Double Bass Best quality bass amplification?

[Barcza]

Sometimes I think maybe the flat response amp is only a legend. When Neumann introduced the U67 mic, the engineers thought this is the mic without color, and later started to use for it's special sound. Unfortunatelly I didn't tried Acoustic Image heads, only a Contra combo, but I didn't like it.

 

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

The downfiring AI design is something that people feel strongly about. I think it sounds really good at low volume, but prefer the Wizzy 10 usually. Although, with some eq tweaking the two cabinets can be made to sound similar they sound much different flat. You just might like the AI head into another cabinet. Then again, once you get into the better stuff I don't think you can go wrong.

 

[Risen Ashes]

Well I can't remove my subjectivity because there is a direct link to my positive experience and that tone in my head.

My biased favorites: Old school All-tube Ampeg heads like the SVT Blue lines, SVT II and the new SVT-VR. Mesa Simul-state amps-I have not heard another comapany combine tube pre-amps with solid state power and sound THAT good. GK amps-Being a big tube fan this would be my hands down head company to go to if I switched to a smaller rig or a lighter rig-from the 800RB, 1001 and 2001 to their Backline stuff it's all amazing to me. David Eden's solid state stuff is pretty good also.

 

[jayarroz]

+1. I know many people who frequent this forum will endorse this if they see the thread. That's what convinced me to try it out. I'm very glad I did. I'm sure there is other gear that will make a good sound too. I haven't tried everything, and gear keeps evolving ... People's tastes vary too. But IMO I think this is a pretty happenin' combination for DB.

YAH I DO THE SAME AI AND EA WORKS FOR DOUBLING TOO, ADD A SANSAMP FOR MORE KICK WITH EB

 

[mikeypbass]

I played through an Acoustic Image Clarus through a Raezers Edge Bass 12... that was pretty bangin for my upright

 

[Scopaz]

I have been floored with the sound of my upright through my Epifani UL110 and my Epifani 502 amplifier. I like the sound of the AI gear as well as the EA stuff, but for my bass personally and the sound and portability I am after, this combo is deadly. Just my two cents...

 

[Jet Nero]

I live less than 3 miles from Atlanta Bass Gallery and have tried just about every amp and cabinet they have. And believe me, they have it all.

Plain and simple, many of the brands mentioned in this thread are absolutely the best money can buy. Sure, some of it is geared more for electric bassists. But I was very surprised at just how great some of that gear sounded with double bass.

It comes down to a matter of taste.

 

[Barcza]

I live less than 3 miles from Atlanta Bass Gallery and have tried just about every amp and cabinet they have. And believe me, they have it all.

Plain and simple, many of the brands mentioned in this thread are absolutely the best money can buy. Sure, some of it is geared more for electric bassists. But I was very surprised at just how great some of that gear sounded with double bass.

It comes down to a matter of taste.

Could you share information with us about some heads, which surprised you mostly.

 

[Barcza]

I have been floored with the sound of my upright through my Epifani UL110 and my Epifani 502 amplifier.

The Epifani head seems very good quality but, the input Impedance: 470 KoHms. its not to low for URB?

 

[Scopaz]

The Epifani head seems very good quality but, the input Impedance: 470 KoHms. its not to low for URB?

Well I am using a Realist pickup which many have told me that mine is 'hotter' than most others. So maybe the combo has worked for me better than it would for others. I have not needed a booster preamp for the signal and have never came close to needing to be louder.

 

[drurb]

The Epifani head seems very good quality but, the input Impedance: 470 KoHms. its not to low for URB?

For most (virtually all?) piezo pickups, 470 kohms is too low. 1 Mohm is the minimum, 10 Mohm often is a bit better but it depends on the individual pickup.

 

[Barcza]

Fishman recomends 1-10 Mohm

 

[drurb]

Fishman recomends 1-10 Mohm

As I said,...

 

[bolo]

FWIW, the MarkBass LM II is getting some good reviews for upright, as I'm sure a lot of us have noticed. Their input impedance is (only) 500 Kohm.

I have tried putting preamps with 10 Mohm inputs (HPF-Pre, D-TAR Solstice) in front of my amps (AI Focus SIII, iAMP 200). With my p/u's (RS II and Planet Wing), the difference in tone is there, but not super significant. In a gigging situation, I'm not sure even I could tell the difference.

Oh, and I wanna try a Glockenklang.

 

[Ric Vice]

FWIW, the MarkBass LM II is getting some good reviews for upright, as I'm sure a lot of us have noticed. Their input impedance is (only) 500 Kohm.

I have tried putting preamps with 10 Mohm inputs (HPF-Pre, D-TAR Solstice) in front of my amps (AI Focus SIII, iAMP 200). With my p/u's (RS II and Planet Wing), the difference in tone is there, but not super significant. In a gigging situation, I'm not sure even I could tell the difference.

Oh, and I wanna try a Glockenklang.

Using a buffer/pre amps with newer pickups gives subtile difference in tone quality, but I think it's there. Kind of hard to tell sometimes, isn't it. But if we travel with Sherman and Peabody in the "Way Back Machine" and use the BP-100 or Underwood then the difference is very noticeable. Since Walter Woods, AI, and GK and EA all have a 1 megohm load it's probably not as big an issue as it once was, just the same I'm keeping mine and using it liberally. I like the idea of the Summit DI with a variable megohm load. That would be nice to have in a little box so you could match the load to the pickup.

Ric

Oh, and I wanna try a Epifani 502

 

[Jet Nero]

Without your personal taste, what amps are the best in quality, clarity, detailed sound, least noise and hiss? I'm mostly curious other nominees than Walter Woods!

The Acoustic Image, Euphonic Audio and Epifani heads all offer what you are looking for to a degree.

While the Epifani UL-502 head (and UL-210 cabinet) sounded very good with my double bass and pickup, there was a noticeable amount of artificial low end. In addition, a preamp was necessary. This is the most expensive option (even without the additional cost of a preamp) and if a flat response is your pursuit, not exactly the best one IMHO.

I had a hard time figuring out the best settings for the Euphonic Audio heads to get "my bass, only louder." It seemed that I'd have to use the EQ to get the response I wanted. And that seemed a bit counter intuitive.

The Acoustic Image Focus head displayed the flattest response. And since I do not play EB, it was the obvious choice.

The head selection took a couple of hours. But the cabinet selection lasted twice as long. My top choices there are Euphonic Audio and Glockenklang cabs for clean, high fidelity power. Epifani cabs deserve a very honorable mention as much of the artificial low end I experienced with the UL-502 head was remedied with the AI head.

Hope this helps you.

 

[MR PC]

I like the idea of the Summit DI with a variable megohm load. That would be nice to have in a little box so you could match the load to the pickup.

I remember reading an interview with Steve Rodby years ago in which he described his DearArmond volume pedal as having a rotary switch with different value resistors for different impedences. Don't know if it's passive or not.

 

[Barcza]

The Avalon U5 DI olso has high impadence input, and sounds amazing. It can be work to improve the impadence?

 

[drurb]

Using a buffer/pre amps with newer pickups gives subtile difference in tone quality, but I think it's there. Kind of hard to tell sometimes, isn't it. But if we travel with Sherman and Peabody in the "Way Back Machine" and use the BP-100 or Underwood then the difference is very noticeable. Since Walter Woods, AI, and GK and EA all have a 1 megohm load it's probably not as big an issue as it once was, just the same I'm keeping mine and using it liberally. I like the idea of the Summit DI with a variable megohm load. That would be nice to have in a little box so you could match the load to the pickup.

Ric

Oh, and I wanna try a Epifani 502

Here's a thread on variable impedance. Post #2 contains my thoughts on it's value.

 

[drurb]

I had a hard time figuring out the best settings for the Euphonic Audio heads to get "my bass, only louder." It seemed that I'd have to use the EQ to get the response I wanted. And that seemed a bit counter intuitive.

The Acoustic Image Focus head displayed the flattest response. And since I do not play EB, it was the obvious choice.

First of all, I can assure you that with their tone controls disabled (or set at "zero"), given that these amplifier circuits are not "voiced," both have extremely "flat" response especially over the range of frequencies that are relevant for amplification of the double bass. That's no trick these days at all.

The determination of how flat the response of the amplifier is would be made with measurement equipment. Now, as soon as the amp is connected to a real cabinet, the frequency response you hear is mostly determined by that of the cabinet and it's interaction with the room. A small effect (given the design of these amps) will come about as a result of the interaction of the amp with the cabinet.

I think we need to keep in mind that we are dealing with musical instrument sound reinforcement and not music reproduction. The frequency response of the sound-reinforcement chain is affected by the response of the pickup, it's loading by the pre-amp stage(s), the response of the cabinet, and the interaction of the cabinet with the room. The last of those varies (sometimes dramatically) from room to room.

All this is to say that it is not, IMO, counterintuitive or undesirable in the least to have to adjust the tone-shaping circuits of the amp to achieve the sound you want. Given all the variables, I consider it a necessity. To choose a rig on the basis of whether or not one needs to adjust the tone controls just doesn't seem practical. Again, it may sound fine in one room set "flat" and awful in another room. Now, I would agree that if a rig seems to require massive amounts of "EQ" regardless of the room, that would signal a sound-reinforcement chain that has some large and undesirable peaks/valleys in its response.

All of the above speaks loudly to why I so value the parametric tone-shaping section of the standard EA amps. That's not necessarily a plug for EA. Any amp that supplies a sufficiently flexible tone-control section might fit the bill.