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Baer Amplification Megathread!

#1,061
Chef said:
gig report:
OK: I found one downside to these:
the handle is tall enough that, when I use them stacked horizontal, neither the MBFusion, nor 1001 clear it. The MBF has substantive feet, the 1001 not so much so, The M9, in it's skb rack won't either.

The good:
Sadowsky>1001>2xML112 was great. Dial in a little hair from the GK and roll. The ML's make that hair sound great.
The horizontal stack is fatter than the vertical stack; I dialed bass on the 1001 back to 9.5 oclock.
The MV5PJ with flats was crushingly fat and clear.
The RV5JJ with rounds was knarly vintage J with some kewl ragged yet musical edge to it.
Click to expand...

Chef

I hear you with the grnarly comment - we ran a DIngwall through a MoMark 800 (which is a vert flat response head) and no eq and man that rig was perfect for grindy tones! I can see these heads perfect for guys not wanting that "hifi" tone predominant on most modern cabinets. We the pout a Mike Lull T4 through that rig - wow!! I have yet to try any of the Genz heads but so far the impressions and interesting and the voicing os very different to any of the cabs we keep in stock and will certainly appeal to those looking for a particular type of response.

Regards

Mark
 
#1,063
poptart said:
Chef

I hear you with the grnarly comment - we ran a DIngwall through a MoMark 800 (which is a vert flat response head) and no eq and man that rig was perfect for grindy tones! I can see these heads perfect for guys not wanting that "hifi" tone predominant on most modern cabinets. We the pout a Mike Lull T4 through that rig - wow!! I have yet to try any of the Genz heads but so far the impressions and interesting and the voicing os very different to any of the cabs we keep in stock and will certainly appeal to those looking for a particular type of response.

Regards

Mark
Click to expand...

The ML112 with a P and a Streamliner is a thing of complete beauty. Punchy, but fat, and that bit of roughness up top that really gives the top end of a P some nice character. Really nice sounding!
 
#1,064
Chef said:
Don't think that's all they do.
put "a clean head" thru them, and they do that quite well also!
Click to expand...

+1 I think of them as cabs that can do the clean thing, when fed a clean signal, but are easily coaxed into a musical grind/growl when you so desire.

FWIW, I prefer the sound of the vertical stack, so it's not an issue for me, but I have also used those Auralex monitor wedges to good effect when I have a cab with a tall handle on top. The other trick is to install taller feet on your head.
 
#1,065
Chef said:
gig report:
OK: I found one downside to these:
the handle is tall enough that, when I use them stacked horizontal, neither the MBFusion, nor 1001 clear it. The MBF has substantive feet, the 1001 not so much so, The M9, in it's skb rack won't either.

The good:
Sadowsky>1001>2xML112 was great. Dial in a little hair from the GK and roll. The ML's make that hair sound great.
The horizontal stack is fatter than the vertical stack; I dialed bass on the 1001 back to 9.5 oclock.
The MV5PJ with flats was crushingly fat and clear.
The RV5JJ with rounds was knarly vintage J with some kewl ragged yet musical edge to it.
Click to expand...
KJung said:
I wasn't clear. I was talking about the ML112 specifically. Roger put the rubber feet on both the bottom and one side of the cab in order to use them vertical or horizontal. The logic was (in talking with Roger a while back) that the horizontal was perfect for full size heads due to the width of the cab (no 'hang over' issue with a full size head), and also most full size heads don't have any issue with their feet overcoming the strap handle sites.

Flip it on its side, and no handle, rubber feet for protection, and a form factor that works fine with the small micro's...
Click to expand...

Ya know, it's funny that when designing a product from the ground up, one of the most difficult challenges tends to be finding just the right hardware. Honestly, I had an easier time working with Eminence to custom design a driver, than I had trying to find a handle that works for this cab. So, here's the scoop. The strap handle we used was chosen, because it was simply one of the only handles that would fit on that cab. If you look at the cab internally, there is bracing running all over the place, plus there's the midrange enclosure. Dropping in a recessed dish type handle on top wouldn't be possible because of the bracing and mid enclosure and going with either two recessed dish handles on the sides, or on the top corners doesn't work for the very same reasons. So, basically it came down to using a single strap handle on top, or completely redesigning the cab to work with a single recessed handle that could go on the top. Even with doing that, that single dish handle could not have been right in the balance point (due again to the mid enclosure), so it would have been uncomfortable to carry, as the cab would tip one way, or the other when picked up (never good for a bass player wrist).

In talking with our customers, it seems that the bulk of our users are pairing their ML112's with micro heads. Most of these users tend to stack the cabs vertically (although I prefer horizontal myself). So taking everything into account, the best solution seem to be to stick with the top mounted strap handle on top and add rubber feet to the "side" of the cab for all the micro users who stack vertically and not compromise on the cabinets internal bracing. Also, believe it or not, we actually have quite a few customers who rest their micro head on top of the handle and like the way the strap tilts their amp up making it easier to see the front panel. Cabinet design is truly all about compromise and sometimes the little details, like the handle type, are chosen strictly from out of necessity, rather than preference.

tombowlus said:
...The other trick is to install taller feet on your head.
Click to expand...

We do have the 3/4" rubber feet we are using for the Valkyrie available in stock, should someone want to change out the feet on their amplifier. The only requirement being that your existing feet have to be attached with machine screws and not be the push in type that are on some heads. IMPORTANT NOTE: You have to be extremely careful when swapping the feet on any amp, that you are aware of how far the screw will protrude into the amps interior space. Using a longer screw to mount different feet could mean that the screw will protrude into the internal space more than intended and that could create a hazardous situation having that metal screw, which is grounded to the chassis, hit a circuit board. When designing the Valkyrie, we actually made sure there are no electronic components anywhere near the feet mounting holes, just in case anyone ever lost a screw and replaced it with one longer than intended. There's no way for us to know if your amp was designed with this in mind, so the responsibility falls on you to check first!
 
#1,066
I'm perfectly happy with my cabs...I LOVE the beefy quality of it and wouldn't trade it...especially if compromising the internal bracing was a concern...

I'm perfectly happy using my wedges to help clear the handle. And because of the feet mounted on the side, I can always stack vertically

If I gave an impression that I wasn't THRILLED with your cabs, it wasn't my intention...
 
#1,069
+1 to Roger's handle choice. It just seems like it'll never need to be replaced, as I've done on many strap handles.

I can deal with the "micro bump," just fine.

Chef, that wedge idea is great. There's somewhat of a counterpart to the ML's in the UK (made by EAD iirc) that are like a line array form factor. Gets the same slant when laid longways.
 
#1,070
KJung said:
The ML112 with a P and a Streamliner is a thing of complete beauty. Punchy, but fat, and that bit of roughness up top that really gives the top end of a P some nice character. Really nice sounding!
Click to expand...

Ken

Yes - I can see that combination working really well, but then again the Streamliner + P and almost any cabs sounds great !! :-D

I was running the MoMark on flat with no eq or distortion, the point I was making is that with a flat response amp these cabs "show" their mid range clarity and "pull out" those lovely upper mid grindy tones but without the fizzy high end associated with tweeters.

Great for players looking for a nice take on old school tones, but also perfect for those smooth/fat tones with an amp like the Streamliner. I am also keen to try these with EUB or Double bass, I reckon it would work really well.

Mark
 
#1,071
poptart said:
Ken

Yes - I can see that combination working really well, but then again the Streamliner + P and almost any cabs sounds great !! :-D

I was running the MoMark on flat with no eq or distortion, the point I was making is that with a flat response amp these cabs "show" their mid range clarity and "pull out" those lovely upper mid grindy tones but without the fizzy high end associated with tweeters.

Great for players looking for a nice take on old school tones, but also perfect for those smooth/fat tones with an amp like the Streamliner. I am also keen to try these with EUB or Double bass, I reckon it would work really well.

Mark
Click to expand...

+1 All the way. Love Roger's cab with the LMIII and F1/F500 also. Roger's cab is the only 'mid driver' loaded cab that actually sounds like a bass cab (i.e., the upper mid response sounds very 'top of the driver'). So, you get the bit better upper midrange dispersion and ability for the designer/manufacturer to use that heavy duty woofer with Roger's cab, but you don't move so far into the 'studio monitor or PA cab' tonal profile as some other mid driver executions do.

Very solid box for those who want it 'small, light, relatively low, and loud' and actually like a somewhat more traditional sounding 'bass backline' tone profile.

The top end of this cab, as you point out, is among the nicest, most musical top ends of any cab I've ever heard, and brings to mind (to me) the final versions of the Bergantino AE cabs with the revised crossover.... bright and present, but very musical, organic, with none of the harshness I hear in some other midrange loaded designs.

As I've posted before, if I didn't have my AE's, I'd be playing these. Since the AE's are no longer available, these are VERY good options for those looking for a punchy, present, articulate tone without the sizzle of a tweeter or the need for massive power.:bassist:
 
#1,072
KJung said:
+1 All the way. Love Roger's cab with the LMIII and F1/F500 also. Roger's cab is the only 'mid driver' loaded cab that actually sounds like a bass cab (i.e., the upper mid response sounds very 'top of the driver'). So, you get the bit better upper midrange dispersion and ability for the designer/manufacturer to use that heavy duty woofer with Roger's cab, but you don't move so far into the 'studio monitor or PA cab' tonal profile as some other mid driver executions do.

Very solid box for those who want it 'small, light, relatively low, and loud' and actually like a somewhat more traditional sounding 'bass backline' tone profile.

The top end of this cab, as you point out, is among the nicest, most musical top ends of any cab I've ever heard, and brings to mind (to me) the final versions of the Bergantino AE cabs with the revised crossover.... bright and present, but very musical, organic, with none of the harshness I hear in some other midrange loaded designs.

As I've posted before, if I didn't have my AE's, I'd be playing these. Since the AE's are no longer available, these are VERY good options for those looking for a punchy, present, articulate tone without the sizzle of a tweeter or the need for massive power.:bassist:
Click to expand...

Ken - we are definitely on the same page here ;-)

Mark
 
#1,073
poptart said:
...I was running the MoMark on flat with no eq or distortion, the point I was making is that with a flat response amp these cabs "show" their mid range clarity and "pull out" those lovely upper mid grindy tones but without the fizzy high end associated with tweeters...Mark
Click to expand...

Very much in tune with our design goals for the ML series cabs. The Valkyrie has a very flat preamp response curve that has no mid cut, no top end boost and has a gentle low end roll off. The 6" mid driver was dialed in to make the tube circuit distortion have prominence, without being harsh. My least favorite combination is with amps that have exaggerated low end and top end boost baked in, but then again, I'm not a fan of that design philosophy in the first place.
 
#1,075
We are looking at a November release for the ML212 and ML115. Price is still TBD on the ML115, but a rough ballpark would be in the mid to high 800's, depending on the final woofer choice we go with. The ML112's will be seeing a small price increase by then as well.
 
#1,078
R Baer said:
Very much in tune with our design goals for the ML series cabs. The Valkyrie has a very flat preamp response curve that has no mid cut, no top end boost and has a gentle low end roll off. The 6" mid driver was dialed in to make the tube circuit distortion have prominence, without being harsh. My least favorite combination is with amps that have exaggerated low end and top end boost baked in, but then again, I'm not a fan of that design philosophy in the first place.
Click to expand...

Hey Roger - when you say "gentle low end roll off" are you referring specifically to HPF? 30 hz and below type of thing?
 
#1,079
Ampwedge, between horizontal cabs.
I dig it.

ampwedge.jpg
 
#1,080
Having gigged my personal Baers now (I had a pair for BassGear for a while), I can say:

I'm one really happy camper.
I missed horns for a while.
I kinda don't now.

I can also say, I really like the vertical stack a little better.
A smidge leaner/tighter.
Definitely nicer-for-me nearfield monitoring.
I still think a "line array" vertical stack throws out into a room cleaner.

The last three jobs I've done were:
Alleva LG5>MBFusion>2xBaer ML112.

I'm hooked.
Despite the fact that I have two GK112's I like very well, a 12/6/1+12sub rig I like fairly well, and 2xTC115's I really like; I have new best friends.

That may change, but I know what I'll be packing to work most regularly right now.
Fat, but not blubbery, and you can eq in more or less beef readily.
Punchy as heck.
Super articulate.
Great mids; smooth, but barky and present as well.
Treble response that really doesn't leave me missing a horn; especially the more I use them and acclimate to their treble delivery.
Light, and easy to move.
And: these cabs take a little grit/grind/OD from the Walkabout/1001/MBFusion, and do nice things to it.

Well done sir, well done.
 

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