active > passive

[Sam Dingle]

Then it's user error, I'm sorry

oh 100%

 

[40Hz]

If you’re like me, then honesty in music means something...and (for me) passive basses just feel more open/honest/pure... besides if I need/want graphic EQ, I can just reach for my amp.

I don't get that at all. There’s just as much technology involved in a passive bass as there is an active one. Possibly even more since it doesn’t have the relative ease of more modern electronics circuits (note: transducers, inductors, filters, mag pickups, etc. are all old tech dating back to the first decade of the 1900s) to compensate for any of its shortcomings.

So exotic magnets and string alloy formulations and so on are the norm. Even the wood is sourced from places all over the world, kiln dried under carefully regulated conditions by industrial machiney, tooled with computer controlled milling machines…it goes on and on. There’s nothing “natural” about a bass guitar. It’s a human invention that’s been refined and improved over the little under a hundred or so years it’s existed. They aren’t grown or harvested. They need to be built. Every stage has been crafted with the intent to produce a specific result. And there’s no “honesty” in a physical artifact. Honesty is a human attribute.

Any honesty, magic, or romance surrounding a musical instrument all come from the player. Without the player a bass is just an assemblage of woods, wires, plastics, and metals. So while there can be something you could call “honestly in music,” I think its really all the result of a commitment on the part of the player. and has nothing to do with the instrument any more than “an honest piece of art” can be attributed to the tools used to produce it.

You can be “honest” and “organic” and “pure” with an active bass just as readily as you can be with a passive or acoustic instrument. Because these things are just tools. They’re not the artist’s vision, intent, or execution.

To my mind, the only genuinely honest or true instrument we can possibly play is our own individual voices.

 

[Koshchei]

hi top guys, i am lurking for a very long time, and now i will post something.
i do not understand why to go for a passive bass today if you can have active and bypass to passive if that is better at the time. not so much more expensive and gives you something back. it seems the correct thing to do for a bass today. why passive??

1) Passive basses sound different than active basses that are in “passive mode”. In active basses, the pickups are usually lower impedance and are voiced flat, so that the preamp can do the tonal colouring. Passive pickups are high impedance and voiced to colour the tone quite aggressively, as they only have passive “cut” controls.
2) Not everybody is ok with dumping used batteries into landfill. Only a small number of municipalities actually recycle them.

TL;DR If you want a passive bass, play a passive bass. An active with the preamp disabled is a compromise.

 

[Killed_by_Death]

pull/push knob to allow a passive preamp

Passive tones controls are not the same as a pre-amp, pre-amps are active.
Maybe one of your basses has active pickups & the push/pull is just a pre-amp bypass:

myth busting - just because your bass has a battery, doesn't mean the pickups are active

It's relatively easy to see if the pickups are active once you get the controls-cavity open.

 

[punchdrunk]

I don't get that at all. There’s just as much technology involved in a passive bass as there is an active one. Possibly even more since it doesn’t have the relative ease of more modern electronics circuits (note: transducers, inductors, filters, mag pickups, etc. are all old tech dating back to the first decade of the 1900s) to compensate for any of its shortcomings.

So exotic magnets and string alloy formulations and so on are the norm. Even the wood is sourced from places all over the world, kiln dried under carefully regulated conditions by industrial machiney, tooled with computer controlled milling machines…it goes on and on. There’s nothing “natural” about a bass guitar. It’s a human invention that’s been refined and improved over the little under a hundred or so years it’s existed. They aren’t grown or harvested. They need to be built. Every stage has been crafted with the intent to produce a specific result. And there’s no “honesty” in a physical artifact. Honesty is a human attribute.

Any honesty, magic, or romance surrounding a musical instrument all come from the player. Without the player a bass is just an assemblage of woods, wires, plastics, and metals. So while there can be something you could call “honestly in music,” I think its really all the result of a commitment on the part of the player. and has nothing to do with the instrument any more than “an honest piece of art” can be attributed to the tools used to produce it.

You can be “honest” and “organic” and “pure” with an active bass just as readily as you can be with a passive or acoustic instrument. Because these things are just tools. They’re not the artist’s vision, intent, or execution.

To my mind, the only genuinely honest or true instrument we can possibly play is our own individual voices.

I had to take a lunch break to read this....and while I agree with your sentiment to an extent I’ll point out that the operative word in my original post was “feels”... as in it feels more open. It’s no upright, but the signal seems to have opened up quite nicely for me each time I’ve modded a bass from active to passive.

 

[lermgalieu]

I don't get that at all. There’s just as much technology involved in a passive bass as there is an active one. Possibly even more since it doesn’t have the relative ease of more modern electronics circuits (note: transducers, inductors, filters, mag pickups, etc. are all old tech dating back to the first decade of the 1900s) to compensate for any of its shortcomings.

So exotic magnets and string alloy formulations and so on are the norm. Even the wood is sourced from places all over the world, kiln dried under carefully regulated conditions by industrial machiney, tooled with computer controlled milling machines…it goes on and on. There’s nothing “natural” about a bass guitar. It’s a human invention that’s been refined and improved over the little under a hundred or so years it’s existed. They aren’t grown or harvested. They need to be built. Every stage has been crafted with the intent to produce a specific result. And there’s no “honesty” in a physical artifact. Honesty is a human attribute.

Any honesty, magic, or romance surrounding a musical instrument all come from the player. Without the player a bass is just an assemblage of woods, wires, plastics, and metals. So while there can be something you could call “honestly in music,” I think its really all the result of a commitment on the part of the player. and has nothing to do with the instrument any more than “an honest piece of art” can be attributed to the tools used to produce it.

You can be “honest” and “organic” and “pure” with an active bass just as readily as you can be with a passive or acoustic instrument. Because these things are just tools. They’re not the artist’s vision, intent, or execution.

To my mind, the only genuinely honest or true instrument we can possibly play is our own individual voices.

Respectfully, he said it "feels" that way. To him. And he didn't mention magic and romance. And maybe part of it is that passive bass sounds often sit well in a mix and don't have a lot going on in the non-bass registers and is associated with a lot of music forms from back in the day where musicians all sat in a room together and played as a band. I get the point, personally. I don't think anyone is saying one or the other IS honest or pure, just that it feels that way. A passive bass feels "right" to me - doesn't mean it IS right (what is "right"?).

 

[CHYC]

Passive tones controls are not the same as a pre-amp, pre-amps are active.

Thanks for the distinction.

Maybe one of your basses has active pickups & the push/pull is just a pre-amp bypass:

I think you're right because the bass stops working when there's no battery pre-amp or not. That one is most definitely active. It's the other one, with seemingly passive pickups and a preamp. Is that an "active" bass in the context of this thread?

 

[40Hz]

I had to take a lunch break to read this....and while I agree with your sentiment to an extent I’ll point out that the operative word in my original post was “feels”... as in it feels more open. It’s no upright, but the signal seems to have opened up quite nicely for me each time I’ve modded a bass from active to passive.

Mea culpa. I missed that. Sometimes I can be a little too literal minded. I also have an unfortunate tendency to wax philosophic when it comes to music. Thanks for not taking my comment as a rebuke. It wasn’t intended to be one. Just me going on and on and hair splitting over words as is my wont.

Hope I didn’t ruin your lunch break.

 

[40Hz]

Respectfully, he said it "feels" that way. To him. And he didn't mention magic and romance. And maybe part of it is that passive bass sounds often sit well in a mix and don't have a lot going on in the non-bass registers and is associated with a lot of music forms from back in the day where musicians all sat in a room together and played as a band. I get the point, personally. I don't think anyone is saying one or the other IS honest or pure, just that it feels that way. A passive bass feels "right" to me - doesn't mean it IS right (what is "right"?).

Already acknowledged my oversight on that point and apologized for being too literal in my previous post to @punchdrunk.

And yes you are correct. I completely missed the “feels” qualification he made. So full acknowledgment of my error and a thank you to you as well for calling me out on it.

 

[Yahboy]

I understand this. But, have you ever played a 5 string passive fan fret with 34"-37" scale? Try it, it is quite wonderful, IMO.

View attachment 3662448

I never play the fanned fret bass you mention, but been own Ibanez SRFF805 and play several time on SRMS805/806 and Cort A5 scms.
The 37 scale Dingwall just feel uncomfortable to me even she has great B.

 

[GIBrat51]

Thanks for the distinction.



I think you're right because the bass stops working when there's no battery pre-amp or not. That one is most definitely active. It's the other one, with seemingly passive pickups and a preamp. Is that an "active" bass in the context of this thread?

If you want to be nit-picky? Probably not. However... in current common usage? Yes, the term "Active bass" refers to both. I have one of each; an Alembic Epic (active or nothing), and a recently acquired G&L CS ASAT Bass (active/passive). I haven't played the Alembic as much as I should; it sounded...nasty... played through my old Marshall combo amp. Unlike every passive bass I own... Different story when it's plugged into this "new-ish" Fender Rumble 500 rig; it's getting a lot more use now. The ASAT, in active mode, sounds very good, too. But, in passive mode? Sounds really good when played through either amp. To be honest, it will probably spend most of it's life in passive mode. I haven't played out in...decades, now; and in my music room, "active" is of no benefit whatsoever. If I want to play the Alembic, though, I have no choice; active or nothing...

 

[lermgalieu]

Already acknowledged my oversight on that point and apologized for being too literal in my previous post to @punchdrunk.

And yes you are correct. I completely missed the “feels” qualification he made. So full acknowledgment of my error and a thank you to you as well for calling me out on it.

Thank you for this response; it is much more graceful and well done than I usually am in this type of situation. Well done, sir.

 

[dabbler]

indeed, it's true, apologies for only reading the first paragraph!
the talk of pushing the signal can be interpreted by some as simply being higher level... which is a common misconception, and it set me off

Understood, "push" probably wasn't the best word to use there... but then I don't have the best words.

 

[punchdrunk]

Mea culpa. I missed that. Sometimes I can be a little too literal minded. I also have an unfortunate tendency to wax philosophic when it comes to music. Thanks for not taking my comment as a rebuke. It wasn’t intended to be one. Just me going on and on and hair splitting over wordsas is my wont.

Hope I didn’t ruin your lunch break.

Thanks for that. Your post certainly read well, and made me think. It made my lunch more enjoyable.

 

[CaptainWally]

I like to use the bypass.

 

[Celen]

I had to take a lunch break to read this....and while I agree with your sentiment to an extent I’ll point out that the operative word in my original post was “feels”... as in it feels more open. It’s no upright, but the signal seems to have opened up quite nicely for me each time I’ve modded a bass from active to passive.

I agree with the "feeling" part, in that a passive bass "feels" more direct. Hard to describe.

Speaking only for myself, I'm sure it's partly psychological - hearing what I expect to hear, like a placebo effect, plus the simpler "user interface" forces me to be present in the music instead of worrying about whether I should reach down and boost the mids a little.

Yes there is still a preamp with EQ at the other end of the cable, and I know that there are awesome on-board preamps out there too... but somehow, with a passive bass I never doubt my tone, I just play.

 

[Dr Zee]

As many here have also stated, I have both types and enjoy them all.
There is one thing that I've done now for a long time. I set the active eq on the bass flat,
then use the amplifiers eq to fit the room, and then I get the tone I want from the bass. I do play in
weird sonic spaces sometimes so this really helps.

 

[/\/\3phist0]

From a line signal point of view, an active bass is just a passive bass with the pre-amp built into the body.

Except, that in "passive mode" it is simply "make a sound" with no tone controls.
The pot values are 25-50k (volume /blend) as opposed to "true" passive which will, depending on tone goals and individual config have 250-500k typical in the circuit , and the tone pot/cap presented as the load the amp"sees" which has a huge impact on the overall tone and dynamics.
an onboard preamp is, in many cases not simply and "outboard" pedal builtbin

 

[juancaminos]

My Hohner headless has a red led light that lets you know when the bass is in active mode. I think it goes off only when you switch it to passive or pull the cord out. Haven't used the bass in a while. However, I'll say this, don't put the light on the front of the bass, it can be pretty distracting lol.

The Yamaha TRBX504/5 does have an led light on the back panel that alerts you when the battery's running low.
View attachment 3662184

Interesting, thanks. I was thinking of just installing a small led somewhere wired to just remind that the bass is plugged in and the system is on. Thanks

 

[/\/\3phist0]

Here's one reason I don't like using an active EQ. If I cut something my signal is going to get too weak. If I boost something it's gonna get too strong. Like how am I supposed to set the input on my compressor with that situation?

Volume knob, roll back if signal 2 hot, roll up if weak. Active volume doesn't change tone (or changes it very little)
Did I miss something ?