- Apr 3, 2003
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- Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
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410UL Series I vs. II A/B comparison
- Thread starter KJung
- Start date
Fixed it for ya, Ken.
Fair enough... just never have run across this. If I wasn't such a gear head who talks to so many 'non TBer's every day, I wouldn't be quite so opinionated on this!
Again... not saying the need is not legitimate, just trying to explain why Nick and Dave aren't bothering with it
- Apr 3, 2003
- 35,518
- 19,954
- Disclosures
- Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
Again... not saying the need is not legitimate, just trying to explain why Nick and Dave aren't bothering with it
Well, as I see it, there is no need to explain anything. They each make a product that they believe in, and that should be good enough. Again, we as bass players are fortunate to have many great options to choose from.
Tom.
Why, you ask, did I order two 4 ohm cabs from Epifani when my Eden WT-400 only goes down to 4 ohms? (You didn't ask, but I'm gonna tell you anyhow). My other two cabs are 4 ohm, as well.
It was a long-range modular approach. I anticipated that for a few years one cab at a time would suffice at any gig I played at. This would give me a variety of cabs that were capable of drawing maximum watts out of my head. Eventually, I would buy an additional amp capable of driving two cabs at once. Not a necessity, as KJung has indirectly pointed out, but still an option I would like to have. I include myself in the group of folks who would prefer not to run below 4 ohms for the reason others have stated.
Almost forgot...YMMV. Doesn't it always?
M. M.
It was a long-range modular approach. I anticipated that for a few years one cab at a time would suffice at any gig I played at. This would give me a variety of cabs that were capable of drawing maximum watts out of my head. Eventually, I would buy an additional amp capable of driving two cabs at once. Not a necessity, as KJung has indirectly pointed out, but still an option I would like to have. I include myself in the group of folks who would prefer not to run below 4 ohms for the reason others have stated.
Almost forgot...YMMV. Doesn't it always?
M. M.
+1 also Tom, right now, IMHO, they're still getting started in the amplification world and acquiring to meet the needs of the masses.
This just means the amp wasn't truly designed for 2 ohm operation, and if that's the case, it should be listed as a protection feature, not a supported load. Truth in ratings... that's all I ask... is it too much?
As a side note, admittedly it's a different amp, but I don't notice anything wrong when running my WT-405 at 2 ohms, and I've done it a lot lately.
Yeah, I know about the preamp, and I'm not sure it fits me. I'm not sure what's up with all the distortion settings... I'd NEVER use that. All I want is a blasted preamp out on my LMII... and that's ALL (...and this chair, and this remote...
). I love the tone from the MB preamp I already own... it's just that it's not designed for me to tap that for a more powerful config. I also already have a power amp I'm very happy with. 
- Mar 11, 2005
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- Employee - Basscentre Melbourne
Man, I had an opportunity to hear the HS410 and HS210 at Bass Emporium last Friday.
And thanks for the great review, Ken! Now, I am dying to hear the HS410 and UL410 Series 2 side by side!
I'm looking forward to hearing the HS410 also... I bet it sounds great. Assuming you get one
Can't wait to hear the results!
Definitely the minority, but not insignificant. I'm not the only bassist I know who uses a 4 ohm cab for average gigs and augments it with an 8 ohm cab (the modular 6x10 we've discussed) for big gigs. The difference in volume is more than just two tens... it's also the fact that those tens are closer to ear level.
Hey fuzzbass, you and me, man, you and me... we'll grab a beer and cry in it for a while, then we'll get stoopid drunk and bash on all the lame amp vendors that don't support sub-4 ohm loads... you and me, bud...
Hey fuzzbass, you and me, man, you and me... we'll grab a beer and cry in it for a while, then we'll get stoopid drunk and bash on all the lame amp vendors that don't support sub-4 ohm loads... you and me, bud...
Count me in this group
.All my cabs are 4ohms and its one reason I have a db750, and a CA9. I have a LMKII as well and one reason I think I'll pass on a sd800 is that it wont do 2ohms, I would be better off using the LMK into a power amp or wait for a markbass preamp.
KJung,
nice review btw.
Thanks! Vic and I had a fun PM discussion of the 2ohm thing. Again, having two 4ohm cabs with a 'stereo' rig is very common, and a different issue (many of us, including me, ran two 4 ohm Eden cabs with a non-bridged WT800... that was the standard back in the day and not really what we are talking about!).
I guess where we came out on this is that there are costs involved in creating an amp that is truly designed to run not only safely but totally 'in spec' at 2ohms. If this could be accomplished without a lot of extra cost, of course, there is no downside.
On my side of the discussion, it seems that most all-in-one bass heads today that are 'safe' to run at 2ohms are not totally designed to do so (i.e., many heads have that maddening statement in the manual basically saying 'you can run 2ohms... or 4 bridged... but we don't recommend it). So, I guess my point is that you should not build a rig 'on purpose' to run regularly at 2ohms IMO, at least in this day and age (or somehow make sure the amp truly is designed to run 'within spec' at 2ohms over extended periods). Much better to get a 'stereo' power amp, as many do, if you have two 4ohm cabs.
That all being said, if it sounds good and doesn't blow up... rock on
Interesting discussion
+1 on everything except to add the following regarding this comment...
I'm guessing the vast majority of us that have sub-4 ohm loads (which is not the vast majority
) didn't originally architect it that way, but instead, just sorta' ended up there as we get stuff and add stuff, so I don't think most folks would ever originally design a rig for 2 ohms, but since enough of us end up there through completely understandable and innocent circumstances, it'd SURE BE NICE if there were a decent selection of amps out there that could truly handle our situation with no penalty.Given today's technology, I have to believe it's not cost prohibitive, but instead just a matter of typical convention, and companies doing what they should do, which is serve the biggest slice... the most typical case... which doesn't include us "sub-4 ohm folks". I understand and accept this, but I also lament it, knowing there's no strictly technical reason why such an amp couldn't exist at a resonable price.
I should add one more thing...
The ONLY reason it's even an issue is because it's so very "expensive" for anyone to exchange cabs due to shipping and low resale value. If reselling and repurchasing cabs wasn't so very expensive and difficult for most of us to do, this would be TOTALLY moot.
Chef
In Memoriam
Thread swerve:
Hey Vic, I wear your shoes. I have a herd of cabs, all 4 ohms.
The several solutions I've come to to driving multiples are all variations on a theme.
WT800B, one cab per side.
Navigator+qsc/plx1602: one cab per side.
Aguilar DB680+ qsc/plx 2402: one cab per side.
Mesa 400+ is two ohm ready, as is the walkabout scout and some other mesa product.
The qsc/plx will run 2 ohms per side, allowing you to run *four* 4 ohm cabs.
back to your regularly scheduled thread.
Hey Vic, I wear your shoes. I have a herd of cabs, all 4 ohms.
The several solutions I've come to to driving multiples are all variations on a theme.
WT800B, one cab per side.
Navigator+qsc/plx1602: one cab per side.
Aguilar DB680+ qsc/plx 2402: one cab per side.
Mesa 400+ is two ohm ready, as is the walkabout scout and some other mesa product.
The qsc/plx will run 2 ohms per side, allowing you to run *four* 4 ohm cabs.
back to your regularly scheduled thread.
All I want is a blasted preamp out on my LMII... and that's ALL (...and this chair, and this remote...
You sure you don't want to throw in the kitchen sink too.
If any of you plan on using a 2 ohm load, I'd recommend getting a separate power amp. They're many good ones out there that have been tried, tested and true for a safe and solid running time as I'm sure many of you already know about.
I think you might be confused. I already have a great power amp. That's WHY I want the preamp out on my LMII!If any of you plan on using a 2 ohm load, I'd recommend getting a separate power amp. They're many good ones out there that have been tried, tested and true for a safe and solid running time as I'm sure many of you already know about.
