Audition Red Flag Time Again

[Muttleybass]

I don't think high profile bands are directly competing with bands that play for free. However, find a decent bar with a really cheap owner and they might be inclined to book a few modest cover bands and original bands and not have to pay anyone.

I agree, except a decent bar with a cheap owner won't stay a decent bar very long.

Around here, the top live music clubs are loyal to the same bands. They pay decent, but breaking in and getting a gig in these places is pretty close to impossible. They won't even give you a chance to prove how good you are.

However, there are a lot of bar owners that will hire a lousy band because they cost less, then they blame the bands for having an empty bar. Eventually these place just stop the live music.

 

[spade2you]

I agree, except a decent bar with a cheap owner won't stay a decent bar very long.

Can't deny that for sure!!! Many seem to change hands often or close.

 

[BassDestruction]

Also, about the red flags...
1. They send you a set list. You show up and any song you call out, they don't know. Usually with the excuse being that it's a song they did a long time ago, or one they are wanting to learn.
2. Non-essential band members (keys, horns, etc.) not seeing it as being important to come to your audition.
3. A drummer with a huge set, China cymbals, double-pedal, etc. for rehearsals. I guess this depends on the music? Nothing I've ever seen as needed though.
4. Showing up and only one person you recognize from the online pictures and videos. That's because it's a "whole new project" he's wanting to try. You were sold on the idea that it was a working band.
5. Being asked (because you live close) to pick up one of the band members on your way to the audition. He lost his license for DUI's (plural)!
6. And lastly, they want to know that if they pick you, are you willing to "chip in" on all new p.a. gear? Yikes!

 

[jive1]

2. Non-essential band members (keys, horns, etc.) not seeing it as being important to come to your audition.

I've worked with bands where I auditioned/interviewed with just the band leader, and some of those were the most professional bands I have worked with. If a band that I am work with is auditioning people, I appreciate it when they don't have me come out. That way, if a bunch of people flake out, or are not a good fit, then my time isn't wasted. When I audition others, I prefer to do it on a one-on-one basis. The players I work with greatly appreciate that I won't waste their time on the audition process to weed out folks who won't work out. The reason why a marginal player like myself gets to work with some really talented musicians is because I respect their time greatly, and treat them like it.

 

[spade2you]

5. Being asked (because you live close) to pick up one of the band members on your way to the audition. He lost his license for DUI's (plural)!

Back when I still played metal and butt rock, I got the spot simply because the last dude lost his license or got arrested.

One of my worst experiences was in a rock band in '04 or so when I had to sober up (to avoid getting in trouble). Drummer was trying to sober up while going through a divorce and rough patch. The guitarists ended up pushing him off the wagon to the point that he was drinking way more than in the bad days. Anyway, I stayed sober and quickly learned that they thought the band sounded great when they were all wasted. In reality, the tunes were awful. They stole about 5-6 songs I wrote and kicked me out. It was interesting dealing with bad stuff sober for the first time in a long time. Fortunately, nothing happened with my tunes since the things I told them to fix ended up ruining the band. Think the drummer might be homeless. Nobody knows what happened to him.

 

[jive1]

I wouldn't even consider a band who posts the same ad for months on end to be a red flag. They could really just be looking for one specific thing they haven't yet found, and if you're it... well...

I have a friend who is in an agency represented band, that's been established for a few years now. They've been looking for a guitar player for a while. They are all very professional, and have their act together. But, they require a guitarist that not only can play guitar well, but they must be able to sing high tenor tunes like Immigrant Song as well as sing harmonies since that's part of their sound. They won't settle on anything less, and they have turned down a number of guitarists that I know because of that standard. Either way, they still have bookings until the end of this year.

 

[spade2you]

I have a friend who is in an agency represented band, that's been established for a few years now. They've been looking for a guitar player for a while. They are all very professional, and have their act together. But, they require a guitarist that not only can play guitar well, but they must be able to sing high tenor tunes like Immigrant Song as well as sing harmonies since that's part of their sound. They won't settle on anything less, and they have turned down a number of guitarists that I know because of that standard. Either way, they still have bookings until the end of this year.

IME, it's one of those things that can go either way. Perhaps the type of person they need is rare as hens' teeth. Sometimes they're just not very good and/or too difficult to work with.

I kinda used a local music board to try to track turnover, after learning the hard way that the reason they went through a few bassists was for a good reason. The same could probably be said about my employer, but I tend to rely on the overtime resulting from turnover.

CL is a little too anonymous to track people, IMO. On the local musician site, you'd see their e-mail address and user name.

 

[smogg]

Red Flags for me include but are not limited to;
no set list,
no minimum specified songs to audition with,
the "just show up and let's see what happens" line,
no prep time (as in expecting me to show up on 24 or 48 hours notice with out even bothering to ask if I'm available or providing me with any tunes to prep).
just to name a few...

 

[phillybass101]

Red Flag;

They ask you to join the band right after the audition.

+1 on this. Been there done that. This is a BIG RED FLAG. Unless it's a big named act and they are about to go on tour.

 

[spade2you]

Red Flag;

They ask you to join the band right after the audition.

Not always. Sometimes it's simply because you're good. Sure, sometimes it's because they're desperate. Once or twice it was simply because my competition simply didn't show up.

 

[bluewine]

Back when I still played metal and butt rock, I got the spot simply because the last dude lost his license or got arrested.

One of my worst experiences was in a rock band in '04 or so when I had to sober up (to avoid getting in trouble). Drummer was trying to sober up while going through a divorce and rough patch. The guitarists ended up pushing him off the wagon to the point that he was drinking way more than in the bad days. Anyway, I stayed sober and quickly learned that they thought the band sounded great when they were all wasted. In reality, the tunes were awful. They stole about 5-6 songs I wrote and kicked me out. It was interesting dealing with bad stuff sober for the first time in a long time. Fortunately, nothing happened with my tunes since the things I told them to fix ended up ruining the band. Think the drummer might be homeless. Nobody knows what happened to him.

This is why I would never join a band with members that don't have their personal lives together.

If a person is having a beer at rehearsal, fine but when I see members getting wasted on a consistent basis, I'm gone.

 

[spade2you]

This is why I would never join a band with members that don't have their personal lives together.

If a person is having a beer at rehearsal, fine but when I see members getting wasted on a consistent basis, I'm gone.

I'll need to choose my words wisely, but I'd probably say that more than half of the musicians I worked with in their past didn't have their lives "together". I suppose one would need to define "together". I've had the same job for more than 10 years and have had many of the same friends since high school and a few before. Some could argue that I don't like change, which is probably true, but I also like to argue that I got it right a long time ago.

 

[bluewine]

I'll need to choose my words wisely, but I'd probably say that more than half of the musicians I worked with in their past didn't have their lives "together". I suppose one would need to define "together". I've had the same job for more than 10 years and have had many of the same friends since high school and a few before. Some could argue that I don't like change, which is probably true, but I also like to argue that I got it right a long time ago.

Together for me and understand I'm a weekend warrior for the most part, would be having a full time job that afords you to be in a working band. Reliable transportation for rehearsals and gigs. Not dependent on help from other band members.

No alcohol, substance issues or any kind of bad history with the law. I wouldn't play with s felon unless he/ she was famous and big $$s were involved.

 

[BayStateBass]

I guess I have a short list of red flags, but they're just my point of view, I guess.

1. Drinking. A beer or two, okay. Crush a 5th in an hour and I probably wouldn't come back even if you invite me.

2. Drug use. If you want to, go right ahead. I just don't want to be around it.

3. Groups that overestimate their appeal or where they are going. If you're covering Mustang Sally and Folsom Prison Blues and insist you are "this close" to a record deal, it's probably not going to end well for anyone.

(If you're realistic and you know what you are, that's cool... I actually like playing those songs, you know, and cheesy cover bands are my preferred groups )

4. If you don't have a consistent practice schedule, a developed setlist, or some sort of organization to the band (like a band leader), you're probably just a jam band. Which is perfectly fine. But recognize what you are and get the right people who have the same goals.

5. Bands that explain all their personal problems, one at a time, to you during an audition. Especially marital problems.


Some things that don't bother me;

1. Startup bands. Let's face it, every good band started somewhere, as did every good musician. But if you have a startup band, have a plan. If you do, you might be surprised at the people who like the chance to help build something.

2. Being asked to join at the end of the audition. That's how I got my current setup. The band had a bassist that left after two years and they were looking for a certain person to replace him and the criteria was not only playing ability, but various other things including age, physical appearance, attitude, etc. I was essentially a drop-in replacement for their old guy and I was offered the job at the end of my audition (which was 2 hours long, BTW....). So far, I'm really happy.

3. Bands that have been looking for someone for a while. It's not a big deal. If the reason is that they are looking for someone in particular with a certain set of skills, or certain criteria. It wouldn't scare me. And genre-specific bass players may be hard to find, depending on your area.

I guess that's all I can think of.

 

[Phlipper]

Not necessarily a red flag, but if they're auditioning friends of the band, I'd take a pass.

You might be the better bass guitarist even the better overall match for the band it's still hard to compete with someone's buddy.

+1000000000

Lately I feel like asking if they're auditioning friends before I even show up. Lost two gigs that way, one after being asked to come back again. "Well, you were great, too, but John's played with this guy blah blah ... "

Why did you audition 15 guys?

 

[tbirdsp]

Check out this recent craigslist ad. Pretty sure it was a joke

"I want to make some M****F****N MONEY"

"Looking for Lead or Rhythm Guitarist spot in a working cover band so I can try to recoup at least some of the money I've wasted on music equipment over the years. I've got the right look, and ALL the right gear so let's get this going.

Being that it's for a cover band, I'm really hoping to not have to practice with you at all. After all these years of dealing with self-loathing, ego-maniac, flaky, ass-wad, big talk-little dick choad-monkeys; I'd really prefer not to have to deal with anyone in the band in any way. Other than playing shows and getting paid that is!

I can play any style of music you want, as long as it isn't from the last say, 10 to 15 years (it's all crap). Pretty much from Nirvana back to Seger. On that note (music humor) I'd prefer to have the band be all dudes. Any chicks in the band always just end up getting me in trouble! HAHA

As you can see I'm a pretty solid dude. The only thing you may have to work with me is on scheduling a bit. I don't do weekday gigs (waste of time), and I don't like working every weekend. Gotta get out on the Harley or the golf course and have a beer or two to clear the head every once in a while, right? Either that or f**king little league practice that I have to take the step kids to.

In your email please send a photo of the band, up coming gig schedule, previous gig schedule, and what my cut of the pay will be. Once I've sifted through all the applicants I'll decide where it is I wanna be. If you don't get a response from me, that's the breaks!

Shred you later!"

 

[Drunk Heffalump]

^ I've said it before I'll say it again, Craigslist is flypaper for freaks..........^

 

[PauFerro]

Red Flags:

1. None of the musicians have management or entrepreneurial sales experience.

2. No real repertoire and refuse to book gigs without one.

3. No gigs on the horizon.

4. You don't like the people (for me, arrogance is a biggy).

5. No one has any contacts.

6. They don't bother to find out about you -- your goals for being in a band, how often you want to gig, and nothing specified about how money is divied up, how repertoire is decided, how often you rehearse.

7. They don't have decent PA equipment and no one wants to invest in any either.

That's a start. Run like a madman from all that.

 

[abemo]

Red flags:

Bad singers.

Bad drummers. (Or "one beat drummers")

Telling me all your life issues. Its cool, we all got them, and if we become personal friends over time, its cool, but I've wasted waaaaaaay too much time over the years listening to other band members over the phone for 5 hours every week because of personal issues.

Finding out they are auditioning you before they let go of their current bassist. If they can't show their current members respect, they'll never show you any either.

 

[rocmonster]

I am not sure it's a red flag, but I won't audition more than 5 songs - no matter how nicely a band asks. Five songs is plenty to get a feel for each other without getting stuck in an awkward situation.

Yep, I was asked to audition for a gigging cover band in a college town. When I contacted the BL, he gave me a list of 20 songs to learn for the 'audition'. The 'audition' was to take place at a bar on a Friday night. What they were really looking for was a temp replacement for their bass player who was out of town that weekend visiting his girlfriend...

Oh, and no mention of pay for the 'audition' that really was a fill in paid gig