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Big E speakers: Pt 2

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#261
rpsands said:
Every time I've ever experienced apparent slowness it was due to something in the FR from 150hz down. If you slap an Fdeck series 3 on a ported cab and turn the variable knob up to 70hz or so, it becomes indistinguishable from sealed for me.

Just my two pence, not saying everyone's experience is the same :)
Click to expand...

I don't think you've heard a good sealed cabinet then. A good one (not an SVT, I hate those things) makes the low end positively subterranean. The mids come back into proportion with the rest of the sound (unlike an SVT) and all of the low notes are easily distinguishable from each other instead of sounding like someone just exciting a resonant system. I love the sound of a great sealed cabinet. Unfortunately, I do not like hauling them around, so I don't use one. However, I do have a pair of handmade Dick Sequerra 12" sealed subwoofers in my home studio. They sound truly wonderful and absolutely different from a ported sub.

I'd love to hear these Big E cabs in person.
 
#262
Hi!
Long time lurker, first time posting.
I just thought I’d post a few thoughts on my little 2X6.

On volume:
I’ve had my 2x6 for a couple of months now, and have used it for 8-10 gigs. Small/ medium clubs, churches, and party tents. It is louder than an Ampeg 115 combo, with far deeper lows. I would compare it to a good 2X10. With a little compression it fills a surprisingly big room, although I do feel a little underpowered if I’m playing loud beat music.
However with the deep and very wideband sound I have, I’ve never had a 2x10 do better either. This much sound coming out of this tiny thing is remarkable.

Dispersion:
It sounds more or less the same at every angle. I like to stand about 6 feet away from it, I feel the sound comes together bit and it sounds even fuller without losing punch or articulation.

Frequency response:
It’s very, very flat throughout the range, and it does go very deep as promised. Deeper than the fEarfuls with a lot more control.

I’ve ordered the 4x6 too, and it should be able to handle anything I throw at it.

Some of the cabs I’ve owned and can compare it to: Acme Low-B4, Eden 210XLT, 115XT, 112XLT, 610XLT, Epifani 310UL, fEarful 15/6/1, 12/6/1 cube.
I’ve played all the usual backline rigs too.


Geir K. Breivik
 
#264
Unfortunately for Shrigg the side handle idea was a disaster. A trusted source (ahem Leland!) said that the Penn Elcom spring loaded handles didn't make any noise on his PA cabs. It's not his fault---I've been trying to tell all of the Big E guys that electric bass is much more brutal than pa sub usage. The transients are insane. It's not the handles banging against the plate. It's the spring mechanism itself. Weird, huh? Well the cab that I initially made for myself will be returning to me and I'll make Shrigg a new one. He can run it without handles until I do. I don't think there will be much of a difference in sound.

On 3rd's cab I switched to metal corners so the I had the room to use 4 corner handles. At first they don't seem as convenient but with 4 handles and being able to grab around the front in the port area it's pretty manageable. Guys--I'm SUPER into any handle ideas!
As far as what RP said---that's the point! You raise the HPF to a point where the port contribution is minimized. Now most bass that we associate with "a big low end" is above 70hz. In a reflex cab the stuff below that adds low end volume but--in my opinion messes with the sound too much. Imagine if you got functional low end down there. As Edwin said--you can get it with a sealed box (or a transmission line) and it'll beat the pants off reflex low end but---it'll be huge or you'll sacrifice a ton of efficiency. A buddy of mine in Chicago in the 80's (he's a brilliant engineer) built a transmission line out of very large concentric heavy walled cardboard tubes for an 18 incher. The low end was astounding. So was the size and weight of his 26" round by 48" tall cylinder. And he needed a TON of power.

To be honest---and I build 'em---I don't know how or why this stuff works. Yeah--I can say how the sound wave is manipulated in the vortex waveguide but I still don't understand why it works. Guys complain about the nomenclature--we could call it the trans-dimensional black hole matrix and it still would be no no less effective than "manipulated vortex waveguide". I've come to accept the MVW nomenclature---it's as good as any description I reckon.
 
#269
Mike Arnopol said:
On 3rd's cab I switched to metal corners so the I had the room to use 4 corner handles. At first they don't seem as convenient but with 4 handles and being able to grab around the front in the port area it's pretty manageable. Guys--I'm SUPER into any handle ideas!
Click to expand...

4 corner handles seems ideal to me... Interested to hear 3rd curve's feedback on carrying ergonomics
 
#270
GK Breivik said:
Dispersion:
It sounds more or less the same at every angle. I like to stand about 6 feet away from it, I feel the sound comes together bit and it sounds even fuller without losing punch or articulation.
Click to expand...
These cabs are so weird. Where I perceive the sound beginning is a few feet in front of the cab. What Steve and Tom tell me is that is where the output from the cone front and horn/port flares begins to combine. I agree that the "magic" spot is about 6 feet in front. I've stood closer with good results.They are really forgiving as far as to where you stand. You can really be 15 feet away and you won't miss much. If you want to dislodge intestinal obstructions---stand right in front of the ports.
 
#271
Stumbo said:
[ot]
You may want to check out this thread:
There are no "fast" speakers/cabs
[/ot]
Click to expand...

Didn't say they were faster, just felt that way. Anyone who has played a number of cabs can tell you that most all of them have a different feel - even between ported cabs. Bag end S15-d vs ampeg svt-15, acme 210 vs Schroeder 210, different speakers in different enclosures react differently - thus giving a different feel while playing.
 
#273
shrigg said:
4 corner handles seems ideal to me... Interested to hear 3rd curve's feedback on carrying ergonomics
Click to expand...

The cab is manageable. Ideally I would love deep dish side handles, that's just not doable with this design. There isn't even enough internal volume to spare so that the speakon connectors can be recessed. I don't know what's going on behind the baffle, but it is packed tight. The 4 corner handles are the next best solution. I will need a cart for this one though. Lifting into a vehicle or moving across a stage is not bad. I carried it a fairly long distance then down a flight of stairs, which wasn't much fun. I need to get back to the gym.
 
#276
I'm building one with outside corner skateboard wheels (in back) and an additional center handle in the upper back. Problem with the handle that Ukiah recommended is that I think that it is great for a one-handed carry---but maybe not two. I found that with 3rd's cab that the more I lifted it the more effective ways I found to do it. Those big open ports with the dividers are pretty useful too.

When compared to the Berg it's only 3 or 4 lbs heavier and a bit smaller.
 
#278
3rdcurve said:
Didn't say they were faster, just felt that way. Anyone who has played a number of cabs can tell you that most all of them have a different feel - even between ported cabs. Bag end S15-d vs ampeg svt-15, acme 210 vs Schroeder 210, different speakers in different enclosures react differently - thus giving a different feel while playing.
Click to expand...

I think that rather than "fast" I would describe it to feel pretty immediate in the attack. And it is fast on the decay. (when that's called for)

Mark A gave a pretty cool description that felt apt.

He said that it has more the immediacy of an acoustic instrument. To me---it feels like the difference of when I play my upright acoustically and then through an amp. No matter how great the amp--it never feels like the notes are jumping out like when it's played acoustically. It is trippy--I don't really have a real clue why.
 
#280
Thanks Mike. That's great to know. I've got some stuff I'm going to put up for sale soon to raise some funds. I think a pair of 45's would just be perfect with my GK MB Fusion head.

Cheers,
Liam
 
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