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fEARLESS F210

#81
dukeorock said:
Wondering if you've spoken with greenboy lately...he's doing a sub for the F110, which will most likely put it in the same ballpark sonically as the F210, but the sub cab should weigh quite a bit less than the F110 :)
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Haven't talked w/Dave for a couple weeks. I gave the two-cab vs. one-cab solution a lot of thought. There are trade offs, as with everything in life. My conclusion was if I went with a 2-cab solution, I'd want the cabs to be identical in order to provide more flexibility - specifically, being able to leave them in different locations and have identical sonic capability. The downside of using 2 cabs is more hassle for load-in and load-out. Love the form factor of a single F110, but stacking two on a hand cart seems unstable due to the asymmetrical shape.

My principal issue with the F210 was it weights slightly more than I'd prefer, and the top-handle design is (for me) somewhat awkward for lifting 50 pounds. The benefit of a F210 is ease of transporting a single high-volume cab that includes the sonic benefit of a dual-driver configuration.

I decided to go with a F210, but have two side handles (shown below) mounted about 1/3 down from the top. Two screws on the port side will enter the lateral port brace. jHAWK recommended these handles as they are lightweight and each provide 88 pounds of lift capacity. The combined capacity of 176lbs will cover the 50lb cab (incl kickstand). Most important: they enable a two-handed lift, which means I can squat down and safely lift the cab onto my cart, into and out of my pickup truck, or on and off a stage.

The handles are the Penn Elcom H1008-00
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#82
Ukiah Bass said:
Haven't talked w/Dave for a couple weeks. I gave the two-cab vs. one-cab solution a lot of thought. There are trade offs, as with everything in life. My conclusion was if I went with a 2-cab solution, I'd want the cabs to be identical in order to provide more flexibility - specifically, being able to leave them in different locations and have identical sonic capability. The downside of using 2 cabs is more hassle for load-in and load-out. Love the form factor of a single F110, but stacking two on a hand cart seems unstable due to the asymmetrical shape.

My principal issue with the F210 was it weights slightly more than I'd prefer, and the top-handle design is (for me) somewhat awkward for lifting 50 pounds. The benefit of a F210 is ease of transporting a single high-volume cab that includes the sonic benefit of a dual-driver configuration.

I decided to go with a F210, but have two side handles (shown below) mounted about 1/3 down from the top. Two screws on the port side will enter the lateral port brace. jHAWK recommended these handles as they are lightweight and each provide 88 pounds of lift capacity. The combined capacity of 176lbs will cover the 50lb cab (incl kickstand). Most important: they enable a two-handed lift, which means I can squat down and safely lift the cab onto my cart, into and out of my pickup truck, or on and off a stage.

The handles are the Penn Elcom H1008-00
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
Click to expand...

I always go back and forth on stuff like that...I'm 6'4" and about 235, my partner in BNA is about 5'6" maybe 130 lbs...it helps us find the right middle ground for handle locations :)

We're doing an F210 for a fella that's gonna have tilt wheels, so that's an option as well...at my height, the tilt wheels would've not really crossed my mind...to much bending over for that 'convenience' :)
 
#83
dukeorock said:
We'll be building F210 very soon, so I can provide more detail then, but having heard the F110, F112, F115 and F215 and from many talks with greenboy on the subject I think I can safely say;

The F110 and F112 sound virtually identical, with the F112 being capable of a little more SPL. The F115 sounds similar, but has much higher sensitivity and feels a little 'girthier' in the lows. Girthier? Haha! Anyway, that's my perception after gigging these cabs, and the specs line up with that perception.

What I see as the pros and cons of the F210 are;

PROS-
Small, lightweight 4ohm cab
Two woofer cabs tend to have a certain magic in most cases; a somewhat more 'enveloping' sound in the lows...they seem to just fill up a bit more space. greenboy would say the same thing.

Cons-
Price; the 3010LF costs the same as a 3015LF, so the lighter weight 4 ohm cab with a small amount of extra SPL is a few hundred bucks more expensive than the F115. The higher sensitivity of the 3015LF is just tough to beat. Honestly it costs us maybe $50 less to build an F210 as it does big ol' F215. So that awesome little 4 ohm cab is super cool, but comes with a pricetag to match :)

All that to say, the F115 is the best value and our biggest seller by far these days for very good reason. I plan on building and gigging an F210 just to see what it can do. I currently run 500-800 at 8ohms watts into my F112 and F115 and have no fears about hurting the cab. I'll be running 900-1,200 into the F210, though I won't be diming the amps for any of my upcoming gigs.

Hope that helps :)
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Bang-for-the-buck (as in lots of bang :D), 115s & 215s w/3015LFs, 3015s, 15PR400s (with/without dedicated mid(s) and/or high frequency horn) just plain old rule the roost.

There are other formats with super drivers that can come close & may satisfy one particular need or another a bit better (usually smaller size/footprint I'd venture to say), but they still lag in outright B-4-B.
 
#84
Mike Arnopol said:
The 3010lf has an astoundingly low fs for a 93db 10" driver. In talking with the designer of the Lf's I was told that to get a low fs on a smaller driver one sacrifices efficiency. The Lf's are a pretty remarkable balancing act between EXTREME Xmax and efficiency. One thing I can say about the 3010lf---it has a lower QTS than the other Lf's. In my experience it yields a little more of a small dip in bass response curve (not extension) and a tighter bass response.

While the 15" cabs will go a bit louder the 10" based cabs will have a bit of a different bass voicing. A voicing that I like. A bit less spread, a bit more focused but still with plenty of extension. You might need to kick up the bass control a little bit, but a very nice voicing.

All of the Kappalites need to be crossed over to a mid driver--so the upper response of the 3010's is a moot point.

You have to think of the f210 as a different flavor than the 12's or 15's---it's not just a matter of "which goes louder"----it's more of which type of bass response you prefer. I dig the 10's for my needs---but I love the f112, too.
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All the LFs you're talking about, right?
 
#87
CL400Peavey said:
None of the plans for the fEARless or "greenboy" cabs (i.e. dually, bassic) are available. They are only available as a finished product from one of greenboy's authorized builders. The fEARful plans are still free though.
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To add about the specs.

the 3010lf is good for an honest 400 or so watts and the rest of the driver specs can be found on Eminence's site. As far as how loud it will go... With the right applicaiton of power the F110 will get about as loud as a good 210, the F210 will be about as loud as a good 410.
 
#90
CL400Peavey said:
There are lots of great mid drivers out there. I would hunt through Eminence and Faital Pro's site to find something that works for your design.
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You misunderstand me. I like the Fearless design and would like to see if I could use the BP102's rather than than the Kappalite's.

I realize there are a multitude of factors such as crossover frequency and mid driver efficiency that would affect the voice of the design when using the BP102's.

An alternative would be to make 2 2x10 sealed cabinets with the dimensions of 1/4 an SVT 8x10.
 
#91
77PBass said:
You misunderstand me. I like the Fearless design and would like to see if I could use the BP102's rather than than the Kappalite's.

I realize there are a multitude of factors such as crossover frequency and mid driver efficiency that would affect the voice of the design when using the BP102's.

An alternative would be to make 2 2x10 sealed cabinets with the dimensions of 1/4 an SVT 8x10.
Click to expand...

Ah I see. No I would not expect those drivers to work in this cab, as it was designed around the 3010LF.

I think design discussion of other cabs is best served up in another thread though. Lots of guys around here to chime in on design of a cab around the speakers you have.
 
#92
CL400Peavey said:
Ah I see. No I would not expect those drivers to work in this cab, as it was designed around the 3010LF.

I think design discussion of other cabs is best served up in another thread though. Lots of guys around here to chime in on design of a cab around the speakers you have.
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Uh, ok thanks....didn't mean to sully your conversation. Carry on.
 
#93
77PBass said:
Uh, ok thanks....didn't mean to sully your conversation. Carry on.
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I think CL400Peavey was just trying to be helpful, honestly. Posting these questions in another thread wasn't an attempt to 'get rid of you,' as much as it was an attempt to help you find answers to your question in a better way. There's tons of folks who could help you come up with a well balanced cab based on your drivers of choice.

In the case of greenboy's designs, the cab is very methodically built to take full advantage of specific drivers that he chose, so to look around for alternative drivers is fine, just not for greenboy designs, because we already know what works best in his cabs.

Hope that helps and I hope you get the perfect cab(s) for your needs!
 
#94
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This examples came from Dukeorock at:

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But all the GB builders are making em.

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Not a big 10" fan myself... but I gotta admit that looks pretty cool. And some of the early reviews sound promising if you need dynamite in a small package. :hyper:

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#98
Templar said:
Beautiful.

A pair stacked vertically would be twice as beautiful!
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If you have a 2 ohm capable amp, yes that would be pretty sweet :)

I will say this is far from a typical 210 cab...has the mid driver...safely handles 900-1,000 watts. I'd put it up against pretty much any 410 :)
 

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