rest of the band (aka: guitarist, keys, etc) land in the tonal process. Listen with you ears. Some times you will sound best with the band but soloed NOT so much. Or vise versa. Just give that a thought.

 

[bertthebassist]

part of the reason for scooping back in the day was because the speakers were to middy. They dropped off on the low and high ends. The scoop was to compensate.

 

[smo]

Lazy soundtechs scoop everyone's mids to make it easier to achieve a quick mix. But it'll sound like *meh* overall.

If you play in a band with a lot going on, you want a decent amount of mids & treble or others may struggle to tell what you're playing.

 

[Corigan]

Some bass players have made a living scooping mids, fieldy from korn comes to mind.

 

[Hummergeist]

Blind tests would be interesting with all of this, or something where it's impossible to tell visuals what each knob on the panel is doing. No expectation or emotional attachment to adding 'more bass' or whatever.

 

[J-Mags]

Because scooped mids don't sound good, except when they do, and you can't hear them in a mix, except when you can.

 

[Cal03]

I was always bothered by the scooped mids of my Yamaha TRBX305. Always felt like I could use more definition to my tone, and only having a 2-band EQ never felt satisfactory. So I insisted on having a full 3-band EQ on my next big bass purchase to make sure those mids were ever present. Sure enough my next purchase was an Ibanez SR306, but to me it sounds fantastic with scooped mids!

-Cal.

 

[Tom Bomb]

In space, no one can hear you scoop.​