• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

fEARLESS F210

#61
If I had to bet a dollar I would say that two F110's would be a killer little rig in its own right. I have yet to play a 3010LF loaded cab, but I expect these to be in a similar wheel house as the F112. Which means they can go from rock, to jazz, to funk with the right eq bumps.


So now the question is, have you been able to run the F110 and F210 stacked?
 
#62
CL400Peavey said:
If I had to bet a dollar I would say that two F110's would be a killer little rig in its own right. I have yet to play a 3010LF loaded cab, but I expect these to be in a similar wheel house as the F112. Which means they can go from rock, to jazz, to funk with the right eq bumps.


So now the question is, have you been able to run the F110 and F210 stacked?
Click to expand...

I agree, two F110s would still be an absolute killer rig.

I can't run the F110/F210 together as I no longer have sub-4 ohm amps.
 
#63
JxBass said:
I agree, two F110s would still be an absolute killer rig.

I can't run the F110/F210 together as I no longer have sub-4 ohm amps.
Click to expand...

You have two of those TecAmps? Run a patch cable betwen the Pre on one, and the power section on the other.


I can tell you from my experiance that there is indeed some "two woofer" magic. I have heard it when comparing a 15/6 to a 1515/66, and a single 12/6 to a pair. I think the F210 is the perfect way to get that dual woofer factor in a small size.


Now we just need an A/B between the 210 and 115. :D
 
#66
Would installing corner handles on both sides of the top of the F210 make it easier to handle - especially for a two-handed direct lift of two feet?

I got two hernias from lifting heavy bass gear around San Francisco and am now very cautious about safety. A one-handed lift of 48-50 pounds does not seem like a safe, balanced way to lift and carry this cab, even if you're just pulling it up to grab the bottom with the other hand.
 

Attachments

  • corner handle.jpg
    corner handle.jpg
    5.4 KB · Views: 143
#67
I think that because of its shape any two-hand lift would be awkward, IMO. I have a great fold up cart, a Kart-A-Bag Concorde, that I would use to haul it between point A and B. The single handle is all I would need to move it a short distance.

If this cab was 2-3 inches shorter and 4-5 pounds lighter it would be a great lift/carry for anyone, regardless of their height and other restrictions, again IMHO.
 
#68
Awkward is one thing, but SAFE is another. I'm trying to get my arms around the geometry of the F210 an potential options.

I also have a fold up cart. Buy since I live in the country, I have to drag it across unpaved ground and then lift the cab into a pickup truck. It's not like a residential thing where you glide from one garage into another. There would be at least four two-foot dead lifts with this cab every time it left the house, and possibly more depending on requirements of the stage area.
 
#69
Ukiah Bass said:
Awkward is one thing, but SAFE is another. I'm trying to get my arms around the geometry of the F210 an potential options.

I also have a fold up cart. Buy since I live in the country, I have to drag it across unpaved ground and then lift the cab into a pickup truck. It's not like a residential thing where you glide from one garage into another. There would be at least four two-foot dead lifts with this cab every time it left the house, and possibly more depending on requirements of the stage area.
Click to expand...

Yes with that kind of weight restriction, you have limited choices. I would actually suggest a single F112 over one 210 or two 110's for you. I played one that was 33 pounds, and had stunning output.
 
  • Like
Reactions: puff father
#70
I was also wondering about the physics of loudness. Why would a single F210 produce more volume than two F110s?

I presume the optimal settings for using two F110s would be turning the tweeter off on one cab and setting both cabs to the "reduced" setting for the mid drivers. Also having the tweeter and mid off-set on one F110 would create alignment for a perfect pair.
 
#71
Ukiah Bass said:
I was also wondering about the physics of loudness. Why would a single F210 produce more volume than two F110s?

I presume the optimal settings for using two F110s would be turning the tweeter off on one cab and setting both cabs to the "reduced" setting for the mid drivers. Also having the tweeter and mid off-set on one F110 would create alignment for a perfect pair.
Click to expand...

That sounds exactly correct...I wouldn't think either would be 'louder.' It can see a possibility that the F210 could be a little bassier, where as obviously the 2x F110 stack would have a stronger mid presence. I have run an F115/F112 stack and can tell you it's glorious :)
 
#72
jnewmark said:
How does BFM's designs compare ? I had a Jack 210 some years ago built for me at about half the price.

http://www.billfitzmaurice.com/Jack.html
Click to expand...

The BFM Jack will play 3-6db louder per watt in the bandwidth where the horn is effective. Depending on the size of Jack, that range is somewhere from 100-175hz to roughly 1khz. It operates as a simple bass reflex cab above and below that. So it's basically like betwern doubling to quadrupling your amp power from the upper bass to the middle mids while being like a "regular cab" in the lows and uppermids. (ognoring HF components here, those will have high sensitivity as well and crazy wide dispersion to boot.)


Question to the builders....If the 3010LF has the same motor steicture as the 12 and 15, what's up with the low sensitivity? If the accrleration is greater, it should have better topend, no?




Note to all this "mine takes 900 watts stuff". The 15 is a 450 watt driver, period, end of story. Yes, it can "take the pounding" of a 900 or 1500 watt bass amp...because it is absolutely not putting out anywhere near that power continuously....rather a small fraction of it.

Also, something that gets ignored way too often around here when people go about adding up decibels and watts....is thermal, power compression. Over time (like at a gig), even the best speakers will lose a good 3db to this....so...cut all your numbers in half and tey again....


This applies to all speakers....going "full bore"...I figure I'm punching you in the chest with a solid 50-80 watts out of my potential 200-400.:smug:
 
#74
The Jacks are really bizarre as bass cabs because they add a ton of sensitivity in a region you don't need sensitivity in. Loudness from 200-1khz is cheap. Making a sacrifice of sensitivity at 200hz to get more at 80hz is almost invariably a good thing for a bass player. Need more 200hz? turn up the low mids.

Need more 80hz? There's no replacement for displacement :P

I say this as a happy Jack 112 owner, I just realize its limitations.
 
#75
rpsands said:
The Jacks are really bizarre as bass cabs because they add a ton of sensitivity in a region you don't need sensitivity in. Loudness from 200-1khz is cheap. Making a sacrifice of sensitivity at 200hz to get more at 80hz is almost invariably a good thing for a bass player. Need more 200hz? turn up the low mids.

Need more 80hz? There's no replacement for displacement :P

I say this as a happy Jack 112 owner, I just realize its limitations.
Click to expand...

I would pretty much agree....though I rather view them as "cabs", rather than "bass cabs". Sort of more of a PA approach...in which case I'm going to push a button and take away all the extra an "LF" speaker gives you....because that's where the kick drum goes...not the bass. :)
 
#76
will33 said:
Question to the builders....If the 3010LF has the same motor structure as the 12 and 15, what's up with the low sensitivity? If the accrleration is greater, it should have better topend, no


:
Click to expand...

The 3010lf has an astoundingly low fs for a 93db 10" driver. In talking with the designer of the Lf's I was told that to get a low fs on a smaller driver one sacrifices efficiency. The Lf's are a pretty remarkable balancing act between EXTREME Xmax and efficiency. One thing I can say about the 3010lf---it has a lower QTS than the other Lf's. In my experience it yields a little more of a small dip in bass response curve (not extension) and a tighter bass response.

While the 15" cabs will go a bit louder the 10" based cabs will have a bit of a different bass voicing. A voicing that I like. A bit less spread, a bit more focused but still with plenty of extension. You might need to kick up the bass control a little bit, but a very nice voicing.

All of the Kappalites need to be crossed over to a mid driver--so the upper response of the 3010's is a moot point.

You have to think of the f210 as a different flavor than the 12's or 15's---it's not just a matter of "which goes louder"----it's more of which type of bass response you prefer. I dig the 10's for my needs---but I love the f112, too.
 
#80
Ukiah Bass said:
I was also wondering about the physics of loudness. Why would a single F210 produce more volume than two F110s?

I presume the optimal settings for using two F110s would be turning the tweeter off on one cab and setting both cabs to the "reduced" setting for the mid drivers. Also having the tweeter and mid off-set on one F110 would create alignment for a perfect pair.
Click to expand...

Wondering if you've spoken with greenboy lately...he's doing a sub for the F110, which will most likely put it in the same ballpark sonically as the F210, but the sub cab should weigh quite a bit less than the F110 :)
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back