Ohh, yeah. Funny, I thought maybe there was a mention of one coming someday, but I can't find it now.
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I grilled Kevin about it one time, using battery clips/waterboarding/crying like a little girl and throwing a tantrum, and was told that one was NOT in the works.
In other news, I just decided on the following:
Fretless 5-String
Unlined Ebony Board w/20 Frets + 'Old Style' string retainer that passes over the B string
Unchambered Ash Body, 'PBass Shape', w/Olympic White Finish
Modern/M5-24 Pickup spacing closer to the bridge
Std Soapbars/Hardware
Portabag instead of case.
Basically a 20fret unlined fretless on a PBody and with Modern Pickup spacing.
Oh yeah!!!
Ahhh, oh well. Kinda' sad, but I decided against wanting the mid circuit anyway, so no problem for me.
Wow, that should be an AMAZING fretless!!
I want it to pass over all the strings. I'm sure the more scientific-minded TBers would line up to tell me that it makes no difference, but to me that extra little bit of downward pressure equals a tighter feeling string, if not more actual tension.
ElMon said:
Have you tried the new retainer or is this only a theory?
::Begins setting up Fisher-Price "My First Large Hadron Collider" set::
Have not tried it, but do know that it does not pass over the B string. And that to ME it makes a difference in the feel of the string. Be glad to fly over any TB'er expenses paid so that I can demonstrate a before and after test. Provided you like scotch and LOTS of it.
Hey how bout them Shadooski basses!!!
(I know a drummer who pronounces it this way. bless his pointy little head)
Install a B string that is long enough so it will wrap all the way to the bottom of the post. Adjust the retainer bar so it touches everything but the B string. Then lower the bar on the bass side and see if you can get any additional downbearing on the B. If so, compare feel of B. Then discuss!
Roger
ElMon, I kinda' have to side with Roger's decision to change and his implementation on this. It's really all about break angle over the nut.Have not tried it, but do know that it does not pass over the B string. And that to ME it makes a difference in the feel of the string. Be glad to fly over any TB'er expenses paid so that I can demonstrate a before and after test. Provided you like scotch and LOTS of it.
Hey how bout them Shadooski basses!!!
(I know a drummer who pronounces it this way. bless his pointy little head)
If you look carefully at the newly equipped basses, the other four strings pass through the retainer right about where the B string post is. So if you string the bass such that the B string comes off the bottom of the post, all 5 strings should have an identical break angle over the nut, since they'd all be coming from the same angle from the same point... and you get the added benefit of easier restringing, and at least IMHO, it looks nicer.
EDIT:
Roger sorta' beat me to it. LOL! Yeah, the key is the B string has to come off the bottom of the post.
ElMon said:
Hmmm... you make an interesting point about the break on the B string... depending on the height of the retainer bar I can see that the break might be greater than without. Although I wouldn't imagine Roger would go changing it without looking into every aspect of the change. Its not like he's a giant conglomerate trying to knock 2 cents on every unit to boost quarterly profit or anything.
I suppose that changing the strings with the new retainer is probably a lot easier than the bar... but I can see your point about wanting the bar... it looks like the new retainer is a NYC option only. I would think they'd still offer the older retainer as well.
Edit: I type way slow.
Sadowsky said:
Well, yeah... you could do that too I guess... you know, if you wanted to get all technical.
I give each string a complete amount of windings around each post so that it connects with the bottom portion. In fact I get pretty nerdy with my setups. I measure the string about 4.5 inches past the tuning post when stringing up, and then cut past there. Plenty of length. I also use a machinist's ruler to set my pickup/string heights, and I write down things I like and reuse them for different setups.
I also, even with strings making contact with bottom of each post, set my string retainer REAL low, about 3/32nd's from the surface of the headstock to the bottom of the retainer, equal on each side. This puts a pretty hard break angle. Recently moved around the string retainer on my Fender P5 so that it would put a similar angle on it's B string, and it feels much better and can take a lower setup without buzzing around the 2nd/3rd fret.
Hmmm... you make an interesting point about the break on the B string... depending on the height of the retainer bar I can see that the break might be greater than without. Although I wouldn't imagine Roger would go changing it without looking into every aspect of the change. Its not like he's a giant conglomerate trying to knock 2 cents on every unit to boost quarterly profit or anything.
I suppose that changing the strings with the new retainer is probably a lot easier than the bar... but I can see your point about wanting the bar... it looks like the new retainer is a NYC option only. I would think they'd still offer the older retainer as well.
Edit: I type way slow.
Well, yeah... you could do that too I guess... you know, if you wanted to get all technical.
Just MY way of getting the setup I'd like. Trial and error, and I even have a nerdy little notebook with my different setups/notes. With smiley faces to dot the 'I's'
Should give an example of what I'm talking about in measurable terms:
When I leave my extreme break angle, and measure from the bottom of the B string and the top of the 2nd fret, taking the time to lay the bass stably on the table and with a light to accurately read the ruler, I measure exactly 4/64ths. When I set the string retainer so that it's not touching the strings at all, taking the same measurement gives me exactly 3/64ths. So yeah, NOT a huge difference, and maybe not substantial for anyone but me to notice.
For some reason I can get a nice medium low setup with no buzz for my playing style. Love it. Although playing the bass without the tension on the strings, and considering that I switched to a heavier set of D'Addario XL's because they were out of the normal ones I get (I'm using 50-135 heavy gauge), I like what I'm feeling. YMMV
When I leave my extreme break angle, and measure from the bottom of the B string and the top of the 2nd fret, taking the time to lay the bass stably on the table and with a light to accurately read the ruler, I measure exactly 4/64ths. When I set the string retainer so that it's not touching the strings at all, taking the same measurement gives me exactly 3/64ths. So yeah, NOT a huge difference, and maybe not substantial for anyone but me to notice.
For some reason I can get a nice medium low setup with no buzz for my playing style. Love it. Although playing the bass without the tension on the strings, and considering that I switched to a heavier set of D'Addario XL's because they were out of the normal ones I get (I'm using 50-135 heavy gauge), I like what I'm feeling. YMMV
Sadowsky said:
If you're keeping track, put me down for a six string Sadowsky. I'd be putting a bunch of basses up for sale tomorrow if you offered one.
NOTE to anyone who wants to try this:
I used a digital caliper to measure the thickness of the head stock, took in account of how long the screw was on the string retainer, and went from there. How did I learn this?
By drilling a screw all the way thru the headstock on a cheaper bass trying to go after the same thing. D'Oh!!!!!!
By the way, following Roger's setup guide exactly with a machinist's ruler results in an extremely comfortable bass. I've used it on all kinds of builds to great effect.
I used a digital caliper to measure the thickness of the head stock, took in account of how long the screw was on the string retainer, and went from there. How did I learn this?
By drilling a screw all the way thru the headstock on a cheaper bass trying to go after the same thing. D'Oh!!!!!!
By the way, following Roger's setup guide exactly with a machinist's ruler results in an extremely comfortable bass. I've used it on all kinds of builds to great effect.
IMO, that's a HUGE difference! But I'm also extremely picky regarding my setups.
Well, ElMon's super low action didn't work for me in Southern California. The climate change was just too extreme and there ended up being too much fret buzz for me. The low B was extremely low compared to the other strings so it had to be raised up a bit. It's perfect now and I LOVE it. LOVE! LOVE! LOVE!
Well, the super low action didn't work for me in Southern California. The climate change was just too extreme and there ended up being too much fret buzz for me. The low B was extremely low compared to the other strings so it had to raised a bit. It's perfect now and I LOVE it. LOVE! LOVE! LOVE!
I had that bass setup with exactly 2/32nds underneath each string from the top of the 12th fret, without fretting the first fret. It was PERFECT for me on that bass. Since I've been playing upright a lot more I doubt I could hang on that setup any more!
I know, I know it was perfect.
I was shocked and just had to figure it was the climate change. LOL!
