Baer Amplification Megathread!

[KJung]

Ken, I think the upper mid presence of the ML112 could actually be a plus over the DB112, not having heard it. There were times, like with any cab, where the fullness of the low mids in the DB112 could be a bit much in some rooms, and it was challenging to control. Perhaps a little too deep and vintage. Like you, I love the grind of a J bass. I just don't want a harsh tweeter to have to get that to come out. This is ultimately why I sold my Neox 212 because it was a little too smooth, and I started looking into the AE line. The AE212 was a little too deep down low for my tastes, and the AE112 didn't bond with me at all either. I've seen where you think the AE112 is similar to the ML112, which scares me. But the AE112 is VERY different from the DB112 which I love, so it's just a bit confusing.

Either way, with the 10-day trial, I'm just going to go for it. I like the idea of a super-12, and I hate, hate, hate most every 12/6/1 cab I've tried. This one sounds very promising.

That is why I posted that the DB112's seem to excel with a head that has a reasonable tight low end, lots of warm mids, etc. So, +1. The ML112 KILLED with my Streamliner, while the DB112's sounded a bit mushy and bloated with that head.

The top end of the AE112 and the AE210 (the original models) is somewhat similar. Both a single AE210 or the ML112 will IMO bury the AE112 down low, which makes the AE112 'bright to the point of too much' to me. So, I would minimize any comments I might have made about the AE112 (I don't remember posting that, but if I did, I was probably strictly talking about the upper mid presence).

The AE212 sounds totally different from the rest of the AE line... much smoother, wider, deeper, and has no similarity with the ML112 (or the rest of the AE line for that matter).

 

[GRoberts]

Did somebody say there is a 10-day trial period with the Baer ML112? Hmmmmm. Sort of makes for a low-risk "try it and see". Hmmmm.

My top two contenders are probably the Baer ML112 or Bergie HD112. Anybody care to draw a contrast between those two? I will be using My Nordy VJ5C and VJ5 Modern Jazz 5'er's with with an Aguilar Tonehammer 500 or an Orange Terror TB500H bass head that I just picked up. I dig it a lot. The Orange has a nice old school low end that is fat and punchy with good clarity in the highs that are never sharp or sizzly. It has some chewy midrange grind built in as well. Nicely balances the focused 70's grind of my Nordy VJ5C Ash/Maple bass.

 

[Eublet]

Yeah, I think you are right Ken, and I try to keep comments in context of where they're made without making them stretch into something else. I think I'm reading you correctly on the description, along with others, on what to expect from the ML112. It really sounds like it could be a great match for what I'm wanting these days, where I find myself turning my tweeters down more and more because I don't want that zingy thing, but then find that I'm missing the upper mid grind in the 2.5k range. It's like there's no happy medium on most cabinets I've been testing for the last few years. The TC RS210 was pretty close since the tweeter was more reserved, but I still wanted a bit more upper-mid grind going on. When I grab the G string on my jazz bass and slide up the fretboard real quick, I want it to sound like someone is goosing a weed-eater.

 

[GRoberts]

When I grab the G string on my jazz bass and slide up the fretboard real quick, I want it to sound like someone is goosing a weed-eater.

Now THERE is a tonal reference we can ALL relate to. You crack me up!

I don't want that zingy thing, but then find that I'm missing the upper mid grind in the 2.5k range.

I also agree with this! That's sort of what the Orange TB500H is doing for me. No zingy / sizzly treble. Just Phat, punchy and goosed weed-eater-ish!

 

[Eublet]

I also agree with this! That's sort of what the Orange TB500H is doing for me. No zingy / sizzly treble. Just Phat, punchy and goosed weed-eater-ish!

LOL, well I might have to check that thing out then!

I don't know how else to describe it, but that's one of the little things I do when I'm trying to dial in a tone...goose my weed-eater, over and over while adjusting EQ until it sounds right. I think I've become a bit spoiled because I play with molded IEM's most of the time with an Aviom system. The Aviom is setup to send MY DI tone to everyone, and then the house guy can tweak what he needs without affecting the monitors. Then there's a bleed control where I can get as much of the house ambience as I want. It's sound frickin' killer all the time. I can make my J basses just grind for days in the monitors, and every little nuance comes through. The TH pedal is crucial for me getting what I want. I've gotten close with the VT pedals and a good ol' BDDI, but the TH is the bees knees.

The problem is that whenever I play without IEM's now, the tone is left wanting. It seems like it's all low-mid pillow with no upper-mid articulation and grind. If I turn up the tweeter, the grind starts coming in, but so does all that shrill harshness. I'm thinking the ML112 might fix that.

 

[R Baer]

When I grab the G string on my jazz bass and slide up the fretboard real quick, I want it to sound like someone is goosing a weed-eater.

Can we use this in our new ML112 marketing campaign? I can totally picture Derek Smalls saying this:

"It's like, when I grabs the G string on me bass, slide up the fretboard real quick and it sounds like I just goosed a f***ing weed-eater! I mean, it sure beats the hell out of Nigel's guitar amp, right? That simply goes to 11. This is one better."

 

[Eublet]

Yes!

 

[tombowlus]

You know, Alan did have like two full paragraphs in his ML112 review about how well the cab performed on gigs, and how it nailed the tone he was after... blah... blah... blah...

We only have so many pages (116, to be exact), so I have to edit some of this stuff down a bit. In a moment of extreme inspiration, I replaced those two full paragraphs with one sentence:

"Those Baer cabs have armadillos in their trousers."

Is that efficient word smithing, or what!?!?

 

[Chef]

It's what I would have said, when limited to that many words.




More or less.

 

[R Baer]

"Those Baer cabs have armadillos in their trousers."

More marketing brilliance!

 

[Eublet]

Good one, Tom! So, maybe we could say playing through a Baer is like goosing an armadillo in your trousers while eating weed?

 

[Chef]

You can only say such things in Colorado and Washington.

 

[tombowlus]

You can only say such things in Colorado and Washington.

LOL

 

[R Baer]

The problem is that whenever I play without IEM's now, the tone is left wanting. It seems like it's all low-mid pillow with no upper-mid articulation and grind. If I turn up the tweeter, the grind starts coming in, but so does all that shrill harshness. I'm thinking the ML112 might fix that.

I really think the ML's might give you what you are after. When I working on the Valkyrie preamp, I always used very hi-fi headphones to do my monitoring. Then when we mated the pre to the power section and started driving cabs, I kept feeling like something was missing. I just couldn't recreate the sound of the preamp into the headphones with an amp and a cab. I also didn't care for the way the tube distortion sounded through the cabs tweeters. In chatting with Bill Fitzmaurice one day, he felt that what I was probably missing was the upper mid presence that comes through loud and clear in the phones, but isn't typically present in most commercial bass cabinets. Bill suggested that I try building a "mid loaded" cabinet and give that a try. At this same time Eminence was just sending out prototypes of their new Kappalite 3012's. Even with the first rough prototype, I was able to get much closer to the sound I was after than any of the traditional cabs I had in my shop. Once I hit upon these extended range mids that reach up to the 6k - 7k range, I knew I had found the sound I was after.

IMO, after the advent of the SWR 410 cabs with a tweeter, most players came to think of a hi-fi cabinet as being heavy on the bottom, scooped in the upper mids and very bright with a lot of sizzle on the top. The ML's are pretty much the exact opposite of that entire way of thinking. A little leaner on the bottom, present through the upper mids and bright in the lower treble region, but with almost no content above 9k. Judging by your previous post, it seems like the sound you are looking for just might be available from these cabs.

p.s. Thanks to Tom AND Chef for the new signature quote!

 

[Chef]

Hey, you have to give me partial credit for the sig line; it was my copy he edited that from.
Or into.
Or something.

Copy editing is a bit of a black art.

 

[R Baer]

Hey, you have to give me partial credit for the sig line; it was my copy he edited that from.
Or into.
Or something.

Copy editing is a bit of a black art.

Done! lol

 

[Addison]

This thread has taken a turn for the awesome. LOL

Anyway, I just thought I'd say that I have the dough for an ML212 stashed away and will be ordering one the second they are available... That is if Roger doesn't put a restraining order out on me first.

Hopefully they're still on schedule for the end I this month... I'll report as soon as I have it. I have an STM900, TH500, MB BB750 and a TE AH300SMX to pump through it... And I have a PH410, Warwick 410, PH412, PH210, DB112 and a DB112NT to compare it to use as tonal references.

So excited to try it!!!

WOOT!

 

[B String]

IMO, after the advent of the SWR 410 cabs with a tweeter, most players came to think of a hi-fi cabinet as being heavy on the bottom, scooped in the upper mids and very bright with a lot of sizzle on the top. The ML's are pretty much the exact opposite of that entire way of thinking. A little leaner on the bottom, present through the upper mids and bright in the lower treble region, but with almost no content above 9k. Judging by your previous post, it seems like the sound you are looking for just might be available from these cabs.

p.s. Thanks to Tom AND Chef for the new signature quote!

Not argue with you Roger, but I've found the box takes eq quite easily. With most reasonable heads I've been able to get a big fat bottom and smoother upper mids. Certainly fatter bottom than most single 12 boxes. The highs are delicious.
One of the big things I like about the ML112 is how good it sounds at lower volume and not being pushed. Many modern boxes have that hole between the top of the speaker and the horn. If the speaker isn't moving much it's hard to get much tone and punch at a low volume. The ML112's 6in mid has the upper bass as well as the rest of the way up. The 12 just has to move enough to fill out the lows a little.

Great box for upright bass too. Again, the 6in mid has the frequencies where the upright lives. Quick off the finger.

 

[R Baer]

This thread has taken a turn for the awesome. LOL

Anyway, I just thought I'd say that I have the dough for an ML212 stashed away and will be ordering one the second they are available... That is if Roger doesn't put a restraining order out on me first.

Hopefully they're still on schedule for the end I this month... I'll report as soon as I have it. I have an STM900, TH500, MB BB750 and a TE AH300SMX to pump through it... And I have a PH410, Warwick 410, PH412, PH210, DB112 and a DB112NT to compare it to use as tonal references. WOOT!

I would imagine the BB750/ML212 combo would just be a wicked rock rig. One of my favorite amps out there. I think the cabs are schedule for the production floor the last week of November, so these should be available around the first week of December.

 

[R Baer]

Not argue with you Roger, but I've found the box takes eq quite easily. With most reasonable heads I've been able to get a big fat bottom and smoother upper mids. Certainly fatter bottom than most single 12 boxes. The highs are delicious.
One of the big things I like about the ML112 is how good it sounds at lower volume and not being pushed. Many modern boxes have that hole between the top of the speaker and the horn. If the speaker isn't moving much it's hard to get much tone and punch at a low volume. The ML112's 6in mid has the upper bass as well as the rest of the way up. The 12 just has to move enough to fill out the lows a little.

Great box for upright bass too. Again, the 6in mid has the frequencies where the upright lives. Quick off the finger.

So Bruce, let me see if I got this straight. You want a big, fat bottom that is smooth and you like it delicious up top? (I'm not even going to touch the "quick off the finger" comment)