Audition Red Flag Time Again

[SBassman]

Check out their equipment, condition, playing ability, practice location.
Also, do any of your buddies know/heard of them.

I did an audition 1 month ago, put 10 hours into it, said they would call
no matter what, never heard back. Oh well.

How about putting about 100 hours into a cover band that was supposed to gig, only to then hear the psycho band leader curse all the venues, and tell us that the Real reason for the band was to record the new gold gems he was going to write. [He's 65, and if you heard the incoherent clips we started getting, you would have bolted faster than me. What a waste of time. ]

 

[SBassman]

I am not sure it's a red flag, but I won't audition more than 5 songs - no matter how nicely a band asks. Five songs is plenty to get a feel for each other without getting stuck in an awkward situation.

I need to adopt this. I'm always the moron who wants to show the work ethic and says - "just 5?, nah, give me the whole set list."

No more.

 

[gjbassist]

The band leader has gigs booked but they are all non-paying gigs being done to "get the band's name out there".

 

[SBassman]

I would be wary of any band with keys. Obviously keys can be great, my bar band has keys, but there is no way I'd join unless I knew the keyboard player wouldn't bury me with subsonic bass notes etc.

Also I'd listen for a clean mix. Boomy sound where its hard to hear each player would be a red flag for me.

In my area, I wish we had More bands with keys. Our music world would be a better place.

 

[BKuettel]

The band leader has gigs booked but they are all non-paying gigs being done to "get the band's name out there".

What is that supposed to mean? If a band doesn't get money from gigs they are automatically red flagged for it?

Last time I checked, professional bands arent worried about finding new or replacing members because they have a name for themselves, word of mouth spreads quickly. I dont find those bands using craigslist to advertise. Its usually your local bands that are trying to get them.

My band is lucky if we get compensated for our efforts, because there is usually a competition between bands in our area to get gigs for exposure. Thats usually the case for young bands these days, especially the local metal scene.

So for us currently looking to get another guitarist, we have just the modivation of getting noticed and doing what we love that would attract fellow members. The majority of people looking to join a band arent paid professionals, and they are usually the ones responding to the craigslist ads. If a band says they are booking and playing gigs in their advertisment thats usually a good sign they are serious.

If your a professional player with years of experience and you are looking to join a well-paying band, you need to ask yourself why you are in the situation you are in, and more specifically why your level of "expertise" has led you to scroll the craigslist ads for an undiscovered band in the first place.

 

[bluewine]

Ty didn't take that picture or post that pic. The OP did. And if that's the way he wishes represent himself, it's not Ty's fault if he takes it as looking bored. Personally, I wouldn't post a pic like that and talk about how passionate I am about music or how animated I am on stage.

I think jive has me confused with some other TBers, I am the opposite of animated on stage. I wish I was animated on stage

 

[bassbully]

Having done this for a while, I've come to the conclusion you can't really make any conclusions until you meet the guys and jam. People will always have some type of shortcoming, so it's a matter of what you can live with. That's why finding a fit is so important for a long term project. In the end, a red flag is only a limitation, and we all have to live with limitations. I surely have plenty of limitations, but by grace I seem to find work. It's more a matter of fit.

But you don't want to waste time either.....
The #1 thing that I have found to be a good indicator of a band's potential is a song list. If it's an original band, a body of work such as recordings. From that you can determine if the material is something you would enjoy doing, and it shows they have put in some kind of work and planning.
The #2 thing is a phone call. It helps if a band can communicate and get along. You can't jam by text or e-mail, so you'll actually need to talk sooner or later. I find this to be a good screen.
If these 2 things jive with me, I'll go audition. The last time I did a bunch of auditions a couple of years ago, I asked for a song list. I did about 5-6 auditions, and none of them were time wasters. They were all bands that were playing out, had decent gear, a place to rehearse, material learned, etc. Nowadays on the occasional audition, I will still use those 2 criteria, and I still haven't had a waste of time.

For me, just because it isn't a fit, I don't consider it a waste of time. As long as I met some cool people, jammed some cool tunes, and didn't cost me too much, I consider it a positive. You don't always get a great fit, and it's not always a fault of the auditioner or auditionee, nor does there need to be a fault. People have limitations, and that means that there will be bad fits.

I agree. This weekend I am sitting in with a few guys starting up a country band to see where it might be going and to maybe give me something to do while my band cools off.

I emailed them for a setlist and got one right away with keys. I asked the questions I needed answers for Ages, drug, drink etc and they answered them all. I then spoke to the drummer on the phone so we all were on the same page and only then decided it was worth my time to go out and sit in.

I don't know if it will go anywhere but after doing the screening I feel it will be worth a Saturday afternoon to go see and meet these guys. Simple screening works for the most part and "Red Flags" would show then. Any other issues could show after we meet and you need to decide if the project is worth it or not then.

 

[bluewine]

I need to adopt this. I'm always the moron who wants to show the work ethic and says - "just 5?, nah, give me the whole set list."

No more.

I won't learn more than 4 songs for an audition. But I guess it depends on the band.

For an established agency represented cover band with a high paying gigs on the books, I will do whatever they want.

Blue

 

[bluewine]

The band leader has gigs booked but they are all non-paying gigs being done to "get the band's name out there".

Yeah, I guess it would depend on the caliber of gigs.

However I agree and would say "no thanks".

 

[spade2you]

What is that supposed to mean? If a band doesn't get money from gigs they are automatically red flagged for it?

I can accept that original bands will be expected to play a few gigs without pay or minimal pay, after that I need a little compensation or the band needs to figure out how to obtain money for playing. I know of several local bands that work extremely hard, but have minimal following and don't make much, if anything at all.

I also know a band that insists on going on money losing tours. This particular band has a very unique style of music that the paying population doesn't generally care for.

I live in an area that probably has more bands than demand. Many play for free, which simply brings wages down for everyone.

 

[spade2you]

big red flag:
when setting up a audition one of them says "oh and by the way, can you bring a guitar for our guitar player to use?"

that one bugs me. so what your saying is i have to carry a bass and a guitar because your guitar player cant be bothered AND/OR doesnt have one?

Before shifting my focus to bass, I played guitar about 40% of practice time and basically played both. I advertised that I could play both guitar and bass. This ended up backfiring.

A few bands wanted me to play both since they didn't have a guitarist or bassist. I'm not quite talented enough to play guitar and bass at the same time and do NOT wish to lug both guitar and bass equipment around. Others simply wanted to help themselves to my gear. :scowl:

 

[bluewine]

What is that supposed to mean? If a band doesn't get money from gigs they are automatically red flagged for it?

Yeah, if your looking for a "turn key" opportunity with a working band. If the ad indicates they play gigs free of charge, it's not really a red flag. It means don't waste their time or yours.

Blue

 

[bluewine]

I live in an area that probably has more bands than demand. Many play for free, which simply brings wages down for everyone.

My problem with this is, I don't think established, credible high level gigging cover bands are competing with bands that play for free.

Off topic:

We go back and forth in this forum with those who play for pay and those who like playing for free.

I say:

"There is no better feeling than getting paid to do something you love doing."

 

[spade2you]

My problem with this is, I don't think established, credible high level gigging cover bands are competing with bands that play for free.

I'm sure there are arguments since we haven't exactly agreed on the best bass for metal.

I don't think high profile bands are directly competing with bands that play for free. However, find a decent bar with a really cheap owner and they might be inclined to book a few modest cover bands and original bands and not have to pay anyone.

 

[bluewine]

I'm sure there are arguments since we haven't exactly agreed on the best bass for metal.

I don't think high profile bands are directly competing with bands that play for free. However, find a decent bar with a really cheap owner and they might be inclined to book a few modest cover bands and original bands and not have to pay anyone.

Maybe, anything is possible.

But, I will tell you this.

You will not see any originals bands in the main stream cover clubs in Milwaukee.

 

[BKuettel]

I'm sure there are arguments since we haven't exactly agreed on the best bass for metal.

I don't think high profile bands are directly competing with bands that play for free. However, find a decent bar with a really cheap owner and they might be inclined to book a few modest cover bands and original bands and not have to pay anyone.

I believe you misunderstood me...

My point is why would these successful bands be using craigslist to find some possibly random stranger with no prior knowledge/experience? If these bands are regular paid gigging bands then you would think they would have their act together when finding some talented musicians? I'm not really sure...look at Ben Kenney's move to Incubus after he played for The Roots.

If you are unable to rely on your massive presence in the music business to attract fellow musicians, than you depend on other means of reaching them, such as craigslist. Bands that have not made it use craigslist because that's all they can use.

Expect there to be a few jokers on craigslist, because the majority of these bands haven't gotten their stuff together. But you cannot exclude the bands that actually DO play quite a few gigs but do not make a living at it. Just because you're not "getting paid" at playing gigs doesn't mean you aren't professional and know what your doing.

 

[spade2you]

Maybe, anything is possible.

But, I will tell you this.

You will not see any originals bands in the main stream cover clubs in Milwaukee.

Hopefully it stays this way. I've heard of a few bands being offered a little less than what bars used to pay. The bar owner made it known that they could just as well find someone for less, so take it or leave it.

The abundance of bands, especially those willing to play for free is a bit troubling. I'm slightly surprised it's not pay to play.

 

[Joe Nerve]

Jumping in late on this one, and didn't read all the responses, so apologies if already stated.

I think the red flag thing is a completely subjective and individual thing. Red flags for me would be things a 16 year old joining their first band would be looking for, and what I would be looking for would be nothing more than a bunch of red flags for that kid.

If my idea of a fun rehearsal was drinking a few 6 packs, smoking some weed, and jamming for 3 hours 2X a week, a serious band that doen't drink would be a nightmare.

I wouldn't even consider a band who posts the same ad for months on end to be a red flag. They could really just be looking for one specific thing they haven't yet found, and if you're it... well...

 

[marmadaddy]

Red Flag:

Genres that don't make sense to you.

The ad reads;

"We play stuff like lady GA GA, Rush and john Meyer."

Pass on it.

How about Lady Gaga, Led Zeppelin and John Mayer? My band covers these artists at most gigs, we do it well and we're successful enough.

We don't do any Rush, but we've talked about it. We've had plenty of requests for some.

My advice about substances: some bands will be on their best behavior at auditions and initial rehearsals. If limiting alcohol or drug use is important to you it's best to say it up front. Your first gig with them is not the time to find out that the drummer "always gets high on breaks" or "oh, that's just Jim, he's always hammered by the third set when we play here."

 

[BassDestruction]

Yeah, if your looking for a "turn key" opportunity with a working band. If the ad indicates they play gigs free of charge, it's not really a red flag. It means don't waste their time or yours.

Blue

I had this conversation with an "artist" that felt it made him more real not to worry about the money. After all, he was an artist! Did I mention he was doing bar cover tunes?

Anyway...My patented line in those situations when money comes up is, "I'm not talking about (my) motivation. I'm talking about compensation." If I'm buying gear, practicing, and above all, making money for a club, I'm getting paid! This is especially true for clubs you pack, then they want to pay the same price for the next gig. Usually you came in the first time at a lower price to start with!