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Do you encourage less skilled musicians?

#62
There is a long tradition of experienced bandleader teaching talented but inexperienced musicians: Art Blakey, Chick Corey, Miles Davis, etc.

Chick gave Stanley Clarke and John Patitucci (among many others) their big break. I think it’s a really important part of how musicianship develops in a culture. We should all contribute to this, we all have something we can teach others, just as we all have something we can learn from them.
 
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#63
I played in the house Band, for a Blues Jam for two years. During this time I encountered many lesser skilled player and beginners. I was happy to help the one who wanted help.
But it was amazing how many bad musicians, would try to bull poopie there way through the jam. And did not care about playing together with the rest of the players.
This thought me to seek out players of my own level, or higher for any Band I join.
 
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#65
Kyllsa said:
You guys are amazing.

Ik spreek Nederlands, maar soms kan ik niet goed verstaan! I've learned a lot of Dutch; my husband and his in-laws are Dutch, as are most of my friends. It is fortunate - and humbling - that so many here speak such good English. It's less fortunate that the law mandates I learn Dutch, and speaking English doesn't help that =D

I would very much like to find jam sessions to drop by, play, and learn. I do not intend to quit! I get frustrated and feel like I will never learn and all that as I am sure everyone does, but I will keep at it.

In short, this thread generated some wonderful responses. That's pretty awesome!
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It's been almost 10 years since I last gigged with him, but you might look up Lamar Chase. He's from Oakland, California and has for many years been based in Amsterdam. He used to run an open-mic at the [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] there. He's the whole package: great player, singer, and larger-than-life personality.
 
#66
brianrost said:
There is a subtle difference though between players who are trying to improve and those that don't know they need to improve. For the latter, I just don't want to have to play with them :roflmao:
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This. Also, players who know they need to improve, but don't do the work.

I don't mind at all playing with people who may not be as far along as me; I was there once too. But don't expect me to carry/drag you because you're lazy. I'll support your growth, just don't stunt mine.
 
#67
smeet said:
There is a long tradition of experienced bandleader teaching talented but inexperienced musicians: Art Blakey, Chick Corey, Miles Davis, etc.

Chick gave Stanley Clarke and John Patitucci (among many others) their big break. I think it’s a really important part of how musicianship develops in a culture. We should all contribute to this, we all have something we can teach others, just as we all have something we can learn from them.
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Well said!
 
#68
I never in my life talked down to a musician. Pretty sure I never put a musician down on this forum either, not even those guys who I’ll admit crack me up :). I’ll help any musician I can if they want my help. I’ll help people with anything I feel I do well, or have more experience with.

It makes us both feel good.
 
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#71
Wow! Thanks for all the comments! There have been a lot of very thoughtful replies! It seems I wasn't very clear: I was asking about encouraging, not being in a band with much less experienced players. I agree totally with wanting to be in a band w/players as good as or even better than me. Been there, got the T-shirt(s).
I was talking more about musicians we see/hear when out and about (gigs, jams, friends' kids, etcetera). I was meaning more like words of encouragement, offering help (could be advice on gear, a better bass line on a certain song, a pat on the back, spending a bit of time with, talking or playing bass, whatever). Again, thanks to all!
 
#73
I would add Herbie, Kenton, Maynard to that list.

smeet said:
There is a long tradition of experienced bandleader teaching talented but inexperienced musicians: Art Blakey, Chick Corey, Miles Davis, etc.

Chick gave Stanley Clarke and John Patitucci (among many others) their big break. I think it’s a really important part of how musicianship develops in a culture. We should all contribute to this, we all have something we can teach others, just as we all have something we can learn from them.
Click to expand...
 
#74
Joedog said:
Wow! Thanks for all the comments! There have been a lot of very thoughtful replies! It seems I wasn't very clear: I was asking about encouraging, not being in a band with much less experienced players. I agree totally with wanting to be in a band w/players as good as or even better than me. Been there, got the T-shirt(s).
I was talking more about musicians we see/hear when out and about (gigs, jams, friends' kids, etcetera). I was meaning more like words of encouragement, offering help (could be advice on gear, a better bass line on a certain song, a pat on the back, spending a bit of time with, talking or playing bass, whatever). Again, thanks to all!
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I generally don't encourage or comment in public to/about musicians I go to see/hear - if I DON'T KNOW them - other than a casual "you sound great" that they hear from others. Those I KNOW are a different matter because most want the truth about the mix, the timing, yada, yada, yada, but ONLY if they ask!
But I'm pretty much like other gigging musicians.. I DON'T want to play with beginners. I do that at church. I encourage, compliment and so on.
I want the best musicians I can have in my gigging band. Experience and skill makes things so much easier.
That said. .I do NOT consider myself much of a bassist. I happened to play in a well-known top local band with some great guys. That ended last June after 4 yrs, but I'm still learning.
Having come from playing lead guitar for 15+ yrs, the best compliment I've had was when another bassist told me I didn't sound like I used to be a guitar player !! That was nice :)
 
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#76
When I was gigging with the church band, there were others who wanted to play too. One kid about 12, just starting on the bass. He was asking me things and I showed him and it felt kinda nice to be looked up to for a change. We also tried a drummer who would progressively slow way down through songs, but I wouldn't know where to start with that. We ended up choosing a different one to gig with, but let the first guy practice with us some. After I quit the band due to family, the guy who replaced me was a natural great player. That was nice to see. I can appreciate someone at any talent level as long as they have a good attitude. We all think differently and we all can learn something from one another.
 
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#77
eJake said:
Im confused as to how rock = young....? Joe Dart looks like he's 15. Young music I hear has really good bass lines these days.
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You're confusing me... how did you get rock = young when I stated young = rock? How many young electric bass players get into it to play jazz or latin beat? I didn't say all young people play rock I said chances are. I also never said ALL popular music had less than exciting bass lines... why am I having to explain this?
 
#78
Kyllsa said:
Im one of those less skilled players. Im in a new country (im American, I moved to the Netherlands 3 years ago) and would love nothing more than to meet some other musicians to jam with and learn from. Between my crippling shyness, the language barrier yet, and this sort of attitude, I fear I may never find people to play with and learn from. More established musicians looking down the length of their nose at me because I sometimes still flub a simple ii v I or a 12 bar blues line doesn't do any favours for any of us.
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Introversion is on a scale: a shy person can become more extroverted. Now, you won't become an extrovert - think a door-to-door salesman, President Clinton, or a friendly Golden Retriever in a park - but you can definitely feel comfortable about meeting new people.

Do not underestimate a smile & a Hi. A trip abroad is a perfect opportunity to practice getting in the game, because you have to (excuse me, where's the bathroom...). Bonus points for a few Dutch words, since the rest of the planet assumes Americans only know English - people will appreciate the effort. The trick is you don't have to carry the conversation: just ask a question. If you stay curious - which is easy when you travel since everything's new - the answer can lead to a follow up question, or ask another question.

Throw in some instruments, and some people would call it Jazz. Want to play overseas? Find some musicians: schools, concerts,... Also consider learning some Dutch folk music. There will be plenty of helpful musicians willing to help someone interested, and no one will expect immediate greatness. If you're a Rocker at heart, well musicians know musicians, you got some extrovert practice, & you learned some music new to you.
 
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#79
jackstraw316 said:
You're confusing me... how did you get rock = young when I stated young = rock? How many young electric bass players get into it to play jazz or latin beat? I didn't say all young people play rock I said chances are. I also never said ALL popular music had less than exciting bass lines... why am I having to explain this?
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Because (to me) you sound like you are disconnected from the youth yet making inferences about them....? My apologies if I misjudged you, but your post rubbed me funny.
 
#80
As a former public school band director, my answer, of course, is yes. It was my job.

As a gigging musician, my answer is no. Not my job.

That said, however, I won’t be mean. If I’m asked a musical question, I’ll do my best answer it. I just don’t seek out the professional development role on gigs.
 

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