Bergantino AE212; Part 2!!

[Chef]

I always bring two; and, generally two that are pretty different from each other.
This is as much for my own entertainment as for the fact that "one seems to always work better in any given room."

 

[GRoberts]

Well, my venerable Henry 8x8 sold last night, so, ''by The Constraints of One In, One Out,''
I'm now obligated to buy a replacement cab.

I totally torn between this one, and Roger Baer's 212.

The Bergantino AE212 seems to be legendary ...as is my AE410. I can't see any downside going with an AE212. I would LOVE to check out an AE212, but my AE410 is such a solid, tried-and-true performer, they seem just a little redundant. Inherent tonal differences withstanding (AE212 being deeper in the lows and a bit smoother in the mids and highs.)

 

[tombowlus]

I always bring two; and, generally two that are pretty different from each other.
This is as much for my own entertainment as for the fact that "one seems to always work better in any given room."

+1 Except I usually bring three (sometimes more, but typically three). But then again, I'm one of those out of touch freaks who still likes to play 4-string on some songs (especially when I sing a lot).

 

[vision]

The AE212 is not bad, but I find it just big enough and heavy enough that it's noticeably more of a hassle to carry than a pair of 112's or 210's. Even just manipulating it in and out of a car/SUV if you use a cart for the bulk of the trip to the stage.

I'm curious about this - a pair of 210's is easier for you to load in/out vs. one 212? I understand that the two 210's will be lighter individually on taking them out of the car than the 212, but isn't the combined rig much more heavy/bulky when rolling on the cart vs one 212?

 

[Vic]

I'm curious about this - a pair of 210's is easier for you to load in/out vs. one 212? I understand that the two 210's will be lighter individually on taking them out of the car than the 212, but isn't the combined rig much more heavy/bulky when rolling on the cart vs one 212?

Yes.

Obviously I'm not talking about grabbing both simultaneously, and the combined weight doesn't matter, because at that point, it's on the cart. I would never walk any great distance even with a single 210 cab... my Kart-a-bag cart is so great and portable, I pretty much always us it or the dolly from the band truck if it's free.

So it boils down to wrestling things in and out of the car for me. The AE212 is significantly heavier and bigger than one of the 210's, and shaped in such a way with the handles oriented such that it's just a lot more difficult for me to get it in and out of a vehicle... much "taller" than the 210 in the carrying position... I find myself kinda' tossing the bottom up and slinging it in, kinda' hard on my lower back, whereas I just set the 210 in very easily. Basically, for me, it's the same level of difficulty as my UL410, even tho my UL410 weighs two more pounds.

I've discussed this many times before but I find geometry just as important as weight when it comes to the "schleppability factor". Man, I love that term.

So in this case, yes, two easier is better than one more difficult for me. Maybe a function of my height tho... I'm only 5,9.

 

[LilRay]

I've discussed this many times before but I find geometry just as important as weight when it comes to the "schleppability factor". Man, I love that term. .

Schleppability factor.......It's an industry term.

So in this case, yes, two easier is better than one more difficult for me. Maybe a function of my height tho... I'm only 5,9.

Get you a pair of Bootsy's platforms brother. You'll easily be 6'1"



God Bless, Ray

 

[foderaman]

What I have found with the AE212 is that when you go to pick it up and carry by one hand it seems to want to get away pretty quick with the tilting motion and when picking up with two hands by both handles it has you in a leaning out and lifting position which is a killer on your back but it is a great sounding cab.Seems to put out more Deep Low end over a AE410 IMHO.

 

[KJung]

Well, my venerable Henry 8x8 sold last night, so, ''by The Constraints of One In, One Out,''
I'm now obligated to buy a replacement cab.

I totally torn between this one, and Roger Baer's 212.

I'm sure those cabs would be be very different. Since you have posted that you don't dig the 'mid driver/no tweeter' design, I would think this would be a very easy decision.

The AE212 is simply a stunning box.. easy to schlepp, covers anything my AE410 does (which is rare for a 212), and is voiced much more evenly than any other AE cab or combination of cabs (for those of you a bit concerned about the somewhat brutal 'tight and bight' of the 10's, and even the smaller 12's. This is quite different. GREAT with a P Bass. The AE410 is king with a 70's style J if you want the grind and bite. For everything else, AE212 by a wide margin for me.

 

[Vic]

What I have found with the AE212 is that when you go to pick it up and carry by one hand it seems to want to get away pretty quick with the tilting motion and when picking up with two hands by both handles it has you in a leaning out and lifting position which is a killer on your back but it is a great sounding cab.

+1

Still, wouldn't be a deal-breaker for me... just a negative point is all.

 

[KJung]

+1

Still, wouldn't be a deal-breaker for me... just a negative point is all.

Can't imagine one handing this cab... way too heavy for that. Two hand... nice carry for me, although I would have preferred the handles just a touch lower on the cab, since 'straight arm' carry can result in the cab banging your knees again. However, at 55 pounds, this is not really 'carry friendly' anyway, and it is just a dream on the kart-a-bag... thin and narrow enough to sit nicely on the Kart-a-bag over long distances, and the carry from the cart to the stage is trivial.

 

[Vic]

Can't imagine one handing this cab... way too heavy for that. Two hand... nice carry for me, although I would have preferred the handles just a touch lower on the cab, since 'straight arm' carry can result in the cab banging your knees again. However, at 55 pounds, this is not really 'carry friendly' anyway, and it is just a dream on the kart-a-bag... thin and narrow enough to sit nicely on the Kart-a-bag over long distances, and the carry from the cart to the stage is trivial.

+1 again... and VERY good point on moving the handles... depending on how far down, it might even solve my "problem."

I did try to one hand this cab, and it is do-able, but really only for short stints... like to get a door open and such, but then kind of a pain to re-grab after that. Still may be better than bending over twice to set-down/pick-up tho.

Bottom line, for me as well... definitely a cart cab.

 

[rodneyat]

+1 again... and VERY good point on moving the handles... depending on how far down, it might even solve my "problem."

I did try to one hand this cab, and it is do-able, but really only for short stints... like to get a door open and such, but then kind of a pain to re-grab after that. Still may be better than bending over twice to set-down/pick-up tho.

Bottom line, for me as well... definitely a cart cab.

If the walk is not too far..I one hand it as well. I am lazy. I like to only make one trip. Bass and amp over my back in my gig back and cab in the other hand.

 

[Vic]

If the walk is not too far..I one hand it as well. I am lazy. I like to only make one trip. Bass and amp over my back in my gig back and cab in the other hand.

Ummm... the cart doesn't add a trip, but it sure saves the back and arms.

 

[vision]

I find geometry just as important as weight when it comes to the "schleppability factor". Man, I love that term.

I definitely agree...that's mainly what I'm getting at. On the cart I'm assuming that your pair of 210's is similar or maybe a bit bigger in size to one 410. I've never been able to use a 410 on a cart because it's so wide that opening and getting through doors and navigating turns is a pain. For the last few weeks at my church gig I've been borrowing Ken's S212 (which I know isn't the best AE212 schlepp comparison because it's considerably smaller and lighter) and that thing is a joy to wheel in and out on a cart.

But I've never gigged with the AE212, and I've also not tried a 410 or pair of 210's on that nice Kart-a-bag you guys have, so that may be the difference.

 

[Vic]

On the cart I'm assuming that your pair of 210's is similar or maybe a bit bigger in size to one 410.
I've never been able to use a 410 on a cart because it's so wide that opening and getting through doors and navigating turns is a pain.

Not quite. Taller, yes, but much shallower, which I would think would make a huge difference in "cartability" overall. I have cart'd my 210s many times and while I have had a few tight turns I had to maneuver a bit on, it was never a problem... never got to the point where I just said screw the cart and carried them.

That said, I do think the AE212 would be even more cartable, however.

 

[grovest]

If this is the AE212 melting pot, I would like to share my experiences. Powered by a Thunderfunk 750.

Have had the cab a few months = a couple dozen rehearsals and four gigs in a variety of rooms.

The sound I almost can't comment on. It's of course great but that was expected. The flexibility of the Thunderfunk's preamp has never been constrained by the AE212.

The weight is OK. I know it is light for the SPLs and two 12s and perhaps I'm being unrealistic to want something even lighter. I schlep my whole rig at least once a week to rehearsals and I insist on bringing a well-outfitted emergency bag (1 spare of every cable, tools, strings, metronome, tuner, more), so I feel every pound.

The dimensions bother me a little. I'm still a little cold on how the vertical 12s look, and the cab's height is awkward on my hand truck. It's trickier to load in to my relatively tall SUV as I have to 'stage' it by resting the back on the cargo area's 'lip' before sliding in the cab. With my previous 2x10's I could directly place the cabs in the cargo area.

The cab seems well made but really needs a section of reinforcement plate along the bottom edges. Somehow, perhaps from the deck of the hand truck, I've already worn through the black finish on the cab's rear bottom edge. I do use protective covers but they are only five sided. With my previous cabs (including the UL310), I had six sided covers made up but I felt the 'bottom flap' would be too cumbersome to work with on the tall AE212.

Volume is excellent to the point of being overkill for all rehearsals and some gigs.

The grill is a million light years improved over the previous polished silver, but I absolutely dread the day when I notice I've poked an indentation in to it. So far so good.

So though it sounds phenomenal, perhaps I would have been better off trading some of that awesome deep bass for the portability of the AE210 coupled with a second AE210 for select gigs. I've never been one to bump the 'bass' knob, anyhow.

And don't ask about the TFB750 just yet....

 

[Saluki]

I have owned the HS210(52lbs each), the AE210s (40lb each) the AE112 (31lbs each), and I have the AE410(62lbs) and the AE212(55lbs). I have never used a cart for any of them. I am bit on the stocky side, but don't enjoy long hauls with any of them. The AE 112 is obviously the easiest to one hand, followed by the AE210 and although you can one hand the AE212 the handle placement doing so will allow the box to rotate thru the center of gravity which makes it a pretty hard one handed schelp. Also at 55lbs I doubt most people could do it for a long distance and if the did their arms would be in no shape to play a long set. With the AE212 or AE410 I typically place the top of the cab in my gut and carry it outward from my body. Even the weight is further from my body it allows my legs to move freely from banging into the cab. From this perspective the AE212 is easier than the AE410, but placing the cabs in my trunk is a different story. The AE410 goes in trunk of my camary way easier then the AE212. With the additional depth and height it just barely fits in my trunk. I would have been bumed if it wouldn't have fit.

 

[Eublet]

Wow, people not liking the size and weight of the AE212. IME, you can't get smaller and lighter for a 212 without sacrificing a lot of frequency response. This cab is more evenly voiced and powerful than many larger and heavier 212's. The semi-vertical arrangement has a purpose, and it's very effective. The only thing I was skeptical of at first was the rear porting, just because I've had issues with it in the past even though everyone will tell you it doesn't really matter. On this cab, I will agree that it's a non-issue.

Grills are heavy. Putting a heavy-duty grill on the cab would only make it heavier. As with all designs, every feature has a pro and a con. IMHO, the design of this cab is about perfect given that statement.

 

[Tunaman]

Wow, people not liking the size and weight of the AE212.

I've been following this thread closely. I love my Epifani 310NYCs, they are heavy so I was looking for a significantly more portable cab & would love a 212.
The more I read however the more I gather it would be a mild improvement for lifting. If I could buy a cab now from scratch it would be the AE212 but the difference isn't enough for me go through the trading process for a few pounds when I already like my cabs sound.

 

[Chef]

Really?
You guys want to grouse about a 55lb killing machine?

My UL410 weighs this much, and it's easy to move/lift/carry when I need to.
My two LDS 2x8's go 45lbs each.

My Henry 8x8 was close to 110.

I'll take 55lbs.