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Double Bass 2022 Spirocore Challenge

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#521
So I’ve been thumping on the 3/4 weich set with great results.

However due to a slight decrease in upright gigs (and subsequent uptick in electric bass gigs), I’ve been feeling twinges of the dreaded “tennis” elbow - so I decided to lighten up a bit and threw on the 4/4 weich D&G over 3/4 E&A.

So far so good, not a huge difference in volume.

I do have a nice gig Friday and a practice day tomorrow so I’ll report back with any revelations or regrets.
 
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#522
Jason Hollar said:
So I’ve been thumping on the 3/4 weich set with great results.

However due to a slight decrease in upright gigs (and subsequent uptick in electric bass gigs), I’ve been feeling twinges of the dreaded “tennis” elbow - so I decided to lighten up a bit and threw on the 4/4 weich D&G over 3/4 E&A.

So far so good, not a huge difference in volume.

I do have a nice gig Friday and a practice day tomorrow so I’ll report back with any revelations or regrets.
Click to expand...
I've been debating giving weichs a try, having only tried 4/4 mittels so far. Seems like the 3/4 weichs are awfully close to the 4/4 mittels in diameter and tension, so I look forward to your comments on the mixed weich grades.

Are you keeping your string heights the same with this switch? I worry a bit about the 4/4 weich G being too skinny on the LH fingers, as I can't really go lower than 7 mm on my G due to a fingerboard scoop issue. Admittedly, my luthier quoted the fingerboard work as cheaper than a set of strings... But this is the strings forum!
 
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#526
I just got my first ever set of TI Spiro Vikes. I put them on my Czech flatback. Large sound. I have two gigs Saturday, so maybe the bass will "get the call" for one or both gigs... I ordered those strings from Thomann in Germany; shipped to USA <$168 total cost. Ordered last Thursday, arrived Tuesday before lunch, on bass Tuesday by dinner! I'll do biz with them again.
 
#528
Reasonably satisfied with my Super Flexes but I think I’m on the hunt for a Mitt E. Or I could go full set but I’m both poor and cheap. Oh ghosts of spiro past/present/future, why do you haunt me so?
 
#529
Still going in October. The key for me was getting the gauge right for my bass. They're working out quite well.

IMG_20221005_111007623~2.jpg
 
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#530
I got back from 5 weeks overseas (managed to see a solo improvised show from the amazing Dion Nijland at the Bimhuis in Amsterdam) and for ***** and giggles put the belcanto G back on. It didn’t last long and the weich went back on. I actually found it harder to start under the bow and I think my old French bass is quite dark so the brighter spiro seems to be a better fit. So for now the weichs are a still a stayer…
 
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#532
I don’t think the longer silk has much influence. The mass is small against the metal below, but the longer stretched windings below can have an influence on pitch. But every string of the same type can vary in that.

The spacers shorten the vibrational length of the underlength for these strings, but also lower the tailpiece a bit, so that the vibrating part of the E underlength stops at the tailpiece hole and gets a bit more distance to vibrate.
It does not have a large influence on the G underlength.
Of course, the shortened vibrational underlengths have a higher pitch then.
The pitch of the underlengths of theE and the G might drop a bit.

But you are right that only Troy can give an authoritative answer to your question.
 
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#533
DoubleMIDI said:
I don’t think the longer silk has much influence. The mass is small against the metal below, but the longer stretched windings below can have an influence on pitch. But every string of the same type can vary in that.

The spacers shorten the vibrational length of the underlength for these strings, but also lower the tailpiece a bit, so that the vibrating part of the E underlength stops at the tailpiece hole and gets a bit more distance to vibrate.
It does not have a large influence on the G underlength.
Of course, the shortened vibrational underlengths have a higher pitch then.
The pitch of the underlengths of theE and the G might drop a bit.

But you are right that only Troy can give an authoritative answer to your question.
Click to expand...
Is this only done to get rid of wolf tones? What are the other reasons one might try to tune the after lengths like this? And is it something that players actually do, or something that needs to be done by a luthier?

I'm imagining going into the luthier and saying,"Hey, can you tune my after lengths? I saw it on TalkBass." I'm sure they wouldn't mind getting the boat payment (as the Car Talk guys would say).
 
#534
bassically_eli said:
Is this only done to get rid of wolf tones? What are the other reasons one might try to tune the after lengths like this? And is it something that players actually do, or something that needs to be done by a luthier?

I'm imagining going into the luthier and saying,"Hey, can you tune my after lengths? I saw it on TalkBass." I'm sure they wouldn't mind getting the boat payment (as the Car Talk guys would say).
Click to expand...
I'm also curious about this @DoubleMIDI @TroyK ... I have a wolf at G#, strongest on the A string but noticable on all four to some degree. If I can just slap a little piece of wood under a string or two and move the wolf, that would be neat. Though I suppose there aren't really any better notes for it to move to. Deep thoughts...

To keep it on topic, I'll say that the wolf was less noticable overall (and not noticable at all on the top two strings) when I had the Obligato GD on there, or the Helicore Orchestra set before that. I attribute this to the full Spiro set having no damping.

I'll also add in that I'm still going strong with the full S42 set. I'm noticing that my right hand is finally starting to find it's position to get whatever kind of attack I want, without having to think about it or spend time dialing it in. That has been unconscious for me on bass guitar for years, but not on double bass until recently.
 
#535
Don Hergert said:
Troy, I just noticed that the silk on your G goes nearly up to the bridge. What are your tone observations about this?

Also, what do the spacers under the A and D strings on your tailpiece do for you?
Click to expand...

The silk is longer on the G because it is an S42 Mittel, whereas the other strings are 3885 Weich. I agree with @DoubleMIDI in that I don't think the silk makes any difference, it's just how it is.

The little pieces of wood are temporary stops that shorten those afterlengths to make them sharper. The notes of my afterlengths are A, D , G, C, some number of octaves + an 11th above the open string. When they are dialed in, no wolfe tones, strings vibrate freely, bass speaks better, lots of wood and body presence and I have a full, luxurious head of hair. It works, it's real...okay, not the hair part. I can tell when they go out of phase, usually when the season changes.

I could possibly have also tuned them by raising or lowering the bridge and sometimes I have "fixed" it by changing a single string to one from a different set. I'm not the ultimate authority on this, but I've been a convert for about 15 years, when Jake set me up. Whenever, I get my bass to him again, if the weather hasn't brought it perfectly back to form he would lengthen or shorten the tailpiece wire until it was perfect again.

There is A LOT more to this if you really want to get into it, but I'll stop unless you ask. Not everyone is a believer and I don't want to hijack.
 
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#536
Thank you Troy, DoubMin and others...

I'll add this and then also slink away...

In the darkest corners of the banjo world where I've spent most of my musical life there are whispers of rumors of myths pertaining to superstitionns about banjo head tuning and wolf tones...

Most of the ancient cultists with any serious experience in this area will say you cannot eliminate wolf tones, they are part of the acoustical geometry of a musical instrument, and you really don't want to mute them because then, as is the case with banjos, they will be quieter, which of course no one wants.

The secret is that you really want to tune wolf tones so they make a positive contribution to volume. On banjos, head tension can be adjusted for this. Most people who adjust banjo head tension are oblivious of this, but when a banjo head reaches an optimal tension, usually around the moment when it bursts, the wolf tones are tuned to common notes within the keys that are most often played, so they contribute to the overall volume and of course everyone is happy.

I do suspect there is a corellary to this with wooden instruments that frequently involves scalloping or otherwise thinning braces, but this affect also may be more easily attainable by adding mass in certain areas, such as tailpieces, bridges, soundposts and pegheads.

... That is, if a person believes in that kind of thing.
 
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#537
Okay, first impure thoughts this week. Considering it is essentially November, I'm going to make it, but...

Suddenly D and G are nasal-y. They haven't been and I'm sure it's the change in weather, but I would sure love to throw a Flexocore G or something on there. I may stick the 3885W G string back on there and see if it's happier.
 
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#539
TroyK said:
Okay, first impure thoughts this week. Considering it is essentially November, I'm going to make it, but...

Suddenly D and G are nasal-y. They haven't been and I'm sure it's the change in weather, but I would sure love to throw a Flexocore G or something on there. I may stick the 3885W G string back on there and see if it's happier.
Click to expand...
How much does the humidity change in the NW? I hate the dryness here in winter. Especially with forced air heating.
 
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