Dingwall Owners Club

[AB Nate]

My apologies @BurningSkies , I just felt like I needed to say something on that front as with the “Canadian builds are better” front there also is the “Canadian builds aren’t needed” front and I feel it’s easy to forget that our opinions come from our own places of experience which often overlook key factors that significantly effect our peers.... (>guilty<)

 

[The_Owl]

If I wanted to order some Dingwall pickup shells, how would I be able to pay for them and the shipping (I'm in Sweden)? PayPal?

 

[spiritbass]

Depends, and I'm going to suggest that your Reeves is also doing something on the top end. My cab setup has a mid that goes fairly high but no tweeter...The DGTC has a high-mid control that doesn't touch the stuff really at the top. So you can boost/roll stuff in that high-mid-to-low-treble range...which for me on a live stage was just fine since my amp wasn't reproducing it anyway...

Yeah, the Reeves does also have a nice high end which my cabs are reproducing. I don't recall exactly which tweeters are in them, but they sound sweet...

 

[Selta]

So, having basically everything from a "cheap" (don't get me started, I know) NG3/10th anniversary, up to a Prima Artist, and having dozens of gigs on each along with hundreds of rehearsals, pit time, and practice at home on each Canadian model...
I dunno. The Canadians, yes, are a step above the Chinese (Combustion/NG etc). There's more options available if those options mean something to the buyer.
But, I think the Chinese ones still hold an important spot. They offer a very compelling set of features, plus all roll through the Canada shop for inspect/setup. If you ONLY want a Dingwall, 2x or 3x pickups, and EMG or DG pre, and no fancy wood or finish, well, you won't be served a whole lot better by stepping up to Canadian models. Heck, you can even get those decent quilt topped Chinese ones now, too. The line is certainly blurred.
The neck, I feel, is the big differentiation right now. This NG3/10th plays very well, but, I'm certainly noticing it taking slightly more effort to play than my ABs/Z/Prima. Setup overall is very nearly identical between them, though I don't know for sure what strings are on the NG. The "in the hand" feel of the NG, for me, is slightly slower and I hate the word, but, "clunkier". That's truly a terrible word for it - these are not chunky, fat, baseball necks in the slighest. But especially compared to my Z, it feels more... substantial? If that makes any sense.

I guess what I'm trying to say, is, I agree with BurningSkies. The Chinese models are very, very much top-notch basses and can serve any player in any situation. I don't think Nolly would lend his name to it if that weren't true, and there are a ton of other pro players out there on huge stages playing these. If the Canadian models weren't available, I'd be perfectly happy with a Combustion/NG. But, I like fancy, I like feeling like I'm handing Sheldon money directly (at hopefully higher markup), and I like the idea that some dudes/gals in Canada are putting their art into something I order from them. A sense of Pride, I suppose.

 

[packrat]

Worth noting that earlier combustions had much chunkier necks than today.

 

[BurningSkies]

I kind of agree and disagree.
The Combustion line is a killer line of bass.....tone and playability are top notch but they are not a Canadian build.

For my tastes, when I was looking at the wall at L and M the other day and there was the SP and the DG edition NG3, if I was to take one home it woulda been the DG NG3. for the simple reason it’s a long scale and more suitable for my desires. I’ve just never been a P guy.

I think some combustion’s actually surpass a lot of Canadian built basses for sure. They are the evolution, where as some of the older ones are “tame” in comparison but again then with that, that could be a great thing depending on preferences and genres.

I think even though the combustion line is the “entry level” Dingwall they are not bottom of the line but they are just a different tool.

if your a super player for one reason or another then you need a super.... not an NG.
If you want different woods or electronics for different characteristics then..... not an NG
If your playing style and body shape bonds with a different model then..... not an NG
also...... if you just want something custom and unique to you.... not an NG.
If you try to minimize your quantity of Made in china products in your life..... then not an NG.

a few reasons anyways.

Me, I know I could work to bond more so with the combustion’s but I got spoiled and familiar on the ergonomics of the Z while playing some pretty darn fast stuff. Switching to the NG was a challenge. With that, it wouldn’t be an issue playing the stuff I’m playing now.

In closing, I agree they are not to be.....looked down upon as a comparison but to counter the NG bandwagon.... they also just simply do not take the place of Canadian builds for numerous reasons.

I’ll probably own another again. I am very curious to put hands on a six string but I know, and I can say this with 100% confidence the neck will be a down grade in comfort and feel from my Z6 necks.... 100%. If I was a younger man with less funds to blow on crap I don’t need..... I’d be all over a 6 string bustin. No question.

I feel like you've misread what I said and then put a lot of energy into debating what I said.

At no point have I told anyone that the NG is better than another bass. Just that they're different and stand on their own.

I'm sorry that you've obviously felt targeted by my post.

 

[AB Nate]

If I wanted to order some Dingwall pickup shells, how would I be able to pay for them and the shipping (I'm in Sweden)? PayPal?

I would think so. Did you contact Dingwall?

 

[BurningSkies]

So, having basically everything from a "cheap" (don't get me started, I know) NG3/10th anniversary, up to a Prima Artist, and having dozens of gigs on each along with hundreds of rehearsals, pit time, and practice at home on each Canadian model...
I dunno. The Canadians, yes, are a step above the Chinese (Combustion/NG etc). There's more options available if those options mean something to the buyer.
But, I think the Chinese ones still hold an important spot. They offer a very compelling set of features, plus all roll through the Canada shop for inspect/setup. If you ONLY want a Dingwall, 2x or 3x pickups, and EMG or DG pre, and no fancy wood or finish, well, you won't be served a whole lot better by stepping up to Canadian models. Heck, you can even get those decent quilt topped Chinese ones now, too. The line is certainly blurred.
The neck, I feel, is the big differentiation right now. This NG3/10th plays very well, but, I'm certainly noticing it taking slightly more effort to play than my ABs/Z/Prima. Setup overall is very nearly identical between them, though I don't know for sure what strings are on the NG. The "in the hand" feel of the NG, for me, is slightly slower and I hate the word, but, "clunkier". That's truly a terrible word for it - these are not chunky, fat, baseball necks in the slighest. But especially compared to my Z, it feels more... substantial? If that makes any sense.

I guess what I'm trying to say, is, I agree with BurningSkies. The Chinese models are very, very much top-notch basses and can serve any player in any situation. I don't think Nolly would lend his name to it if that weren't true, and there are a ton of other pro players out there on huge stages playing these. If the Canadian models weren't available, I'd be perfectly happy with a Combustion/NG. But, I like fancy, I like feeling like I'm handing Sheldon money directly (at hopefully higher markup), and I like the idea that some dudes/gals in Canada are putting their art into something I order from them. A sense of Pride, I suppose.

For necks, the thickest Dingwall I have is my Voodoo Prima, it's neck profile is considerably thicker than any of my others.

I don't have my AB anymore but the feel of the more current combustion necks is really close, I think they're a hint thicker than an AB but not by far. They do have a different radius though. The AB is compound and the Combustions are standard.

The thinnest of necks is my Z, to the point where I wouldn't want it any thinner, and I know of a few Z users who felt it was too thin and caused some cramping. I think that sort of shows that something between Z and Combustion are the 'ideal' thickness for most.

...I've played all of these in the context of my band across the years...and tonally the one that's been favored by most band members and in the studio by a producer or two has been the Combustion w/ DGTC. They just like the way it sounds better. I find that my Z is a little more polite that it doesn't assert itself as much and my thought is that its good in some situations and not good in others. People seem to like the 'mids' in the NG...that is what comes up the most in comparison discussion. For the record the bass that people liked least in the band context was the Voodoo Prima, and that was an all around sound defeat.

I don't think that Sheldon lets anything pass through the shop that isn't good. To the same extent that I remember my AB and knowing that it was the 'entry' level model because while beautiful it obviously took less build time than a Z or a Prima, less options, less body contouring (that means less sanding detail, etc.) passive electronics, at that time no neck inlays, it has a straight pull headstock instead of a compound angled mitered tilte headstock. The Combustion has those kinds of decisions applied to it to be 'entry level'...but entry level for a $2000 bass isn't the same thing as entry level of a $300 bass.

 

[AB Nate]

I feel like you've misread what I said and then put a lot of energy into debating what I said.

At no point have I told anyone that the NG is better than another bass. Just that they're different and stand on their own.

I'm sorry that you've obviously felt targeted by my post.

First off let me say this. I have much respect for you and love Rootshock.

I didn’t feel targeted at all. Perhaps triggered to say something but knowing that you are the owner of the Rastaburst I don’t think I would feel targeted considering the source.

You made mention of Canadian built owners missing the point of the NGs and that is where I just disagree with you.
I merely wanted to state that it’s a preference of:
A B C and D. Etc.

 

[Selta]

For necks, the thickest Dingwall I have is my Voodoo Prima, it's neck profile is considerably thicker than any of my others.

I don't have my AB anymore but the feel of the more current combustion necks is really close, I think they're a hint thicker than an AB but not by far. They do have a different radius though. The AB is compound and the Combustions are standard.

The thinnest of necks is my Z, to the point where I wouldn't want it any thinner, and I know of a few Z users who felt it was too thin and caused some cramping. I think that sort of shows that something between Z and Combustion are the 'ideal' thickness for most.

...I've played all of these in the context of my band across the years...and tonally the one that's been favored by most band members and in the studio by a producer or two has been the Combustion w/ DGTC. They just like the way it sounds better. I find that my Z is a little more polite that it doesn't assert itself as much and my thought is that its good in some situations and not good in others. People seem to like the 'mids' in the NG...that is what comes up the most in comparison discussion. For the record the bass that people liked least in the band context was the Voodoo Prima, and that was an all around sound defeat.

I don't think that Sheldon lets anything pass through the shop that isn't good. To the same extent that I remember my AB and knowing that it was the 'entry' level model because while beautiful it obviously took less build time than a Z or a Prima, less options, less body contouring (that means less sanding detail, etc.) passive electronics, at that time no neck inlays, it has a straight pull headstock instead of a compound angled mitered tilte headstock. The Combustion has those kinds of decisions applied to it to be 'entry level'...but entry level for a $2000 bass isn't the same thing as entry level of a $300 bass.

Agreed . I'll also just mention that, somehow, oddly and counter-intuitive as it may be, the Prima I have is actually the most output and "massive" sounding of all my Dingwalls. Even with my 3x Z, AB, and now NG. The Prima's output is hotter, but also just overall way more "huge" sounding than every other bass I have. Which is why it's my main.

 

[BurningSkies]

First off let me say this. I have much respect for you and love Rootshock.

I didn’t feel targeted at all. Perhaps triggered to say something but knowing that you are the owner of the Rastaburst I don’t think I would feel targeted considering the source.

You made mention of Canadian built owners missing the point of the NGs and that is where I just disagree with you.
I merely wanted to state that it’s a preference of:
A B C and D. Etc.

There are a number of people on TB, FB, IG and a few other places who have stated to me that they won't try import Dingwalls. That's fine. People can make their own decisions. BUT they're missing out on part of the actual Dingwall line. The Combustions and the NGs are different, they have their own personality, their own sound and feel. I keep saying that. They stand on their own as their own models with their own tone and their own feel. When people act like they're knock offs of the real thing...they're missing that they're not.

 

[singlemalt]

The thing that stands out for me, is something I remember Sheldon saying in an interview. I don’t remember if it was a video or print interview.

Loosely paraphrased, Sheldon states that the Combustion line, and the decision to begin an overseas production saved the whole Dingwall enterprise. Without the imports, the Canadian products with the wide range of options would have had to fold. All that effort and the jobs of the entire operation would have ended.

Globalization is what it is. My kites, shoes, boots, tools, pretty much everything, including the whole kitchen and sink is imports. Even my Ford van probably has import parts.

I haven’t had an opportunity to try an import, but I hope to at some point. If the spec sheets are accurate, the Dbird neck should be a close match to the AB neck, minus a couple frets.

I wouldn’t do extensive mods on a Canadian model. I’d just sell it as is. But I could see going to town on a dbird or combustion.

I always buy used, so I’ll be watching the used market. (Like always). So far, used imports are not showing up at a compelling discount. And there’s a wait list for many models at the dealers. Reviews have been very positive.

I could see myself trying an import at some point.

 

[AB Nate]

There are a number of people on TB, FB, IG and a few other places who have stated to me that they won't try import Dingwalls. That's fine. People can make their own decisions. BUT they're missing out on part of the actual Dingwall line. The Combustions and the NGs are different, they have their own personality, their own sound and feel. I keep saying that. They stand on their own as their own models with their own tone and their own feel. When people act like they're knock offs of the real thing...they're missing that they're not.

This I agree with 100% and I see. I’ve never really heard anyone say just that before I guess. They are a valuable tool.

matter of fact.... I’d be very tempted by a production super J if they ever come to exist.

 

[Lowendtech]

I’d be very tempted by a production super J if they ever come to exist.

I’d probably have a few myself. Like 1/2 dozen few.

 

[Smallmouth_Bass]

I have never owned a Z or Prima but have had the opportunity to try a few and I thought the necks felt very thin back to front. I haven't tried any recent batches of Combustions or NG's, but my v1 Combustion has a bit of a chunky neck. I tried a v3 that had an even chunkier neck.

Even between my two AB's, even though the overall shape is the same, one is a little chunkier than the other and they have their own personalities. I don't mind having a chunky-ish neck.

If I remember correctly, the initial Combustion model was meant to be a useable stand alone bass, but also designed to be a launch board for modifications if you wanted to go down that route. Everything from the standard pickup shape to the hardware. Since then, they have evolved into their own more distinct models. The hardware is higher quality, they've gone to the same pickups as their Canadian models and the preamps are different. But the pricing has also gone up too. The original Combustions were in the $1100 - $1200 range and now I think they're in the $2000+ range.

 

[spiritbass]

Loosely paraphrased, Sheldon states that the Combustion line, and the decision to begin an overseas production saved the whole Dingwall enterprise. Without the imports, the Canadian products with the wide range of options would have had to fold. All that effort and the jobs of the entire operation would have ended.

You beat me to this very important point. All this and the fact that they are excellent instruments.

 

[BurningSkies]

The thing that stands out for me, is something I remember Sheldon saying in an interview. I don’t remember if it was a video or print interview.

Loosely paraphrased, Sheldon states that the Combustion line, and the decision to begin an overseas production saved the whole Dingwall enterprise. Without the imports, the Canadian products with the wide range of options would have had to fold. All that effort and the jobs of the entire operation would have ended.

Globalization is what it is. My kites, shoes, boots, tools, pretty much everything, including the whole kitchen and sink is imports. Even my Ford van probably has import parts.

I haven’t had an opportunity to try an import, but I hope to at some point. If the spec sheets are accurate, the Dbird neck should be a close match to the AB neck, minus a couple frets.

I wouldn’t do extensive mods on a Canadian model. I’d just sell it as is. But I could see going to town on a dbird or combustion.

I always buy used, so I’ll be watching the used market. (Like always). So far, used imports are not showing up at a compelling discount. And there’s a wait list for many models at the dealers. Reviews have been very positive.

I could see myself trying an import at some point.

Yep...that was the Scott Devine interview right? Yeah, there was an era of big backlog and lots of custom work and I think that ended up stressing the shop in their cashflow, also the burgeoning of success of the Super series I think was a mixed blessing.

I can say that when I went to Sheldon a couple years ago and asked him for some guidance as I retired the Rastaburst from regular road work...I asked if I were looking at a stripped down Z, an AB or something else. He told me to try the NG and that he thought I'd be really happy with it. And I was.

Along the way, I've asked the Dingwall Guitars people some questions...for one of our videos that we knew would get a certain amount of attention for, I asked if they'd rather the Rastaburst or the NG in the video. The reply was "the NG". When I needed a picture for the Dingwall website for the artists page I again asked if they wanted the Z or the NG. They asked for the NG. I think not only is it the side of the bread that's buttered for the shop, but I think it's an instrument they believe in. And after a few hundred shows...I believe too.

I have never owned a Z or Prima but have had the opportunity to try a few and I thought the necks felt very thin back to front. I haven't tried any recent batches of Combustions or NG's, but my v1 Combustion has a bit of a chunky neck. I tried a v3 that had an even chunkier neck.

Even between my two AB's, even though the overall shape is the same, one is a little chunkier than the other and they have their own personalities. I don't mind having a chunky-ish neck.

If I remember correctly, the initial Combustion model was meant to be a useable stand alone bass, but also designed to be a launch board for modifications if you wanted to go down that route. Everything from the standard pickup shape to the hardware. Since then, they have evolved into their own more distinct models. The hardware is higher quality, they've gone to the same pickups as their Canadian models and the preamps are different. But the pricing has also gone up too. The original Combustions were in the $1100 - $1200 range and now I think they're in the $2000+ range.

The idea originally was to launch a bass that would introduce a wider playing audience to Dingwall and the fanned fret benefits and aethetics. You may have been part of those original discussions on the original message board where we discussed how to make the bass ride the line between traditional, comfortable and familiar as well as still having it's own Dingwall personality. I distinctly remember discussing the neck-joint fretboard end and the idea of curving it rather than the AB-style fixture to make it a little more traditional to the average Fender player. The pickguard, the chrome, the dot inlays (AB's were blank boarded at the time) and the finishes all spoke to the more 'traditional' look. Though the pickguard was optional.

The original original idea was to come in right around $1K, IIRC.

 

[Smallmouth_Bass]

The idea originally was to launch a bass that would introduce a wider playing audience to Dingwall and the fanned fret benefits and aethetics. You may have been part of those original discussions on the original message board where we discussed how to make the bass ride the line between traditional, comfortable and familiar as well as still having it's own Dingwall personality. I distinctly remember discussing the neck-joint fretboard end and the idea of curving it rather than the AB-style fixture to make it a little more traditional to the average Fender player. The pickguard, the chrome, the dot inlays (AB's were blank boarded at the time) and the finishes all spoke to the more 'traditional' look. Though the pickguard was optional.

The original original idea was to come in right around $1K, IIRC.

If it weren't for a small group trying to make the minimum order for the candy apple green finish in that first run, I don't think I would have one. I certainly didn't need another.

 

[BurningSkies]

If it weren't for a small group trying to make the minimum order for the candy apple green finish in that first run, I don't think I would have one. I certainly didn't need another.

When those occasionally surface, I'm always taken back to those discussions. I'd only recently gotten the Rastaburst, so I wasn't really looking for more. Even my AB was sitting in a case under the bed for a few years.

 

[Smallmouth_Bass]

Someone was asking about a SuperP with no pickguard a few pages back. I started scouring the early pages of this thread to see if I could find the photo, and it's interesting to re-read the conversations from that long ago; the anticipation of new models and the discussions on what we'd like to see.