Why did Fender fail to capture the 5 String market?

[Brad Johnson]

Not in some cities you could live in

This was in Easton Md, a small town on the Eastern Shore of Maryland.

 

[Chickenwheels]

So... who captured the five string market that Fender supposedly didn't. Should be an easy question but no answers so far.

MusicMan of course!

 

[Brad Johnson]

MusicMan of course!

You think there are more five string MM basses than Fenders?

 

[Chickenwheels]

You think there are more five string MM basses than Fenders?

The BB5000 was the industry standard in the 80s, but was hard to come by.
The SR5 came out in 87, fixed the string spacing issue, and was readily available to all. They’re still making them 35 years later.
Pretty good odds.

 

[Chickenwheels]

Even Nathan had one on hand in 1990. And the BBNE5 bore some uncanny resemblances.

 

[Brad Johnson]

The BB5000 was the industry standard in the 80s, but was hard to come by.
The SR5 came out in 87, fixed the string spacing issue, and was readily available to all. They’re still making them 35 years later.
Pretty good odds.

I don't recall there being an industry standard in the 80's. That's when the first OTS attempts took place The modified four string mindset was still at play. I do remember narrow spacing being an issue. And you're saying Musicman addressed that?


Neither of those basses had anywhere near the sales of what Fender did in the mid-90's. They certainly didn't dominate anything, just a couple of nice choices for people who didn't mind their shortcomings. I had an Aria Pro II, a narrow spaced bass that I disliked.

Again, alternate universe. I ordered a five from Mike Tobias in 1984 because of the lack of good alternatives. Still have it..

 

[Brad Johnson]

What brands are Fender fives supposed to be second to? Certainly not in sales... and personally I've found most "improved" Fender clones to be mostly hype. I don't see the demand for 7 lb. jazz basses to be all that high.

This is an interesting thread in that the root of it is based on assumptions that don't ring true.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Just perused some Ernie Ball forum posts about string spacing and they were just as goofy as I remembered them. Big Poppa decided on narrow spacing and wrote that if you want wider spacing, go somewhere else.

I remember getting a similar response from G&L. And I happily went elsewhere.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

I suspect Ibanez sells the most five and six string basses since they make so many at all price points. I am pretty sure Fender beats Ibanez in the $1,000+ area.

 

[Verne Andru]

My question is this... why wasn't Fender able to establish the same powerful foothold in the 5-string market as they did with the P bass and Jazz Bass? Were they that bad? My thinking leads me to believe that a 5-string was considered a very heavily specialized instrument at the time and not as ubiquitous as it is today.

FWIW I bought my first 5-string in the late nineties after a bit of shopping around. At that time the only Fender available where I am was a 5-string J running around $1900. The cheapest 5 was a Yamaha BB405, which was also a J configuration. Whereas the Fender felt like a low B was added as an after-thought, the Yamaha was purpose-built as a 5 and felt/played better. This was the way it was for quite a while - Fender not taking the 5 seriously - allowing other makers to dominate this part of the market.

 

[audreycashin]

Looks like a humbucker pick up to me....

That's a question I've been asking for years. Best 5-string Fender ever made IMO (neck-and-neck with the Roscoe Beck V). You still see a handful of 4-strings in the wild for sale but the 5-strings are unicorn status now.

Unicorn is right! Been looking for one about 5 years now, since I picked up the 4 string version.

 

[audreycashin]

That's a beauty! All passive, with just series/parallel switch?

Series, parallel and OMG mode.

 

[Auspuff]

I have read some stories about Fender and the first 5-string bass. It had only 15 frets and a high C...and wasn't accepted by any players then in 1965...

But what happened after that? There was no other Powerhouse in the game like Fender. We know that 10 years later Jimmy Johnson worked with Alembic to create one of the first five strings with a low B, a bass we now consider to be the template based on the modern 5-string. For a full 10 years or more Fender gave up on the concept?

My question is this... why wasn't Fender able to establish the same powerful foothold in the 5-string market as they did with the P bass and Jazz Bass? Were they that bad? My thinking leads me to believe that a 5-string was considered a very heavily specialized instrument at the time and not as ubiquitous as it is today.

To an extent even in 2020, I still feel that is true and although Fender today makes great 5 string basses, they still pale in comparison to the P and Jazz 4-string dominance of yesteryear and today.

Since the modern 5 string became a thing, why have Fenders become a secondary 5 string option to other brands? Were they unable to produce a quality instrument in the early years? Did other brands simply establish themselves before Fender for 5 string basses?

I'm sure they captured a decent portion of the market at one point or another but for a company as dominant as Fender was, their 5-string business seems like an overall failure. JMHO.

Because it's not a priority.

 

[skyline_01]

Unicorn is right! Been looking for one about 5 years now, since I picked up the 4 string version.

Right?! I have a friend who has a sunburst one and I drop him subtle hints once in a while to sell it to me.

 

[Chickenwheels]

My 5-string odyssey, starting in ‘92:
ESP Horizon 5 (because I couldn’t find a BB5000)
Ibanez SR05 (briefly, wobbly neck).
Fender Roscoe Beck V (still a main player today).
String spacing never bothered me much. I’d come from an Aria SB1000 with narrow spacing anyway.
The first time I heard of a “5 string bass” was when I was reading the sleeve on one of my Dad’s album. A credit was written: Jimmy “Flim” Johnson - 5 string Alembie(sic) base(sic). Lol.
After digging around I found out that most of my favourite players had been using the Yamaha BB5000. I still love the tone of these basses, and even have an old BB 4 string. Part of this is why I wanted the passive RBV.
Tobias basses were highly coveted but ultimately too exotic for an Antipodean in his teens in the early 90’s!

 

[JimmyM]

My 5-string odyssey, starting in ‘92:
ESP Horizon 5 (because I couldn’t find a BB5000)
Ibanez SR05 (briefly, wobbly neck).
Fender Roscoe Beck V (still a main player today).
String spacing never bothered me much. I’d come from an Aria SB1000 with narrow spacing anyway.
The first time I heard of a “5 string bass” was when I was reading the sleeve on one of my Dad’s album. A credit was written: Jimmy “Flim” Johnson - 5 string Alembie(sic) base(sic). Lol.
After digging around I found out that most of my favourite players had been using the Yamaha BB5000. I still love the tone of these basses, and even have an old BB 4 string. Part of this is why I wanted the passive RBV.
Tobias basses were highly coveted but ultimately too exotic for an Antipodean in his teens in the early 90’s!

Don't feel too bad...they were too exotic for a Yank in his teens in the late 70's, too, and that was back when nobody but a handful of Orlando musicians knew who he was! Sure took off in our area, though...then he got the hell out of Dodge!

 

[pedulla-2007]

Just saying... It does not look as if This gentleman thinks the older Fender 5 strings have a floppy "B" string. Starting at 1:44, and a solo at 3:44, see if you can hear anything wrong with Melvin Davis' older inline 5 string Jazz bass.

 

[Brad Johnson]

FWIW I bought my first 5-string in the late nineties after a bit of shopping around. At that time the only Fender available where I am was a 5-string J running around $1900. The cheapest 5 was a Yamaha BB405, which was also a J configuration. Whereas the Fender felt like a low B was added as an after-thought, the Yamaha was purpose-built as a 5 and felt/played better. This was the way it was for quite a while - Fender not taking the 5 seriously - allowing other makers to dominate this part of the market.

Here in the US Fender Jazzes were around $700 or less in the mid-90's.

Yamaha didn't dominate the market. Who did?

 

[TheDominoKid]

My 2002 American Jaz Deluxe V has a beautiful B string. But then again, the tuning machines aren't five-in-line.

 

[pedulla-2007]

Here in the US Fender Jazzes were around $700 or less in the mid-90's.

Yamaha didn't dominate the market. Who did?

This company got my 5-string money back in the day until I could get my hands on a BB 5000!
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