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advice for discussing some thoughts with a guitar player

#41
mambo4 said:
I'm kinda in agreement. With no desire to play gigs, the primary justification for trying to sound better (the audience) evaporates.
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I get that, indeed, and I'm not saying it's wrong, but for me--and I doubt whether I'm entirely alone in this, though I may not have a lot of company--if you're not trying to play the music as well as you can reasonably manage, it's NOT a "fun hang." Perhaps especially when no money is involved. I'm not talking about going into Whiplash mode, or trying to impose world tour standards, or rehearsing obsessively, but if musicians don't care about playing decently or getting even just a bit better at something, why bother? That doesn't sound like fun to me (though mileage varies).

And blasting the volume without consideration of others' repeatedly expressed requests is also not a "fun hang." As you point out. IMO it's kind of a d!ck move. That immediately lowers the "fun quotient" for me.
 
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#43
drewphishesp said:
I do enjoy. Look forward to it every week. I just want to have my cake and eat it too. I want to just get better as a musician and a band. None of this I think is intentional it's just kind of what happens
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If those problems you mentioned in the OP don't actually interfere with your enjoyment, then you probably don't have a problem. Or, rather, two problems. If that's the case, it's a good thing. Enjoy and don't stress.
 
#44
mikeoso said:
"How many lead guitarists does it take to change a lightbulb?"
One...he holds the bulb and everything revolves around him.

What happens with some leads is they get so far into pushing themselves they forget about the mix. Top level pros probably can ride with it, but....well, not me anyway.

What I've had success with when someone gets unwrapped in a jam is quit playing. Explain that I couldnt find the ( tempo) (beat) (whatever). No blaming or criticism, just "something isnt working". Let them figure out what and why. Ok, it's kinda passive agressive, but not confrontational.
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This is super useful with sound levels too. I find it really hard to play if I can't hear myself, then on top of that what's the point of playing if you can't hear it; so stop altogether because if the pointlessness. We are a 3-piece, so if it isn't noticeable when 1/3 stops playing...everything is WAYYY too loud. Its always amicable and agreeable in the end, thankfully.
 
#46
drewphishesp said:
its not that I want to gig, but I want to evolve as a band. Its hard to do that when not everyones on the same page
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Yes, but what does that mean? What's the point of trying to excel if there's no solid goal to achieve or land on?

It's like writing (or studying), rehearsing, and critiquing for a theater play or comedy skit that nobody is invited to. You might record yourselves, but if nobody else is going to see it then it's a hard sell to push everyone to their limits. It's also superfluous to expect everyone to nail their lines and characters perfectly if it's not going to be seen. There'd be more wiggle room if these were unpaid charity gigs or backyard concerts for family/friends, but nothing at all? Ehhh...

If you guys wanna get serious or progress, there's gotta be some skin in the game. A possible solution is convincing the others to start gigging, or at least performing in front of other people. If he legit doesn't want to do that or improve his chops to that standard, the problem might take care of itself...saving you the trouble.
 
#48
turf3 said:
I do not agree that you have to be gigging to play well, or to improve.

I have played in very many rehearsal bands that either never performed or rarely did so, and in all cases we tried to play well and to play better each week than the week before.
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Agree, it's how you are motivated. There are plenty of band out there gigging that aren't very good and never get better.
 
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#49
I say, if you want to play in front of other people, buy a full length mirror for your bedroom speakeasy. Works for me.

As far as getting better faster, buy a fretless. Suffer through the bad intonation of the initial period and you will soon get better. Forces improvement to technique, improves ears. Did wonders for me.
 
#51
drewphishesp said:
My main problem is our lead guitar player. Despite our best efforts hes always at 11 by the end of the night. He also seems to get lost in his own jam/solos/ideas and loses direction from the rest of the band at times. As we go from song to song he often misses cues because hes so wrapped up in his own playing.
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It sounds like he should have been in the Grateful Dead
 
#52
drewphishesp said:
SO have been playing with a group of guys for about a year now. We all get along (some of us were friends outside of this before) and it sa good hang and great jam situation. its close to home, dedicated space in the drummers garage and we play music I enjoy. We could easily gig (we sound pretty good) but no one really has a desire much for gigging. More so a weekly jam hang to play and enjoy ourselves. We also record everything via multi track so its something cool to listen to, and use as a tool to improve my playing.
My main problem is our lead guitar player. Despite our best efforts hes always at 11 by the end of the night. He also seems to get lost in his own jam/solos/ideas and loses direction from the rest of the band at times. As we go from song to song he often misses cues because hes so wrapped up in his own playing. He's a friend and I dont want to make it personal, but I think we could get to the next level if we were to listen better to each other (we playly mostly jam band/ jam based music). How Do I bring this up with him without making a rift?
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Why do you want to be polite with this guy and do/say nothing while he scorches your hearing? There's ZERO reason for you to be enduring that B.S. regardless of whether the others are okay with it or not. If it's not okay for you to even say anything, then you're probably dealing with one or more infants and maybe you're stuck in a situation that can leave you tip-toe'ing around in a toxic minefield. I've put up with this sort of thing here and there and it took me too long to realize that it was a major waste of my time and also a little insulting.

Say something. No need to be mean or snarky about it. If guitar hero can't handle it, that's his problem. Few things are as nauseating as having to call out our pals in the grown-up world on their own behavior, but sometimes it's worth it. You might get his attention and snap him out of it. You could even ask everybody about carving out a couple of spots during these jams where it's okay to go on a bit of a walkabout. When everybody gets together, those sessions need to be productive all of you, not just Jack the Sonic Ripper.

I've got a guy in my current band who routinely flirts with getting too loud both at rehearsal and at gigs, but he sometimes listens when I chirp at him to turn down a little bit. He can occasionally be a serious bonehead, but other times it's obvious that he's taken his humble pills and wants to do whatever is going to make everything work better.

And yes, this thread is also convincing me to be more proactive with my own situmahzation... so thanks for the inspiration.

I'd say that square one is along the lines of what our pals above have already recommended. Tell him to put his amp on a stand and point his awesome sound at his own head. That issue of shooting his searing volume past his knees at the rest of you has become a cliche for a reason. Once he's made aware of both the problem and the solution, there's no reason for him not to fix it. You could even go full olive branch and get hit an amp stand for X-mas if he doesn't have one!!

All of you can have fun together without one or two of you wrecking it for everybody else. If you ask him to reign it in a little bit and he ignores you, then I'd say it's time for you to take care of you. Just apologize to everybody, tell them that you're not in the mood, pack up, and leave... in a polite way (see what I did there?). Then they'll understand that they have an issue on their hands. If they don't understand, then that setting just ain't no good for you.
 
#56
If you've already brought it up, then simply stop playing the next time he gets too loud. After everyone else stops, say, "dude - you're too loud again. I'm not going to do this at these volumes."

Then just shut up and see what happens. If he makes any excuses or says anything else that indicates refusal to accept and address the problem, simply repeat "I'm not willing to do this at these volumes." Take you're time and keep you're voice low - You don't need to say ANYTHING else.

And you don't need a band consensus as others have mentioned - Make this only about your personal boundaries, be honest and comfortable in your decision. Otherwise, you're not being the bad guy, you're not making accusations, you're only stating what you're willing and not willing to do.

And yeah - as others have mentioned, this is not a professional setting - demands are low. Which is all the more reason to be comfortable in what you're willing and not willing to to do.
 
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