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X-Bass - Experimental 3 Pickup Bass

PROJECT UPDATE:

Ok, I have all of the software loaded up and ready (the TRUE-RTA setup), and I am pretty much all ready to go. I forgot to order in the extra pickup screws though, so for now I am using only two screws per pickup placed on opposing corners of each pickup.

It's a matter of making time to do the recordings and prepare them for posting in SoundCloud.

After getting my shoulder issue fairly dealt with, I had to take time to get caught up at work, then these blasted record setting Monsoon storms hit and knocked out power for several days, and caused roof damage as well. So ..... I am behind at work again (can't solder in 115f degree heat without power!). Which means this project has to get set aside .... again.

So ....... another delay on this project. Have no fear though, I absolutely WILL be moving forward with it.

Thanks ..... FJ
 
UG!!! ANOTHER FALSE START, BUT I'M GETTING GOING ON THIS PROJECT NOW!

Well, just a few days ago I was released from the hospital after staying there several days for a severe life threatening kidney infection. Caused by what, you say?

I passed a 6.1mm calcite stone at home, in a 12 hour long battle with me on my hands and knees clawing at the carpet and writhing around in agony.

Stone-1_zps4581b008.jpg


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I've broken over 30 bones (motorcycle and BMX racing ... even broke 5 bones at once one time), been shot 3x, had concussions, numerous other pain producing incidents that many people go through .... but these large kidney stones hold no peer. This was my twelveth stone, and my third "monster" stone over 5mm. The little ones, I hardly even feel some of those. I've even squirted two or three out in the past that I didn't even know I had in me. But these large ones, they feel like someone is pulling a fish hook through you, and taking 12 to 18 hours to do it! It is sheer torture, without any exaggeration.

Even nurses at the hospital that have given birth to humans and have also had larger stones say that the stones are far more painful than childbirth is. All I know is that I do not like them. The VA has been treating me with anti-stone production efforts since the last big one I passed which was a 7.26mm stone (again, passed at home) in 2010. But it's fairly obvious that their efforts have not worked as expected.

SO ANYHOW .....

Yea, so I'm getting this project rolling again. I'm installing the 3rd and 4th pickups tonight, and getting the wiring done on them using the multi-connector strip idea I came up with to wire it all in. As previously pictured the terminal strip and output jacks are already installed, and the massive bathtub pickup cavity is all cut and finished (well, as finished as it's gonna get!). Due to the interruptions over the past several months (the shoulder issue which is now pretty much fixed, the Monsoon Storms which caused a 65 thousand volt power pole to fall on our house and lose power in our entire area for five days during a 117f heat wave, and most lately the kidney stone issue which still has me on the strongest antibiotics I've ever taken to clear up the severe bacterial kidney infection) I had to set this project aside.

Storm2013-1-001_zps9c517640.jpg


Now I'm ready to move forward, not at the pace I wish I could move with, but at least it's forward motion!

I'll be sure to post pics as I progress here. And I'll be testing out the TRUE-RTA digital o-scope and frequency analyzer program I bought a few months back. Screenshots from it coupled with very short little audio demos that I'll be posting in my SoundClould account will be used to compare pickup data and different combinations of pickups, as well as some different pickups. As it stands all I have on hand at the moment is two complete sets of Duncan Designed J-bass pickups (which I quite like to be honest) as well as a set of stock Fender P-Bass pickups.

For anyone new to this project, go back and read about some of the configurations I plan on testing out. There's one I call "Super P" that many members seem interested in.

So there we go .... I'm back baby! :bassist:
 
Here's a recap of what's going on (this goes back to page 6) ......



JACK PANEL AND TERMINAL STRIP

Here we go. First off, I've had to start using smaller photos. Photobucket started whining at me about using too much bandwidth so I've gone down to 640x480 pics. I may be reducing the size of pics I have already posted as well to reduce my monthly bandwdith useage, so if there are any pics you particularly like in the larger size you'd be well advised to copy them soon. As I get time I'll be resizing and reposting the pics at a smaler size over the days/weeks ahead. I'll also be paying for more bandwidth from Photobucket so as to be able to continue providing these project threads with as much photographic content as possible.

Onward .....

Ok, I made a jack panel that I was able to mount five Switchcraft #11 1/4" Tip/Sleeve jacks to. I made the panel out of 1.5" x 1.5" x 1/16th" aluminum angle that I got at Lowes. 3 feet of it was about $15. I use that type of stuff for many things so it was of no matter that I had so much of it left over. I made the panel 12 inches long. I did so because what I had done was measured between a couple of holes that were already drilled into the bass's body that were used for the pickguard. They would be covered by a piece of aluminum 12" long. So I cut the aluminum, filed the cut edges down smooth and rounded the corners. Then I measured the distance between two predrilled holes and transfered that dimension to the angle, and drilled holes in it accordingly.

I knew I wanted to have five output jacks .. just cuz .. so I decided on a good distance between them to keep things easy to do (1.25" between centers), and centered that group of five holes on the aluminum angle on the other flange. Marked and drilled those holes. Dressed up the jack panel to keep any sharp edges from being a problem. Then I went ahead and mounted the five TS jacks to the panel, and placed blue painter's tape on the surface that would be contacting the bass body to keep from making unneeded damage to the bass.

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It took a little bit of searching at our local Lowes, but I located some screws that would work to mount the terminal strip to the bass. They are the same type of screw used to mount the pickups (#4 screws) these are just 1/2" shorter in length. #4 x 1" stainless steel sheet metal screws (package of FIVE was $1.29) ....

IMGP0104_zps4801ae47.jpg


As you can see they work out really well for the terminal strip ..

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After doing a little more clean up of the carved out cavity and dressing the edges a little, it was ready.

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All of the screwholes used to mount both the terminal strip and the jack panel were existing holes that had been drilled at the factory for the stock control plate and/or the pickguard. So no extra holes had to be drilled to mount the t-strip or the jack panel.

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I then remounted the two stock pickups, and faked-in the first two added pickups. I was unable to locate any 1.5" long #4 screws locally to mount the additional pickups so I am waiting on some that I've ordered via eBay. For the time being I'll just use 2 screws per pickup (one in each opposing corner).

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Now, the idea is to wire up the output jacks with the grounds all tied together and connected to the t-strip, which will be connected to the bridge-ground. Then, each pickup will be wired in to the t-strip however I see fit to do so. I may route them so they are parallel, or series .. with any other pickups I wish simply by loosening a set screw on the t-strip and reconnecting any given pickup in any manner I choose. I may wire each pickup to it's own dedicated output jack if I wish, or parallel up two (3? 4?) so they all go out of one jack. However I'll most likely leave each pickup connected to it's own dedicated jack and then each pickup will be piped to it's own dedicated mic preamp.

Each mic preamp will be routed to it's own dedicated channel on an 8 channel mixer then pickup blending and controlling will be taken care of at the mixer.

I am going to calibrate all four ART mic preamps by using one pickup. I'll connect one pickup to a "control" preamp and get the gain settings and output levels set to optimum levels as well as make careful observations (and hand written notes) of what the TrueRTA analyzer is saying about the signal. Then I'll repeat that process with the other three preamps, using the same pickup that I used to set up the control preamp, play the same stuff through each one and watch the TrueRTA analyzer carefully. I'll set each mic preamp so that it has the same readings as the first one (the "control" preamp) and make careful notes about how to set each mic preamp so that each one has as close to the ~exact~ same gain levels (etc) as the control preamp. That way there will be as little variation caused by different settings among the preamp array. Simply setting each preamp's controls to the same markings or panel settings is poor bench practice ... each one has to be calibrated to a control preamp and notes must be taken about how to set each one so that they perform as close to the same as the control preamp, thereby removing any chances of variations throwing off the results of the forthcoming tests.

It ain't perfect, and of course there will still be flaws and probable cause to doubt some of the preciseness of the calibration process. But it is the best I can do. And that is all that can be asked. At least I am taking all the precautions I have at my disposal to eliminate as many variables as possible. And in the end, context has to be remembered, after all I'm not building a friggin space shuttle here, this is just some pickup comparisons for a bass guitar, y'know?

Anyhow, so there's today's update. Next update will include wiring up the jacks and the pickups. Then soon after will be the very first tests which will be of the stock pickups to obtain control data which can be used to compare any of the upcoming configurations. So after pickup wiring, and the first control readings, THEN the fun will begin by testing out different pickup configurations.

Bonzai !!

And so now we dance ..... :hyper:

shprockets ....
 
Glad you are doing better, Flux. :)

I was wondering why you hadn't posted in a while. Good to see you back!
Thank you. This stagnance and drifting in still waters drives me NUTS! I have to be working, always have to be doing something, always moving forward. So even though I'm not really as healthy as I should be, I gotta do something!!!!!!!!

I've found that a big part of getting better does not include laying in bed moaning about how bad life is. The more active and productive a person is, the sooner they get better. The human body is there to do one thing and one thing only ..... house and support the brain. The brain is a problem solving device. So if the brain is happy and active, it requires the body to come on-line sooner and with greater gusto and power. So give the brain something to do, something to solve, and it demands that the body support it's activity.

Pretty soon the whole machine begins working better.

:)
 
This was #12 .... the last big one was a 7.26mm that I passed at home on June 17th 2010. I've passed 3 of them that were over 5mm, and 9 of them under 5mm since 2007.

I'm not sure I can take another big one ... they take a lot out of me.

I really feel your pain. I have you beat on stone quantity, but you're way ahead on size.

Now we return you to your regularly scheduled thread...
 
ONE question, though I am on page 5, or so, at 20 posts per page!

Regarding the Jazz placement... while youre there (though I assume you are not, by now, with so many pages ahead of me ;) ) I would LOVE to hear the 'other' 4-jazz orientation, for one reason-

I do not 'have time' for ridiculous stereo-singlestring-solo-tapping processing or anything, I just like the idea of the singular pickup having so much breadth-of-harmonics. If at this point you still have the washtub routing sitting around, and felt like taking a special request, I would be beyond happy to hear even a one string, one octave scale with one 'horizontal j' under it

edit: regarding the 'ridiculous processing' i was referring to that style of playing; I am VERY interested in YOUR ridiculous processing in terms of conceptual aesthetic, savvy, and diligent attention to endgoals.. I lack the latter often

Im happy thinking about it even if you are too busy ;) I need a new project
I would ALSO accept a 'horizontal' P-bass pickup on two strings :p

the modular rig thread, and now this thread, are truly INSPIRING ME

I am a neophyte in the effects/electronics realm, but i am clever, and my inexperience combined with my particular ways of thinking make me see things a really functional-but-unusual way, and in this vain, you are my HERO


I have some ideas i'd love to spitball with you sometime, so I can figure out what I am talking about ;) I really 'get' what you see in all of this, and I appreciate your voluntary, and well-crafted long-windedness; it is a quality and skill I do not see enough of


I'll catch up in a few pages, on both threads

cheers
 
hm! another thought!
have you considered using the pickups 'naturally balanced' state?
I realize that there is a volume on each pickup there, but I.. well.. I am already COVERED in footswitches and Exp Pedal arrays, so I see an easy solution to that.

By naturally balanced, i mean this:
(and you will be well served to research this, because im a little dumb )
Rather than referencing 'one side' of a pickup to ground, I believe you can tie it to the jack as a 'negative' as in a TRS or XLR setup. From what i understand, you can use this as a balanced signal, use a balanced input (i think those ARTS have that.. I have a couple mic preamps around and most of them can take a TRS balanced-in)

It is hard for me to say if this is productive or counter-so to your means, but theres something nice-sounding about the idea, in a zealous 'sooper pure tone' kind-of-way.. grumble grumble.. loading, erm.. volume pots something or other, stutter mumble

and though its not the lowest impedance signal (i assume, i guess i do not know how that works in this setup) it would seem that you could be allowed some cable noise reduction, whether or not its low impedance enough to run long cables..

anyway.. something i have been thinking about lately, and perhaps the idea would appeal to you!

edit:

Hell, you could even use each lead to run through a whole different 'parallel effects' setup.. i.e. use the '2 copies' of the signal for .. well for whatever you wanted
 
ONE question, though I am on page 5, or so, at 20 posts per page!

Regarding the Jazz placement... while youre there (though I assume you are not, by now, with so many pages ahead of me ;) ) I would LOVE to hear the 'other' 4-jazz orientation, for one reason-

I do not 'have time' for ridiculous stereo-singlestring-solo-tapping processing or anything, I just like the idea of the singular pickup having so much breadth-of-harmonics.

Uh .... "ridiculous stereo-singlestring-solo-tapping processing" ... yea ... um, what?

If at this point you still have the washtub routing sitting around, and felt like taking a special request, I would be beyond happy to hear even a one string, one octave scale with one 'horizontal j' under it
Well, I don't know why I wouldn't still have the bathtub cavity, I mean it's not like it can grow shut or whatever. :D

As far as "horizontal" placement, is it safe to assume you mean placing a pickup parallel to a single string? This notion isn't really a very good one, the extreme magnetic pull on the string will totally kill any sustain. The string will not be allowed to maintane an orbit for very long, and the orbit will also be very small and short lived due to the strong magnetic pull exerted by the magnet(s) being parallel to the string. The idea has been discussed any number of times in a number of threads and posts here in Talk Bass. I may give it a whack just to solidify any opinions about that method's validity or poor application.

edit: regarding the 'ridiculous processing' i was referring to that style of playing; I am VERY interested in YOUR ridiculous processing in terms of conceptual aesthetic, savvy, and diligent attention to endgoals.. I lack the latter often
This went right over my head. To be honest I don't know whether to be insulted or feel complimented. I'm not sure what you mean by "ridiculous processing" as a "style of playing".

Im happy thinking about it even if you are too busy ;) I need a new project
I would ALSO accept a 'horizontal' P-bass pickup on two strings :p

the modular rig thread, and now this thread, are truly INSPIRING ME

I am a neophyte in the effects/electronics realm, but i am clever, and my inexperience combined with my particular ways of thinking make me see things a really functional-but-unusual way, and in this vain, you are my HERO
Thank you very much. All I try to do is share my ideas and thoughts with the hope of helping others move forward with their own ideas. I'm also very open to things that contradict pre-conceived ideas and conventional methods. Just because certain things are not on the normally beaten path does not mean they are bad or unusable. Within the same philosophy but said another way, just because something is "popular" does not necessarily mean it is good.

I used to apologize for my "long windedness" but any more I figure that the English language is a wonderful tool for communicating detailed and complex ideas and thoughts. The way I see it, "Twitteritus" makes peoples' brains shrink and is only serving to make people think smaller. Just like eating less as a practice makes one's stomach shrink (and therefore has a lower capacity), limiting one's thoughts to 140 characters or less makes the mind shrink. And if some folks find spending 5 minutes to read a post to be just too much to bare, there are plenty of 6 word posts no more than a mouse click or two away in forum.

I have some ideas i'd love to spitball with you sometime, so I can figure out what I am talking about ;) I really 'get' what you see in all of this, and I appreciate your voluntary, and well-crafted long-windedness; it is a quality and skill I do not see enough of


I'll catch up in a few pages, on both threads

cheers
Again, thank you.
 
hm! another thought!
have you considered using the pickups 'naturally balanced' state?
I realize that there is a volume on each pickup there, but I.. well.. I am already COVERED in footswitches and Exp Pedal arrays, so I see an easy solution to that.

By naturally balanced, i mean this:
(and you will be well served to research this, because im a little dumb )
Rather than referencing 'one side' of a pickup to ground, I believe you can tie it to the jack as a 'negative' as in a TRS or XLR setup. From what i understand, you can use this as a balanced signal, use a balanced input (i think those ARTS have that.. I have a couple mic preamps around and most of them can take a TRS balanced-in)

It is hard for me to say if this is productive or counter-so to your means, but theres something nice-sounding about the idea, in a zealous 'sooper pure tone' kind-of-way.. grumble grumble.. loading, erm.. volume pots something or other, stutter mumble

and though its not the lowest impedance signal (i assume, i guess i do not know how that works in this setup) it would seem that you could be allowed some cable noise reduction, whether or not its low impedance enough to run long cables..

anyway.. something i have been thinking about lately, and perhaps the idea would appeal to you!

edit:

Hell, you could even use each lead to run through a whole different 'parallel effects' setup.. i.e. use the '2 copies' of the signal for .. well for whatever you wanted
I think you'd be far better off using a balanced DI for that. To make a truly balanced line you are best served by using a coupling transformer to isolate the source (the pickup). Besides the bass still needs to be grounded. SO if you're intent on doing something along those lines, in my own opinion you'd be best off installing a DI in the bass itself. You also must provide a proper load on each pickup, the impedance that each pickup "sees" is very important to getting the broadest bandwidth out of the pickups. Usually about 1megohm is the faved norm by most passive pickups.

I'd suggest setting up a bass in the same manner I have set the X-Bass up in, so that you may do whatever you wish with the pickup wires to perform a nearly unlimited number of wiring tests. That would most likely be the best way to learn about how the pickups (and sound) is affected by various wiring schemes.

Hopefully I'll be covering most of the ideas that the majority of interested members have regarding different pickup wiring schemes in these X-Bass tests. I'll do what I can. :)
 
Hey folks, I thought I'd check in. I've been going through some very serious health issues that have had me in and out of the hospital since basically September of 2013. The last little stay was for an entire week in February.

I'm on the road upward though, things are looking better, my health is improving. I hope to be back at my full pissed-off arrogant over-confident self soon, and I FULLY INTEND on resuming this project. I worked far too hard on it to just drop this.

Anyhow, thanks for hanging in there with me. I need to focus on my health for the moment, but as soon as I am able I will be back at it again full speed ahead.

Be well, Fluxolio.