410UL Series I vs. II A/B comparison

[MacGroove]

I think you might be confused. I already have a great power amp. That's WHY I want the preamp out on my LMII!

I know what you were saying Vic but since there's so much talk about the 2 ohm load, I just feel that those who want the ability to go 2 ohms should just invest in a power amp that's safe to run that way.

I didn't notice on Mark's web site that the LMII has a pre amp out. The Epi UL502 has one. It'd have been great for you if the LMII did, problem solved.

 

[jmain]

I know what you were saying Vic but since there's so much talk about the 2 ohm load, I just feel that those who want the ability to go 2 ohms should just invest in a power amp that's safe to run that way.

I didn't notice on Mark's web site that the LMII has a pre amp out. The Epi UL502 has one. It'd have been great for you if the LMII did, problem solved.

I find myself on the edge of this issue too. I just got a 4-ohm 4x10 that should be enough for the majority of bigger gigs. I'm considering a stereo pwr amp so I can add my 8 ohm 1x12 on top (and more if needed). I think the LMII may push a QSC PLX2402 just based on raw numbers - using the DI - but that's not ideal and I'm not sure it would work. The pwr/pre setup is new to me.

 

[MacGroove]

I find myself on the edge of this issue too. I just got a 4-ohm 4x10 that should be enough for the majority of bigger gigs. I'm considering a stereo pwr amp so I can add my 8 ohm 1x12 on top (and more if needed). I think the LMII may push a QSC PLX2402 just based on raw numbers - using the DI - but that's not ideal and I'm not sure it would work. The pwr/pre setup is new to me.

For this very reason I got the UL902C for use of mulitple cabs at the rating or different ratings. I don't have the need to go to 2 ohms although I once did many years ago when I had 2-4 ohms Epi cabs (T210 and T212).

 

[jmain]

For this very reason I got the UL902C for use of mulitple cabs at the rating or different ratings. I don't have the need to go to 2 ohms although I once did many years ago when I had 2-4 ohms Epi cabs (T210 and T212).

I'll probably wait to see if I truly need to run more than the 4x10 at 4 ohms. But I hate to be caught w/out the right gear for the job.

Heck, I'm looking at a wireless to get out from in front of the cab right now anyway (even with earplugs), so it may be a moot point.

 

[MacGroove]

I'll probably wait to see if I truly need to run more than the 4x10 at 4 ohms. But I hate to be caught w/out the right gear for the job.

Heck, I'm looking at a wireless to get out from in front of the cab right now anyway (even with earplugs), so it may be a moot point.

I have yet to need anymore than a UL410, of which I just recently got the Series 2 now. I only got the 902C for the added head room (which really makes the 410 more efficient IMO) and that someday I'll add my 2-PS112's to the mix.

As Ken and I always say, the UL410 is the 'do it all cab'.

 

[jmain]

I have yet to need anymore than a UL410, of which I just recently got the Series 2 now. I only got the 902C for the added head room (which really makes the 410 more efficient IMO) and that someday I'll add my 2-PS112's to the mix.

As Ken and I always say, the UL410 is the 'do it all cab'.

Right on.

 

[Vic]

I didn't notice on Mark's web site that the LMII has a pre amp out.

I'm assuming you have a typo here. It does NOT have a preamp out, hence my "compaint".

The Epi UL502 has one. It'd have been great for you if the LMII did, problem solved.

I have other options for preamps... TFB, Eden, and even an older (but pretty darn good sounding) Carvin RSP (yeah, the one with the real tube in it). Also, I had the Quest II preamp for a while, didn't like it at all, which is why the UL502 (or 902c for that matter) are not options for me.

Again, all I need is a preamp output on the LMII, or even more gain supported on the DI (like on the SA450), and I'd be happy.

 

[Chef]

I wonder, could you add one?

 

[MacGroove]

I'm assuming you have a typo here. It does NOT have a preamp out, hence my "compaint".

I have other options for preamps... TFB, Eden, and even an older (but pretty darn good sounding) Carvin RSP (yeah, the one with the real tube in it). Also, I had the Quest II preamp for a while, didn't like it at all, which is why the UL502 (or 902c for that matter) are not options for me.

Again, all I need is a preamp output on the LMII, or even more gain supported on the DI (like on the SA450), and I'd be happy.

Yup, I'll blame it on the typo.

My apologies, didn't know your feelings about the Quest II pre.
I'll just but out and keep my mouth (fingers) shut (doing the talking).

 

[Vic]

Yup, I'll blame it on the typo.

I HATE when that happens!

My apologies, didn't know your feelings about the Quest II pre.
I'll just but out and keep my mouth (fingers) shut (doing the talking).

Seriously tho, please don't. You had no way of knowing I didn't like that preamp... it was a perfectly fine response. My intent was only to reply, not to stifle... really...

 

[Vic]

I wonder, could you add one?

Possibly... I've looked at the PCB and the block diagram and figured I could probably find the point to tap, but it'd definitely void any warranty if I did, and I'm not sure I want to do that... at least not yet...

 

[MacGroove]

I HATE when that happens!


Seriously tho, please don't. You had no way of knowing I didn't like that preamp... it was a perfectly fine response. My intent was only to reply, not to stifle... really...

Thanks Vic, I can finally relax and breath naturally again.

I like the way you can divide the quotes into separate parts and you do it also with putting several post quotes and responsed in one post. I'm not sucking up, just I got to learn how to do that someday.

 

[Vic]

...I got to learn how to do that someday.

It's not hard... I'm sure you'll figure it out pretty quickly... otherwise, PM me and I'll just tell you.

 

[figuredbass]

By this you mean the S2 sounds louder to you than the S1? If so, with my UL310's, I've had opposite results... mainly due to that mid peak on the S1's.

Vic, I agree with you. I just auditioned my series 1 UL310 against the series 2 side by side with the same amp and settings and had the same results you did. My first impression of the Series 2 was "where's the beef?" The series 1 is clearly more authoritative, almost saying, "Here I am!" while still retaining the original sound of my bass. The Series 2 sounded good, but polite and a bit plain, yet the Eminence neo drivers also sound closer to a conventional (non-neo, ceramic) speaker than the B&C neo's in the series 1.

 

[KJung]

Vic, I agree with you. I just auditioned my series 1 UL310 against the series 2 side by side with the same amp and settings and had the same results you did. My first impression of the Series 2 was "where's the beef?" The series 1 is clearly more authoritative, almost saying, "Here I am!" while still retaining the original sound of my bass. The Series 2 sounded good, but polite and a bit plain, yet the Eminence neo drivers also sound closer to a conventional (non-neo, ceramic) speaker than the B&C neo's in the series 1.

That's a good way to put it.... I called the S2 410UL more 'polite' in my review above (although I like the tone of the S2410UL MUCH better than the S2310UL I heard) I also agree that the S2410UL has very little of what some people describe as the 'neo' sound (i.e., pronounced mids). I, quite frankly, like that 'S1' punch, and while it doesn't sound as good played solo in the basement, it seems to really work on the gig.

That being said, the 410UL S2, with its more 'ordinary' voicing, seems to finally IMO eliminate any need to talk about 'neo' speakers. In other words, it sounds like a very good, standard 410 (to your point). No need to haul around the 90 pounders any more... none whatsoever

 

[alexclaber]

That being said, the 410UL S2, with its more 'ordinary' voicing, seems to finally IMO eliminate any need to talk about 'neo' speakers. In other words, it sounds like a very good, standard 410 (to your point).

At last!

Alex

 

[tombowlus]

That being said, the 410UL S2, with its more 'ordinary' voicing, seems to finally IMO eliminate any need to talk about 'neo' speakers. In other words, it sounds like a very good, standard 410 (to your point). No need to haul around the 90 pounders any more... none whatsoever

I am not surprised that you have reached this conclusion. For my part, I am not there yet.

Tom.

 

[tallboybass]

It would be the mighty Carvin B1500 for you... not expensive, three space but not that heavy, and enough power to drive that rig.

I guess some of you guys just play really loud. I thought I played pretty loud (many large groups and large rooms without PA support). I've never, ever, ever run out of room with 700+ watts going into a good 410 like the 410UL. And, quite frankly, not sure how much more ooomph an 8ohm 210UL will give you in the stack.

Aw man, I've already got 3 amps and have to buy another one?! Really, it's hardly ever that I need more than the 410, but it would be nice to have that flexibility. Believe it or not, when I had the WT800B pushing 1100 watts into the UL410, I had occasions where it was straining. It just seems like adding more speakers has way more effect than adding power IMO.

 

[Turn Em Loose]

I, quite frankly, like that 'S1' punch, and while it doesn't sound as good played solo in the basement, it seems to really work on the gig.

Interesting observation. And well put. Though I don't know yet whether I like the S1 ro S2 UL112 better, the S1 (at least for me, and with the limited time I've had it--all of one week!) seems to have a three dimensional tone to it in a mix.

More gigs and more testing are forthcoming!

 

[Fuzzbass]

That being said, the 410UL S2, with its more 'ordinary' voicing, seems to finally IMO eliminate any need to talk about 'neo' speakers. In other words, it sounds like a very good, standard 410 (to your point).

Well, to my ears, that would make the difference between the S1 and S2 UL410 a lot more than subtle!

In other words, it sounds like a very good, standard 410 (to your point). No need to haul around the 90 pounders any more... none whatsoever

Well, even "standard" 410 cabs can have significantly different voicings. It's still likely that someone will prefer Eden or Ampeg or whatever to Epifani.

No need to haul around the 90 pounders any more... none whatsoever

My solution to the 85 pound 4x10 will likely be a pair of 50 pound 2x10 cabs. I'm going to hear DooWop's HS210 cabs this evening.