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Bad attitude, or am I overthinking this?

#61
Going in, you know a beginning singer-songwriter usually isn't going to have much appreciation for bass if they don't have any other musical experience. Go into the project knowing and accepting this, maybe trying to prove what bass can do, or if you can't go into it with a good attitude then look for something else, instead.
 
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#62
Muttleybass said:
If you're spidey sense is tingling, follow your gut, but I don't see anything to be really concerned about. It does sound like he's all about his stuff, but there's nothing wrong with that. It might not turn out to be exactly what you what you want, however, it still could be an experience. I think it'd be worth a get together. It's not like you're marrying the guy... You can bail at any time.
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Exactly! Just because you go to jam with somebody doesn't mean you're committed to anything. But keep your eyes open.
I went to a jam a couple of weeks ago. The amps were cranked way too loud for the little room, players didn't have any sense of dynamics, I noticed HA support stickers on buddy's motorcycle, firearms not locked up.... I'm not going back
 
#64
If you are relatively new and looking to gain experience, you really can't spend that much time talking yourself out of opportunities to try out. Even if it turns out to be awful, you will have gained more experience. My advice to new players is to accept any invitation to jam, regardless of how it fits into your overall vision of the future. You can't get "there" without starting somewhere. At worst, you invested an hour or two on a challenge that you don't need to repeat.
 
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#65
I don't think he's acting weird. I would go for it man!! If you want to get better, playing with others is the best and quickest way to do that IMO. If he's down, and you're down, why not?!? Don't get hung up on the small stuff. Plus, it's SUPER hard telling what some people mean through email/text/whatever. It's better to just meet up, talk and see if it goes somewhere. Worst case, he's a total a$$hat and you walk, best case, you guys end up making some kick butt music together and learn a lot from the exp.
 
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#66
Absolutely, do it. The guy's attitude about bass is pretty typical for a folksy singer-songwriter. The good thing is he won't be expecting killer bass chops and won't be telling you what to do. If he also lines up a drummer, it's a bigger win. Learning to play with a drummer will be a big positive in your development as a player. At your stage, never pass up an opportunity to play with others unless you feel they have some kind of personality disorder, etc.
 
#67
friendlybass said:
Give it a shot, it sounds like it'll be more his project than a collaborative effort to write but that can give you a lot of freedom to experiment. The worst that happens is he's a diva and you spend a few hours not having fun instead of chilling at home.
Actually the worst that happens is he's a serial killer, but id say risk of that is low.
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serial killers are much less news than songwriters with backing bands that they finnagle into paying equally into the band recording and then take all the credit, running off with a label band of hired guns when it goes well.
 
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#68
Well, I happen to be a bassist who also thinks that if you're calling attention to yourself at the expense of the song, you're probably doing it wrong.

For me, one of the sublime pleasures about playing bass is making everyone else sound as good as they can while not calling attention to myself.

If the craigslist guy had said that to me, my response would have been,"right on! absolutely."

Your mileage may vary.
 
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#69
I've come across a few good musicians over the years who simply don't get the bass. In some cases it only comes to their attention when it's played wrong (notes, time) or is missing and in other cases the thought of giving the bassist some soloing room never crosses their mind.

It is what it is. I don't like it but I don't want to spend time educating them.
 
#70
Forty-Thirty said:
I've never approached anyone that I don't know to talk about playing together before, and I have an interaction I'd love your thoughts on.

I saw an ad on Craigslist this afternoon from a guy who is a singer/songwriter type and is looking for people to play with and improve with. I am also looking for people to play with and help me improve, so I contacted him. He said he plays a little guitar and has another guy he plays with sometimes, but was looking for a bassist and a drummer. I told him I'm a beginning bassist, but can learn quickly and have similar goals to the ones he stated. He had a SoundCloud page and had some folksier type music on it, which I am not opposed to, and I sent him the only recording I have of me playing with another person. It's from a jam session (my very first ever) with my dad at Christmas when I had only been playing about 6 months. It's not bad at all, but I like to think I've improved since then. I told him this was from months ago and my first ever jam, so it's not necessarily an indication of my best.

He wrote back and said a few things that concern me a little, and I'm not sure if I'm being overly sensitive or if I should be a little wary. He said, "I listened to your jam with your dad. He's really good! I'm not saying you're not, but it was more of a keyboard showpiece. For me, bass is something I don't really notice unless it's just all wrong. But you obviously got a little swing in you!"

Um. Ok. There's a bit of a compliment at the end, but it's also kind of a dig at bass in general and maybe at me personally. Anyway, it was really off-putting to me.

He also said, "I'm definitely interested in talking some more and/or just getting together to see what happens music-wise. Sounds like we have the same aims-- just to get better and for me, to flesh out all these songs that are driving me crazy."

And it's the "all these songs that are driving me crazy" line that gives me pause, too--he doesn't seem to think bass is all that interesting/important, and he's also got his own stuff swirling around in his head, so I wonder how much of this would be collaborative and how much would be just him trying to get his own stuff done.

So... what do you make of this? Thanks!
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You're way overthinking this brother ;)

The guy sounds like a typical songwriter, and he didn't say anything negative about bass or you.

You can only learn from collaborating with people, especially since you're so new to the instrument, so go into it with an open mind and a positive outlook and see how you can help each other grow :thumbsup:
 
#71
I think it would be worth a meeting or two. Think about it. You could be the key to turning all that "crazy" in his head into amazing musical results. It's a pipe dream and a one in a million, but you can't say it doesn't happen. CSN? (Young wasn't there yet.) The first time they got together and sang a few bars they couldn't stop laughing (per Mr. Nash) because they knew what they had.
Or you could just say nope.
Go with your intuition and then "choose wisely". Best of luck. I'm rooting for you and the one in a million. :)
 
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#72
Having played with quite a few 'folksy-er' Singer/Songwriter types, I've found that they likely have all sorts of ideas of how bass should sound on their songs - which based on their limited knowledge of bass - but when you do something different (for example playing like a bass player), their eyes light up.
Guitar playing singer/songwriters tend to focus on lyric (usually VERY personal), melody, and then the guitar playing. I'm not saying there aren't many wonderful players out there, but there are a lot who are better and singing, and songwriting than they are at guitar. Bass players tend to look at songs through a wider lens.

Go for it. Keep it simple, tasteful, and insist you keep the time (if you're without a drummer for now). They'll secretly thank you for it. The worst that can happen is it only happens once. In that case, you now have some experience.
 
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#73
One shot and make sure you take your Dad just as an onlooker.. If it clicks cool, if not don't hesitate to step off ASAP.. Like even if your in the middle of something! 1st impressions are usually the correct ones.
Try not to read too much into emails it's usually not the best way to communicate. As you never can interpret what the person is trying to convey. IMHO
Good Luck!
 
#75
Forty-Thirty said:
I've never approached anyone that I don't know to talk about playing together before, and I have an interaction I'd love your thoughts on.

I saw an ad on Craigslist this afternoon from a guy who is a singer/songwriter type and is looking for people to play with and improve with. I am also looking for people to play with and help me improve, so I contacted him. He said he plays a little guitar and has another guy he plays with sometimes, but was looking for a bassist and a drummer. I told him I'm a beginning bassist, but can learn quickly and have similar goals to the ones he stated. He had a SoundCloud page and had some folksier type music on it, which I am not opposed to, and I sent him the only recording I have of me playing with another person. It's from a jam session (my very first ever) with my dad at Christmas when I had only been playing about 6 months. It's not bad at all, but I like to think I've improved since then. I told him this was from months ago and my first ever jam, so it's not necessarily an indication of my best.

He wrote back and said a few things that concern me a little, and I'm not sure if I'm being overly sensitive or if I should be a little wary. He said, "I listened to your jam with your dad. He's really good! I'm not saying you're not, but it was more of a keyboard showpiece. For me, bass is something I don't really notice unless it's just all wrong. But you obviously got a little swing in you!"

Um. Ok. There's a bit of a compliment at the end, but it's also kind of a dig at bass in general and maybe at me personally. Anyway, it was really off-putting to me.

He also said, "I'm definitely interested in talking some more and/or just getting together to see what happens music-wise. Sounds like we have the same aims-- just to get better and for me, to flesh out all these songs that are driving me crazy."

And it's the "all these songs that are driving me crazy" line that gives me pause, too--he doesn't seem to think bass is all that interesting/important, and he's also got his own stuff swirling around in his head, so I wonder how much of this would be collaborative and how much would be just him trying to get his own stuff done.

So... what do you make of this? Thanks!
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Huh.

I think he has some bias there. He thinks of the bass player as only for filling in the low-end, not being heard out front with the guitars. Plenty of good music has been written with a prominent bass line, or has been written by bassists (Jeremy by Pearl Jam was written by a bassist).

There's nothing wrong with playing out back if that's your music. However if you want to do something more then you might have a problem with this person. It's too early to say for sure though, he could be better than that initial impression.

I've written songs before for my bands. It's always been real collaborative, maybe I write a verse or a chorus, or even arrange a whole song. I only say this because that's how it can be if you find someone that appreciates the other musicians in the band. Heck, our current drummer writes lyrics because she's more poetic than the rest of us are.
 
#76
Gravedigger Dav said:
Don't be bothered by it. You'd be surprised how many musicians see bass as a necessary evil or at least, "well, it's not that important, but it has to be there."
I worked for a year with a guitar player who often said bass is easy, guitar is hard.
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Ugh, I hate people like that.

Without a good rhythm section you have nothing driving the music.

Hand those egocentric guitarists a bass and they are terrible at it--everything looks like a guitar to many of them. Bass requires a very different technique.
 
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