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AudioKinesis Cabs V!!!!

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#902
engedi1 said:
Do we need something smaller and lighter than the TC112 with all its power?
Click to expand...

Perhaps, I asked Duke once about building. TC 110. He ran the specs and the weight reduction, between the two cabinets wasn't all that significant and the trade off in bass response just didn't justify building one. At the time he wasn't even considering 8". I just wish that he could buy his custom 12's in smaller lots from Eminence. Currently, their minimum order is so high, that small builders just can't afford to purchase that many drivers at one time.


Ric
 
#903
i actually would like something smaller as i want to start taking the metro to gigs.

i was thinking on the hathor as a 110 because then you don't get into the horn, which takes up a lot of real estate, and get into having a 4-inch driver (or whatever) for the mids/highs. so it seems like you'd have more space . . .
 
#906
DukeLeJeune said:
The cabinet has three 3" diameter flared ports in a vertical line on the back of the cab, with the top and bottom port right behind the woofers and the middle port centered between them.
Click to expand...

Hey Duke,

I've seen it mentioned here in various threads that locating ports directly behind a woofer (i.e. Bag End) can be problematic, or at least less than optimal because it lets mids and highs escape through the port... any truth to that, TB folklore, depends....?
 
#907
steubig said:
after the cabpalooza with no static this last weekend is started jonesing for something along the lines of a hathor that's a 1x10 with a 4-inch mid/high driver.

seems like a no-brainer for subway culture . . .

just saying.
Click to expand...

I haven't found a 10" woofer that I really warm up to. The 8" Faital used in the Crazy 8 and Crazy 88 is arguably superior to most 10" woofers, but it's pretty expensive. The Kappalite 3010LF is lower in efficiency and maximum output than the 3012LF, has a ragged response curve that pretty much demands a midrange driver, and both costs and weighs as much as the 3012LF. Greenboy is making a fEARless cab with the 3010, and it's probably heavier and more expensive than the Thunderchild 112.

Since the stock Kappalite 3012LF puts out decent bass in a smaller box, I'm considering doing something more compact than the TC112, but haven't worked out the details yet. It can definitely be done.
 
#908
JGR said:
Hey Duke,

I've seen it mentioned here in various threads that locating ports directly behind a woofer (i.e. Bag End) can be problematic, or at least less than optimal because it lets mids and highs escape through the port... any truth to that, TB folklore, depends....?
Click to expand...

I want the mids to escape from the port! I use a flared port which doesn't impart that harshness to the mids (caused by diffraction) that happens with a sharp-edged port, so what comes out sounds pretty good. In the acoustic-friendly version, those mids combine with the output from the rear-firing tweeter and give you full spectrum sound, albeit at reduced volume, behind the cab. The additional full-spectrum sound to the rear better mimics the behavior of an actual acoustic instrument, and gives your drummer a better chance to hear exactly what you're doing.

With very long-excursion woofers like the Kappalites shoehorned into a small cab, if the port(s) are off to one side of the woofer, you can get cone-rocking sufficient to cause the voice coil to click up against the side of the magnetic gap on some notes. I got that in my prototype, which had both ports up behind the horn, and have heard of it happening with other Kappalite-loaded cabs where the port was off to one side. The port configurations I use offer a more symmetrical airload on the back of the cone, so no problems from cone rocking. Even with one port plugged on the TC112, I still haven't heard of anyone having problems from cone rock, probably because the remaining port isn't too far off to one side.

Finally, having one port below the woofer magnet, and one port above, facilitates cooling. Hot air tends to exit the top port, drawing cooler air into the bottom port.

Credit to Jerry McNutt of Eminence for my port locations on the Thunderchild cab.
 
#909
DukeLeJeune said:
I haven't found a 10" woofer that I really warm up to. The 8" Faital used in the Crazy 8 and Crazy 88 is arguably superior to most 10" woofers, but it's pretty expensive. The Kappalite 3010LF is lower in efficiency and maximum output than the 3012LF, has a ragged response curve that pretty much demands a midrange driver, and both costs and weighs as much as the 3012LF. Greenboy is making a fEARless cab with the 3010, and it's probably heavier and more expensive than the Thunderchild 112.

Since the stock Kappalite 3012LF puts out decent bass in a smaller box, I'm considering doing something more compact than the TC112, but haven't worked out the details yet. It can definitely be done.
Click to expand...

cool. an 8 would be fine. i like what you do is the main message here.

for me it's both weight and size. the weight of the tc112 doesn't seem prohibitive, but walking around a metro platform with it does seem so . . .

anyway, no biggie. still live the tc112.
 
#911
DukeLeJeune said:
I want the mids to escape from the port! I use a flared port which doesn't impart that harshness to the mids (caused by diffraction) that happens with a sharp-edged port, so what comes out sounds pretty good. In the acoustic-friendly version, those mids combine with the output from the rear-firing tweeter and give you full spectrum sound, albeit at reduced volume, behind the cab. The additional full-spectrum sound to the rear better mimics the behavior of an actual acoustic instrument, and gives your drummer a better chance to hear exactly what you're doing.

With very long-excursion woofers like the Kappalites shoehorned into a small cab, if the port(s) are off to one side of the woofer, you can get cone-rocking sufficient to cause the voice coil to click up against the side of the magnetic gap on some notes. I got that in my prototype, which had both ports up behind the horn, and have heard of it happening with other Kappalite-loaded cabs where the port was off to one side. The port configurations I use offer a more symmetrical airload on the back of the cone, so no problems from cone rocking. Even with one port plugged on the TC112, I still haven't heard of anyone having problems from cone rock, probably because the remaining port isn't too far off to one side.

Finally, having one port below the woofer magnet, and one port above, facilitates cooling. Hot air tends to exit the top port, drawing cooler air into the bottom port.

Credit to Jerry McNutt of Eminence for my port locations on the Thunderchild cab.
Click to expand...

Very interesting, great information/explanation, thank you!
 
#912
Mark Sacchetti said:
Duke
Need the measurements on the Hathor so I can have LeCover make the cover for the cab.
Thanks
Click to expand...

Looks like I fumbled my reply to your PM; there's no sign of it in my "sent items" folder.

Dimensions including corners:

Height = 25.5", width = 18.5", depth = 14.5" (includes allowance for woofer grille pooch-outage).

As I recall the handles are centered on the sides, and the outer dimensions of the handles are 6" square, dimensions of handle opening about 4" square.
 
#913
steubig said:
cool. an 8 would be fine. i like what you do is the main message here.

for me it's both weight and size. the weight of the tc112 doesn't seem prohibitive, but walking around a metro platform with it does seem so . . .

anyway, no biggie. still live the tc112.
Click to expand...

If I do a more compact 8-ohm 112 cab, I'll try to make it shallower (more "suitcase shaped") so that it's an easier one-hand carry. Hopefully that will offset the weight somewhat.
 
#914
Not every cabinet need be gig-worthy. It would also be helpful to have a nice, full sounding, light weight, small form factor cabinet for acoustic volume get-togethers. I'd be willing to trade off volume to make that happen.

I find myself considering all sorts of cheap crap for this - and maybe that's the way to go - just thought it would be great if there was a quality cabinet built for this purpose. There may not be enough people besides me that want this to make it a reality - just tossing ideas out there. It's possible that a cheap combo amp is what most are using for this scenario.

I've seen the Crazy 8, and Mike does wonderful work, but invariably the discussion about that cab is for upright bass. The only clips I've heard support that.

The Phil Jones briefcase is also very small but lacking in the bottom end from what I've heard. If I'm settling for significant loss in the lows, there are many much less expensive options to consider - and again, maybe that's where I should be looking. Just adding my thoughts to the conversation.
 
#916
PDGood said:
Not every cabinet need be gig-worthy. It would also be helpful to have a nice, full sounding, light weight, small form factor cabinet for acoustic volume get-togethers. I'd be willing to trade off volume to make that happen.

I find myself considering all sorts of cheap crap for this - and maybe that's the way to go - just thought it would be great if there was a quality cabinet built for this purpose. There may not be enough people besides me that want this to make it a reality - just tossing ideas out there. It's possible that a cheap combo amp is what most are using for this scenario.

I've seen the Crazy 8, and Mike does wonderful work, but invariably the discussion about that cab is for upright bass. The only clips I've heard support that.

The Phil Jones briefcase is also very small but lacking in the bottom end from what I've heard. If I'm settling for significant loss in the lows, there are many much less expensive options to consider - and again, maybe that's where I should be looking. Just adding my thoughts to the conversation.
Click to expand...

I can't imagine a better cab for that purpose than a TC112.
 
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#917
PDGood said:
Not every cabinet need be gig-worthy. It would also be helpful to have a nice, full sounding, light weight, small form factor cabinet for acoustic volume get-togethers. I'd be willing to trade off volume to make that happen.

I find myself considering all sorts of cheap crap for this - and maybe that's the way to go - just thought it would be great if there was a quality cabinet built for this purpose. There may not be enough people besides me that want this to make it a reality - just tossing ideas out there. It's possible that a cheap combo amp is what most are using for this scenario.
Click to expand...

indeed. this dovetails nicely with where i'm coming from.

and kj: i have tc112 and it might be too big for what i'm talking about.

and i get that it may not be economically feasible. but consider all the upright players who use those really small genz 10 and 8 cabs. small is often the key term here.

i think duke could make something better.
 
#918
PDGood said:
Not every cabinet need be gig-worthy. It would also be helpful to have a nice, full sounding, light weight, small form factor cabinet for acoustic volume get-togethers. I'd be willing to trade off volume to make that happen.
Click to expand...

steubig said:
indeed. this dovetails nicely with where i'm coming from...

i get that it may not be economically feasible. but consider all the upright players who use those really small genz 10 and 8 cabs. small is often the key term here.

i think duke could make something better.
Click to expand...

Okay, you guys have my attention. I would enjoy immensely developing and building a killer little "acoustic volume" cab. Other companies are already doing "ultra light" little cabs, so I'm going to shoot for "sounds really good and still easy to carry".
 
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