Why do we still use amps?

[Samatza]

Mic’ing an amp sounds great. I can see your point live, but for me I went from going direct to mic’ing at home.

but I do remember the first time I played my Mesa Bass 400 cranked, live. Goosebumps.

Oh yeah! I played one at a show years ago with an Alembic Essence bass and man did I fall in love with that combo.

 

[MDBass]

Probably just as well newer players are dumping their amps. Knowing how to get a good and balanced house sound using just your backline amps is pretty much a lost art these days.

Either way, for the amount of volume being cranked through most PA systems I’ve been hearing lately, and the obsession with putting the kick and everything else below 250Hz through the subs, it doesn’t really matter what you do most times. Because even though the quality and capabilities of our gear has improved dramatically, the knowledge of how to effectively use it hasn’t always kept pace.

Definitely, subs needs to be crossed over WAY lower than 250Hz for them to work musically instead of just producing a woofy wall of muddy garbage.

Pretty easy to make six figures worth of new gear sound like poop if you don’t know what you’re doing.

 

[downunder]

When you run through PA you give up control of your sound in a big way. I play a gig pretty regularly that has a house keyboard, drums, PA, monitors and a direct box For the bass. This is a chain restaurant and one of the rules is everybody goes through the PA. Let me tell you; the sound sucks. It’s embarrassing to say this but they’ve got a digital/led/multiscreen mixer which I can’t access from where I play, so the keyboard player is always trying to figure out how to make it work. And they never really can. It’s a really complicated little thing. I know how to run a mixer but not this thing. i’ve started running a line out from the direct box straight into the monitor closest to me so I can at least hear myself, Even though it’s distorted and the Lows fart out through the crappy speakers that were meant for Vocals.

 

[pbassjbass]

The pa is two twenty year old JBL eon 10's and a 300 watt soundcraft head, currently used for vocals (sound on a stick setup, out front) I don't think it would work well for bass, and I'd never hear it. Why do we use it? It's paid for, and the gigs keep coming.

 

[JimmyM]

When you run through PA you give up control of your sound in a big way. I play a gig pretty regularly that has a house keyboard, drums, PA, monitors and a direct box For the bass. This is a chain restaurant and one of the rules is everybody goes through the PA. Let me tell you; the sound sucks. It’s embarrassing to say this but they’ve got a digital/led/multiscreen mixer which I can’t access from where I play, so the keyboard player is always trying to figure out how to make it work. And they never really can. It’s a really complicated little thing. I know how to run a mixer but not this thing. i’ve started running a line out from the direct box straight into the monitor closest to me so I can at least hear myself, Even though it’s distorted and the Lows fart out through the crappy speakers that were meant for Vocals.

You don't have to give up all control. I certainly don't. But there really isn't much you can do in that situation except grin and bear it.

 

[juancaminos]

I play best when I sound the way I want. There is often nothing I can do to influence the FOH, but I can get my sound on stage.

This for me, someone else mentioned all of the amp choices we have today. I chose the sound of a particular amp that I am pretty sure I'm not going to get out of some random monitor speaker.

To add to this...I guess that if I was on tour with the same sound guy who I know will get my sound every night then I really wouldn't care where it came from as long as it was there, right?

 

[madmaskbass]

If I was a international touring musician that music was my main living I would 100% be in-ear monitors and a small utility pedalboard for overall tone to keep overheads down. But as a weekend warrior/bedroom basher where music and gear is a interest and love that i sink bulk money into having a monster rig is such an amazing value add! You can almost guarantee that everyone of those musicians did not record with their tour rigs and if given the preference would mostly emulate their ideal rig if they had roadies and the freedom of choice. There is also the idea that greater control can be gained over lowering the stage volume helps but i think the art of balancing this has been a well trod path and the quality of a sound engineer is getting this balance right. Just because I have a rig that could drown out the whole band and blast ear-drums for days does not mean that i have to. So yep I am gonna stick with my old, fragile, heavy and rediculous rig because the sounds that this thing make keep me happy, motivated and in love with bass!. I will fight the idea that a pedal and a set of IEM's is enough until that is all I can carry or i am relying on making money.

 

[klejst]

Interesting. I never had but a band my band at the time used to play shows with the bassist would always just bring his amp and run through the PA speakers from the DI. I always brought my cab too, however most times it was hardly used and I was usually routed through the DI as well instead of mic'ed or just straight output from my amp and cab.

 

[LBS-bass]

It actually sounded effective, like they meant to do it. But that was for "Don't Step On The Grass, Sam," where the call-and-answer thing works with that sound. I have to think other tracks he sang on didn't fare so well.

I'd have recut it and lied about it

I would have, too. I was kinda surprised that's not how that ended.

 

[sflajimmy]

"Empty cabinets have been a thing for some while - they're basically decorations for the bands that can afford it "

I'm sure this has been mentioned in relation to this thread, but some touring acts just use props for the "look". The cabs are empty. A color coordinated wall of Marshall Stacks and Ampeg 8x10's been done many times....

 

[JimmyM]

I have a funny "going ampless" story...

This was probably 2002...I was the first call bassist for the house convention band at House Of Blues at Disney Village in Orlando. We'd do a set or two of dance music, then a Blues Brothers show. They had a great sound/light staff, a big stage, and pretty massive sidefills on the stage, and I never lacked for bass. So one night I figured I'd go in ampless and see what I thought because the schlep kind of sucked. I set up, and as I'm finishing up, the drummer walks in, my longtime pal to this day Cadillac. Love the guy! A blast to hang with and a fantastic drummer who can play his ass off but only plays what's right and never a beat more. He asks where my amp is. I tell him what's going on.

"Don't ever come to one of these gigs ampless again."

He was visibly unhappy about it, too.

"Why not?"

"I don't want to put you in my monitor."

"What's wrong with that? Your monitor is fine for bass."

"I don't want bass in my monitor."

"OK, so don't put it in there."

"I want to hear the bass."

"Then put it in your monitor."

"I don't want it in my monitor."

Arrrggghhh! Drummers! Spinal Tap moment! I wished he could explode spontaneously, but he didn't.

"I have no idea what your problem is," I finally said.

"I want to hear the bass out of your amp. I don't want to hear it out of my monitor. I only want to hear me out of my monitor."

You son of a motherless...you're ruining my plans for an easy schlep...why you...I oughta...

Instead, I calmly offered up the sidefills.

"I can't hear them from back here."

He's right...you couldn't. They're good for the front line if they can't hear something, but not much in the back. So I had to blast myself in the face with monitor in order to make him semi-happy and hear myself sing, and then it occurred to me how I hate hearing bass in my monitor, too, and everything else except other vocals way down from mine.

So I said, "OK, Caddy, I learned my lesson. I'll never put us through that again."

"You better not."

And I haven't after 18 years. Got a gig with him in December, I believe. I'll bring an amp for sure. Don't intercourse with Caddy.

 

[Meaculpa]

I dont use amps since 1 year and a half ago. Send my signal to foh or use the backline amp of the venue. Almost every gig I manage to get the same sound that I used to with some proper tweaking. Everything changed when I purchased my beloved boss gt1b. No need no more amps.

 

[Heroinsheep]

A good amp will make you play with more emotion. My happy place on bass is being relaxed, and often with a DI alone it's hard to feel relaxed because you feel "in the mix"... where as being close to an amp gives you that slight "outside the mix" feeling which is relaxing to me (even if amp volume is low).
But sometimes it can be the exact opposite... Whatever the gig requires... In some cases hearing yourself exactly inside the mix can help make the music more dance-able... I find music that isn't played with a drum set but say.. a Laptop, a percussionist, or any kind of non standard drumset beat making thing, going with a DI+FX and no amp can actually be more fun...

 

[Sassy Tick Tock]

Because we like them

Took the words right out of my mouth.

 

[YAdaYadaYada]

I use an SWR 200 Watt combo. It has an XLR out, to the board. I own the PA, so I usually plug all the instruments into the board for every gig. Even the small gigs, if just to pull the sound out to the front a bit more. My thoughts have always been, amps on stage are our monitors. Let the sound man do his job, and keep it down to a dull roar. That being said, we could always go direct, and put a matched washing machine and dryer set behind us, just like Geddy.

 

[Stevorebob]

Because the monitor mix is often unreliable in many venues.

 

[Sywannab]

I feel more alive when the powerful sound comes out from the cab behind me.

 

[TheDominoKid]

Oh god. 8 hours later and this thread is still going. Per his photo of the small stage—swap places with the guitar player that’s standing in FRONT of your bass cab.

Love my stack. Love stage volume.

 

[Spectrum]

Standing in front of a real live SVT rig cranked up to rip your face off. That's why.

 

[/\/\3phist0]

I've seen a bunch of interesting bass rigs from touring artists - mostly in the rock / metal scene where the guys usually send some sort a direct signal to the front of house and use amps on stage.

My question is - why do so many guys spend the money on 800+ watt amps and 8x10" cabs plus go trough the effort of transporting it to gigs, when no one except the bass player actually cares. How many bands do you know that actually mic up their cabs and don't just go trough the DI of the amp in the end?

Here's a recent example, where the guy is sending 2 direct signals to the PA. Why not use the same setup + an IR loader to send the signal directly.


P.s. I don't use an amp, and my band uses an in-ear monitoring system.

As I say in every one of these threads that come out every year at least.
Why, if you are using in ears, the next revolution should be similar technology for the audience, a Bluetooth stream, many people walk around with them full time anyway .
And following that, live stream video to the phones that many of the audience spends so much time watching while you are on stage anyway.
No need for acoustic drums either, right?
Why bring out a big sub and mains?
Heck since we're toddling down the road, why not just pre record the entire performance and just show it on a big screen on the wall?

Simple, amps are visceral, and in ears create a distance and isolation that many cannot accommodate. Many can move this direction, and it works no doubt, many can't hang with the tech.

Large acts have been using the amps and cabs as stage props for decades.

Why I personally use an amp and cab:
I like feeling the sound, I like the sound of the amp and cones interacting.
I like hearing the crowd, I like being able to talk directly to band members without the need to use a mic.
IEMs are in my future for the singers primarily, and the drummer is going digital, the guitarist still uses a small cab miced. I di to the FOH, and once we move away from the floor monitors I will need to go in ears myself. The physical impact of the audio will need to be replaced by a bodypack, or a floor feedback plate of some kind.

I has sad

technology will replace every human aspect of music eventually.
Heck we don't need to sing or play in tune anymore thanks to Antares and other autotune processes.

Oh and I'm in a high tech field so not a technophobe !

 

[mmmmmmmmm]

You can't make the people near the front of the stage soil themselves if you don't have some nice fat subs...