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Can we talk about marijuana?

#141
people want others taught that which supports their own interests. if someone smokes, and wants it legalized, what better way than to mold a new generation of voters to their way of thinking?
No one will admit that, because it is deplorable to think that someone would manipulate our nation's youth, so they could further enable chemical intoxicants, but that really is what happens

you know I will get flamed for this, but one has to wonder about the motives of those who will be most vocal about it
 
#142
Lee H said:
people want others taught that which supports their own interests. if someone smokes, and wants it legalized, what better way than to mold a new generation of voters to their way of thinking?
No one will admit that, because it is deplorable to think that someone would manipulate our nation's youth, so they could further enable chemical intoxicants, but that really is what happens
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No what people are saying is give both sides of the argument. If you tell kids pot is evil they will not listen to anything you say. Treat them like adults and let them hear both sides and make up their own minds. I feel that if he really wants to reach these kids and make a difference treat them like adults and you'll see some changes that you want.
 
#143
if they are all ready lazy and unmotivated, treating them like adults and giving them encouragement to use drugs makes more of the welfare, self entitlement adults that sponge off society

do you know what would have happened if I had used drugs, and failed in school? I would have been walking around with a boot stuck in my posterior. I was not old enough to make adult decisions, no matter how much I thought I was...

long term result was a that I became successful business owner instead of following the druggie kids I wanted to hand out with.
 
#145
I think for me, and a large percentage of other smokers is that it can really help you just chill out after a stressful day, and these are very stressful times we live in. Its just nice to come home after a long day of busting your a$$, light up a fattie, and just flip on the ol' boob tube and get a few laughs in at something you might not even find that funny usually and then call it a night. For me I've always been a serious night owl, even when I would have to work early in the morning, I just could never get myself to go to bed at even a relatively decent hour, but when I would smoke at around 10-11 or so, I would be falling asleep at midnight or so, which would make a world of a difference at work the next day when my performance would be notably better.

I've never seen any studies about it, but I really do believe that the stress relieving benefits of smoking could have a drastic effect on your health in a positive way, specifically on your heart. But hey, I'm in no way a scientist, but when I was smoking, I was generally just a happier more energetic, outgoing kind of guy. I never relied on it, but I did enjoy it.
 
#146
OK! You guys go over there, and you other guys go over there. Cool.... Now you look like kids at a dance. Now get off the wall and mingle. Pass the joint. Put the joint down. Have a drink. Pour someone's drink out. NOW FIGHT! lol. Now go home and think about how trivial opinions are.

I just typed this all out because I'm drunk. It might have been better if I was high. I might not have cared if I was sober. You might not have read it if you were wired. The kids will do drugs, whether they think so or not. It is patterns of behavior that confine us to failure, success, and mediocrity. Say luh veee!

Shut up and play yer guitar.

The kids are not alright. As they should.
 
#149
ShredderMaximus said:
I think for me, and a large percentage of other smokers is that it can really help you just chill out after a stressful day, and these are very stressful times we live in. Its just nice to come home after a long day of busting your a$$, light up a fattie, and just flip on the ol' boob tube and get a few laughs in at something you might not even find that funny usually and then call it a night. For me I've always been a serious night owl, even when I would have to work early in the morning, I just could never get myself to go to bed at even a relatively decent hour, but when I would smoke at around 10-11 or so, I would be falling asleep at midnight or so, which would make a world of a difference at work the next day when my performance would be notably better.

I've never seen any studies about it, but I really do believe that the stress relieving benefits of smoking could have a drastic effect on your health in a positive way, specifically on your heart. But hey, I'm in no way a scientist, but when I was smoking, I was generally just a happier more energetic, outgoing kind of guy. I never relied on it, but I did enjoy it.
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Was smoking, past tense. Why did you stop?
 
#152
fingerbun said:
When people stop breaking into my house and stealing my TV so they can sell it cheap to finance their habit I'll agree with you.
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This is as ridiculous as Harry anslinger saying its from the devil cause black jazz players smoke it. And don't forget the evil Jewish community, they are all up in that too. Why don't you people really find out why it's illegal. Mostly because people wanted to advance their career(Harry) or want their competition out of the way like the paper mogal willam randaolph Hurst.
 
#153
I'm an ex-drug user, when I quit, I stopped smoking pot because it wasn't of any benefit to me, personally, and I decided I wouldn't miss it so I might as well cut it out along with the rest. Was pot a gateway drug for me? No. I would've tried hard drugs without ever having tried pot. Funnily enough, the only real reason I started experimenting was because I didn't have faith in what I was being taught about drugs in school, via the media and by my parents. My curiosity led me to want to find out for myself. Now none of them did me any good, but in my personal experience, it was a far cry from the, "drugs are so bad, if you smoke pot once, you'll end up addicted to crack and mugging old women to fund your habit" type of propaganda that often goes around. I knew a lot of casual drug users at the time, and a few wasters, but to portray smoking a joint as life-ruining is a bit much.

Munjibunga, I noticed in continuing your vitriolic insistance that drugs never have a positive effect on people's lives, you skipped on past this and chose to respond to Jmatt's much less challenging one. Was that intentional? Either way, here it is. I'd appreciate seeing your response.

Jools4001 said:
Well, my wife has secondary progressive Multiple Sclerosis. For those that don't fully understand what that is, it's an incurable degenerative neurological disease that ultimately destroys the function of the central nervous system. In time, depending on the completely random nature of the disease progression, it may well leave her being unable to speak coherently, she may have to be tube fed because her ability to swallow may be totally impaired, she may have to be catheterised and have a colostomy to deal with dual incontinence, and she may lose the use of her legs and arms, may lose her sight or just about anything that is a function of the central nervous sytem...which is just about everything..

She is already reduced to being in a wheelchair full time, needs to have her food cut up for her because she can't use her hands properly and has some speech and cognitive issues that are typical of MS. The secondary progressive stage of the illness means that she no longer has periods of remission and, basically, it's all downhill from here - and some of the other symptoms described above are already starting to manifest themselves.

Outwardly, people with advanced stages of MS will look pretty much like Professor Stephen Hawking. He has Motor Neurone disease, which is a completely different thing, but the outward effects look pretty much the same...except that MS also impairs cognitive function.

We are both in our mid 50's. I work as a programme manager for a multinational, before my wife was diagnised and had to give up work because of her condition she was a paliative care nurse helping people with terminal conditions (including MS) to die with dignity. WE are not stoners.

And yet, canabinoids are reputedly very good at alleviating the constant neurological pain, cramps and muscle spasms that MS engenders, so we tried it a year or rwo ago on her birthday.

My wife has never smoked cigarettes and found smoking weed very difficult. I dabbled with Marijuana a couple of times in student days but left it alone for 30 plus years, so it wasn't easy....I couldn't even remember how to skin up properly.

Eventually, after a lot of inept floundering, we both managed to get moderately stoned and enjoyed one of the first evenings in years where we were both able to giggle like lunatics - just some brief respite from dealing with the relentless daily grind of dealing with a progressive, crippling deisease

That seems pretty positive to me.

We won't be making a habit of it, and haven't repeated the experience but it was fun while it lasted.
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p
 
#155
Von Felgenhauer said:
No positive benefits yet the government owns the only patent for it citing its neuroprotectants US Government’s medical marijuana patent « Patients for Medical Cannabis
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The patent claims that -


“Cannabinoids have been found to have antioxidant properties, unrelated to NMDA receptor antagonism. This new found property makes cannabinoids useful in the treatment and prophylaxis of wide variety of oxidation associated diseases, such as ischemic, age-related, inflammatory and autoimmune diseases.The cannabinoids are found to have particular application as neuroprotectants, for example in limiting neurological damage following ischemic insults, such as stroke and trauma, or in the treatment of neurodegenerative diseases, such as Alzheimer’s disease, Parkinson’s disease and HIV dementia.”


The patent was obtained in October of 2003.

Thanks for posting that. I didn't think I could have less respect for our govt. than I did when I woke up, but you never know what a new day will bring.
 
#156
ShredderMaximus said:
I think for me, and a large percentage of other smokers is that it can really help you just chill out after a stressful day, and these are very stressful times we live in. Its just nice to come home after a long day of busting your a$$, light up a fattie, and just flip on the ol' boob tube and get a few laughs in at something you might not even find that funny usually and then call it a night. For me I've always been a serious night owl, even when I would have to work early in the morning, I just could never get myself to go to bed at even a relatively decent hour, but when I would smoke at around 10-11 or so, I would be falling asleep at midnight or so, which would make a world of a difference at work the next day when my performance would be notably better.

I've never seen any studies about it, but I really do believe that the stress relieving benefits of smoking could have a drastic effect on your health in a positive way, specifically on your heart. But hey, I'm in no way a scientist, but when I was smoking, I was generally just a happier more energetic, outgoing kind of guy. I never relied on it, but I did enjoy it.
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Thanks for this post. This is exactly one of the things that I believe to be truly harmful about marijuana. It's a mind altering chemical, that changes people's perception of things. My brother spent years doing exactly what you described above. Started just a few times a week, but eventually became his routine. Got to the point where he couldn't sleep without pot. I was the same way. I know lots and lots of other people who can't sleep without getting stoned. Lots of them. Anyhow, fast forward... my brother lost a lot of his income. He had a pretty good job. Now he delivers pizza. He's locked into a relationship with a completely non functional woman. He has no clue how to get himself out of a mess that he's in, and he's sinking quickly. He's not the greatest communicator, and I feel he's lost 15 years of learning how to deal with his emotions (or any problems for that mattter) because he got into the "healthy" habit of just going home to chill with blunt. Everything just fades away and the stuff that bothers you just doesn't bother you so much any more. And this is what lots and lots and lots of people are starting to do now. Maybe you (all the pot smoking advocates posting here) don't, but the vast majority of people who smoke reguarly are doing exactly what's described in the quoted post above. And it works so well, and feels so good, that they'll do anything they can to protect it. And get very angry if anything threatens it. None of you are addicted to pot, but if it were taken away from you you'd be wicked pissed. I love pizza. I eat it every single week. If you took it away I promise you I wouldn't get all that bent out of shape. Not quite the same with pot.

Also from my own experience. I got to the point in getting stoned where I wouldn't play music unless I was high. I was much more creative, much more connected, the music took on a character it just didn't have when I wasn't stoned. Ya know what... I was literally 1000X more productive after I put it down, and only then began to enjoy some success in my music. And I've had some considerable success. Not much got finished when I was stoned, and a lot more often than not what I created that I thought was completely awesome high, turned out to be pretty crappy stuff.

Getting back to the original thought here though, pot paints reality a different color. Intersting how many pot enthusiasts here don't trust the government regarding legalization, yet never give much thought to the fact that the way you're all using marijuana plays so incredibly well into a much bigger scenario. One that the government is IMO very happy about. A uneducated nation full of stoners is an awesome way for people in power to get exactly what they want. I don't know about you, but I want all my wits about me. I want to see clearly. Yeah, it's a sometimes frightening, stressful world, but I want to be in it and deal with it. Not run from or escape it.

When I smoked pot reguarly the world was colorful, and intense. Often humorous too. When I stopped, the world turned black & white. A lot of joy and excitement was sucked out of everything. My head turned into a pressure cooker that I was sure was going to explode. I had to learn new ways to cope, deal, and manage. As a result my life got exponentially more exciting. I started to live the things I fantasized about. Started to travel to the places I watched on TV screens. Started to really have an awesome life. I've got a lot of reasons to be teaching the benefits of not smoking pot. And I'm still not convinced there's anything good about this that I can be presenting to the kids.

And again, they're already on my side. They like me. They know I'm for real. I know this is a sensitive issue, and for the umpteenth time I'll state that that is the precise reason for this thread.
 
#157
As for any of the benefits that are being posted, I never denied that there were medical benefits. Medical benefits that I believe there are better alternatives to :), but in class, we won't be spending a whole lot of time on medical marijuana. That's not what teens are using it for. They're using it as a recreational drug, and leaning heavily on the fact that you can now get a prescription for it. You can get a prescription for oxycodone and valium too. 8 pages of people telling me I need to know more about the "other side" yet I haven't seen anything better than, it helps me make friends, and it helps me to chill, or escape and cope with world. If you were in the postion I'm in, how would you guys be teaching this?

The idea of presenting 2 sides of this and letting them figure it out on their own sounds great on paper, but in reality seems ludicrous to me. And I still don't know the other side. I will absolutely be telling them that I know of the "perceived" benefits. I know why they smoke. They know why they smoke. But it seems there's an ounce of benefit to a gallon of reasons against.
 
#160
Devils Advocate said:
As for any of the benefits that are being posted, I never denied that there were medical benefits. Medical benefits that I believe there are better alternatives to :), but in class, we won't be spending a whole lot of time on medical marijuana. That's not what teens are using it for. They're using it as a recreational drug, and leaning heavily on the fact that you can now get a prescription for it. You can get a prescription for oxycodone and valium too. 8 pages of people telling me I need to know more about the "other side" yet I haven't seen anything better than, it helps me make friends, and it helps me to chill, or escape and cope with world. If you were in the postion I'm in, how would you guys be teaching this?

The idea of presenting 2 sides of this and letting them figure it out on their own sounds great on paper, but in reality seems ludicrous to me. And I still don't know the other side. I will absolutely be telling them that I know of the "perceived" benefits. I know why they smoke. They know why they smoke. But it seems there's an ounce of benefit to a gallon of reasons against.
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You're being given plenty to work with, but this being a public forum for bassists, it's not exactly bound to be a database teeming with scientific data about this or that (even when it comes to tonewoods ;)), but being that I've done some research from both sides, here goes.

If you want resources advocating against its use and benefits, that's pretty easy to find - you needn't look further than the NIDA and DEA websites (and maybe DARE and ATI, while you're at it).

However, if you ask me, thoroughly understanding and acknowledging the arguments of both sides is necessary if you want to keep these kids' respect and actually teach them a thing or two.

Now, I'll warn you, the link I'm posting is from a pro cannabis website. Try to look past that. Click on the links. There's a whole lot of scientific data to sift through here, but since you want to pass on useful knowledge to these kids, a thorough understanding is fundamental.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
 

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