I've been using the Vintage channel to get a lovely clean tone with my baritone Tele, but I've been struggling to get an OD tone I like on the other channel. I'll have to look into it again, because I love the Overdrive channel with my P bass.
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Fender Bassman 100T - chapter 2
- Thread starter BassyBill
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Hey Freight Train!
I particularly enjoyed reading your early posts about this amp in chapter one! Your comments about the use of the 410 Neo were instrumental in pushing me over the cliff and returning the Ashdown and buying the 410 instead!
I had a Bugera BVP5500 before the Bassman and bought the Ashdown at the same time. The Bugera turned out to be defective, so I decided to stop screwing around and buy something I knew, and that was the Bassman. I certainly didn't expect it to blow away my memory of how a vintage Bassman sounds, but damned if it did! By a mile! I think this is the best Bassman head Fender has ever made! And I don't say that lightly!
As for the 410 cab... If I had bought the 100T first, I probably would have popped for the 410 too cause they look so cool together! But your experience at gigs with that combo put all my concerns to rest in spades!
THANK YOU!!
As far as tubes go... Yeah... It is a hard thing to quantify and there is a lot of voodoo BS out there about them too. Some of the claims about the advantages of NOS tubes are true of course, but a lot of it is just BS. I can hear the difference in various brands of power tubes, but I have been listening to these differences for 30 years now, and they are subtle and I don't think everyone can point and go...Oh! Oh! Thats a black plate RCA large bottle 6L6 quad in that amp! lol!
Those are great tubes though, but the sonic differences take days of playing around to identify as compared to another good quality tube. Unlike preamp tubes, the differences don't automatically jump out at you, unless you are comparing crap tubes to something really good like the Jan Phillips small bottles I mentioned in my first post.
Fender used GE and Sylvania small bottles in the original 59 Bassman, so large bottles have not always been the norm in Fender Bassman amps over the years.
As far as the GT power tubes in this amp go... I am franklly really impressed with these! I would have yanked them already if I wasn't! I actually laughed out loud when I first started playing my Jazz through this amp because it sounded so freaking good! And the whole time I was thinking... With GT tubes yet!
The tubes we all get from Fender are made by Sovtek for GT and are decent tubes and it looks like this amp was really dialed in to use these particular tubes. More so than I think most amps have been for a long time! Something to consider when yanking them for something else! There is every chance that a new Russian tube set will sound worse than the GTs in this amp!
Still just to give you a comparison....
I pulled my GT 6L6s and put them on my Hickok 600a Mutual Conductance tester just to see what they put out. On my standard output test on this calibrated 600a, they are putting out between 6000 and 6500 or somewhere in between those two numbers. All four tested slightly different but all within that range. The Jan Philips with the exact same settings during the same test session are pushing out 7600 on the meter.
I won't get into the whole microhms stuff... I just wanted to show the difference in output values this tester checks for between these two tube sets.
One set was made by Sovtek recently and are not perfectly matched as the readings show, and one set was made at the big Philips factory here in the USA in 1964 for the military. All four of my JANs test at 7600 exactly! One of the many reasons I LOVE JAN tubes of any type! They are always awesome spec wise. The best example of that tube model possible at the time.
Anyway...I will definitely post back when I get those JANs in the 100T and see how they do. Hopefully the amp hasn't been too heavily weighted towards the GTs that the JANs sound crappy! That would be highly unlikely, but the fact that the 100T sounds so good with the GTs, I am starting to wonder.
Preamp tubes is a no brainer though! I already yanked the GTs and put in a Mullard in V1 and an RCA in V2 and an RCA 12AT7 in. Made a noticeable difference! Just seems to be more of everything! Tone controls seem to do more than before. More definition was the most obvious difference I noticed.
The GT AX7s tested in the average range for an AX7. Same for the AT7..
One last thing I wanted to mention...BEWARE of yanking out the GT 12AT7 unless you plan to replace it with something narrower! That bottle barely fits inside the insulating ring! I don't think I would be able to get that tube back in there if I had to. I had a heck of a time pulling that one out! I was worried that I might snap it off or break it and cut my fingers! The 12AT7 socket seems to have been designed for a narrower AT7 and they are shoehorning these fat GTs into that narrower insulator ring! The RCA I put in instead is much narrower, so no worries now... But thought I should mention that!
Carry on gentleman!
I don't post much here (or anywhere else for that matter), but I have joined the 100T/410 Neo club. Man, this amp is awesome. Easily the best bass amp I've ever owned. For contrast, my main bass rig was Fender Precision->Manley Voxbox->QSC PLX1602->Accugroove El Whappo Jr. That is a super-accurate sound (and the most killer recording DI), but it definitely lacks the power tube saturation you can get with this rig. Did I mention it's awesome yet?
As an added bonus, if you plug in a Fender Strat on the Vintage channel you get a classic Fender clean guitar tone, or you can Overdrive it on the other channel. Same settings for bass and guitar! So ridiculous that it sounds that good with both guitar and bass. Of course guitar players co-opted the Bassman a long time ago for their own use, so that shouldn't be too surprising.
Anyhow - thanks for all the discussion here and on the other thread. Definitely helped me feel confident in the purchase, and the tones I'm getting are worth every penny.
I hear ya about using these for guitar! Was one of the ways I justified the expense to myself! lol!
Can't remember if this was mentioned in this thread, but the early Marshall guitar heads were basically Bassman ripoffs! Check the schematics of the two originals and you will see what I mean!
So actually... Jim Marshall was the first to actually endorse the use of the Bassman head for guitar players!
GG7....might be a good idea not to list ur address.....wouldn't want those JANS to go missing....lol a quad of those go for 500 or close to it. Drooled over em for a good month but got a quad of winged C's. Very happy with em. And yea that at7 was a pain to pull. I think I even posted on it months back. Welcome my friend and enjoy as we all have.
a quad of those go for 500 or close to it. Drooled over em for a good month but got a quad of winged C's. Very happy with em. And yea that at7 was a pain to pull. I think I even posted on it months back. Welcome my friend and enjoy as we all have.
Interesting stuff thanx GG7.
I'd think most of what you said would apply to the Super Bassman also.
It sounds so freakin good as is, with stock tubes, but as I've a few NOS JAN Philips & RCA AX7's I'll give them a try in my Super Bassman when I get some time.
I'd think most of what you said would apply to the Super Bassman also.
It sounds so freakin good as is, with stock tubes, but as I've a few NOS JAN Philips & RCA AX7's I'll give them a try in my Super Bassman when I get some time.
GG7....might be a good idea not to list ur address.....wouldn't want those JANS to go missing....lol
LOL! Hey Mr. Cool! Thanks for the advice!
$500.00? Seriously! WOW! I am pretty sure you can still pick up a quad of these for less than that. The 60s vintage can command prices as ridiculous as that, but there are some more charitable sellers out there that may part with a set for closer to $250.00. GE small bottles are really good too, and those actually sell for more $$ than the Jan Philips do. Another option would be to try and find some early 70s vintage of the same Sylvania tube. They made these till the late middle 70s at this same plant (In good ol PA if I am not mistaken) and they are just as good! Trust me! They look nearly identical. No tooling was changed from the ones I have till production stopped.
I've seen a quad of those go for as low as 90 bucks on eBay and they are NOS, not used and are even matched/tested on many occasions!
I would say steer clear of anyone trying to get $500.00 out of a quad set of JANS! Maybe in another 5 years, but they are still around. The military ordered literally TONS of tubes, and there are still a lot of them out there sitting in warehouses and stuff. Now that they are worth some cash, people are out there as we speak trying to hunt down the big stashes!
Most will end up on eBay where deals can be had if you know what you are doing. You can also get ripped blind if you don't!
Thanks Rod!
Would be VERY eager to hear a report on what you notice as differences between the stock tubes and those NOS sets!
You've got 6550s in your rig though correct? I don't think the Jan 6550s were made by Sylvania but are more likely to be either RCA or GE produced in both small and large bottle depending on the vintage. Just as good as Sylvanias produced at the Philips plant during the same era. I've got a bunch of small coke bottle GE 6550s that I stockpiled for my Leslie 122. It uses two of those, and tends to be hard on power tubes for some reason. I've gone through way more of those over the years than in all my guitar amps combined. The Hammond sounds SO GOOD with those GE 6550s in the Leslie though! My all time fave brand of 6550 hands down! If you have JAN Philips/GE 6550s, I'm definitely jealous! lol!
I picked up on that last night as I read the 2012 thread and since I was already on the fence, last night after reading many of the reports especially the ones from Freight Train I said F it!
Called MF and ordered the 410 Neo!
Curious what the engineer said to you about that tube not wanting to come out. ??
The reason is a simple one as far as I can tell. The insulator ring was designed to surround a much narrower diameter AT7 than the GT they are using in these amps. The result is a VERY tight fit, to the point that the tube once plugged into the socket, is nearly impossible to get out due to the tight fitting ring coupled with the pins into the new tight fitting socket.
I finally got mine out, but when I test fit it back into that ring, it was a total NO GO! I don't see how they can even get these fatboy AT7s into that preamp! The bottle is obviously wider than the insulator and you can see that when the tube is out of the amp.
I pulled mine to install an NOS RCA and fortunately, most NOS tubes are the old design which are much narrower and fit easily into the amp, and will NEVER get stuck like these stupid GTs do!
Again...was curious as to what the guy told you? Did they cop to the fact that this portion of the amp was designed for a smaller diameter AT7 and then they decided to go with these wide bottle GT AT7s that barely fit into the ring? I guess if you had to stick with the GT AT7, you could just pry the plastic ring out of the chassis with your fingers and put the tube in without the ring. It easily fits without getting stuck that way. I tried it just to see if it could be removed easily, but put it back in when my RCA easily fit through the ring with visible room to spare. Obviously the way the amp designer originally intended!
Yep, 6550's in the Super Bassman. It sounds so good with the stock power tubes, I won't be changing them anytime soon. The NOS JAN tubes I've got are all 12ax7 maybe a AT7 & AU7 or two. Most are Philips,& a cuppla RCA's.
Agree tho, these new Bassman's are new classics, for sure.
Agree tho, these new Bassman's are new classics, for sure.
I was on that same fence after getting the 100T. Then one Sat. morn is was having a cup of coffee and found one on local CL for $450. Immediately made a phone call and was on the road to Seattle within a 1/2 hour. I also sold an old Epifani T212 that same day that had been on CL for over a month. I should have bought a lotto ticket that day.
I've been very happy with the neo 410. easy schlep, looks fantastic, and sounds very nice. Though I must add that I installed 4 extra rubber feet on the 100T so she sits nicely on my Berg. 12's. That pairing is mighty sweet too. It's a win/win for me when choosing which set up to use.
I've been very happy with the neo 410. easy schlep, looks fantastic, and sounds very nice. Though I must add that I installed 4 extra rubber feet on the 100T so she sits nicely on my Berg. 12's. That pairing is mighty sweet too. It's a win/win for me when choosing which set up to use.
Aaaand I've just pulled the pin on a 410 Neo, due to the 115 Neo being out of stock & not coming back until mid June. I realised the weight and height difference is negligible between the two cabs anyway
Cool guys!
I also liked the idea of having the casters on the cab! I'm not gigging with my rig, just jamming around and recording in my home studio these days, but I am really looking forward to being able to roll this rig around the room and tuck it away when I am not using it.
My space is getting pretty cluttered these days, as I have been on a GAS fueled buying spree since last November. Just woke up one morning and said... I want to do more writing, recording and jamming! I miss all my old guitars I use to have! I want to have a studio again too! ...I have the $$$, so why not?
So I did!
Who would have ever thought that those boxes and boxes of old tubes that everyone always use to tease me about coveting like baseball cards would fund nearly every single one of these recent purchases?
I always said that collecting tubes if you played Hammond, Guitar or Bass was much more fun than Baseball cards, Furbies, Beany Babies, or whatever else people were collecting, cause you can use them to make your gear and your music SOUND BETTER!
Who's laughing now? (To many of my old bandmates who never understood me!) lol!
I also liked the idea of having the casters on the cab! I'm not gigging with my rig, just jamming around and recording in my home studio these days, but I am really looking forward to being able to roll this rig around the room and tuck it away when I am not using it.
My space is getting pretty cluttered these days, as I have been on a GAS fueled buying spree since last November. Just woke up one morning and said... I want to do more writing, recording and jamming! I miss all my old guitars I use to have! I want to have a studio again too! ...I have the $$$, so why not?
So I did!
Who would have ever thought that those boxes and boxes of old tubes that everyone always use to tease me about coveting like baseball cards would fund nearly every single one of these recent purchases?
I always said that collecting tubes if you played Hammond, Guitar or Bass was much more fun than Baseball cards, Furbies, Beany Babies, or whatever else people were collecting, cause you can use them to make your gear and your music SOUND BETTER!
Who's laughing now? (To many of my old bandmates who never understood me!) lol!
Ahhh! I misread your previous post and thought you had JAN 6550s! Those are much coveted! Even I don't have any of those anymore!
Those preamp tubes you have should open your tone section quite a bit! The NOS preamp tubes I put in my 100T certainly did!
While the GTs aren't terrible... As you may have read from some of the guys in here that upgraded their tubes and then for ***** a giggles, popped the GTs back in to compare... It will sound like you threw a blanket over your rig by comparison!
I would retube your preamp ASAP! It will very likely be similar to buying the amp in the first place, as in... "Why did I wait so long?"
P.S. Here are some photos I took while I was testing the JAN 6L6s earlier this evening. I wanted to point out the interesting date stamp on these tubes! They were made in 64 but were not boxed up till 6/66.
Maybe I should work on some heavy metal tunes when I put these in eh? lol!
Well, I've a few old 70's lightly used Sylvania 6L6's that were given to me back in early 80's, but sadly no JAN tubes-6L6 nor 6550 
So if you're thinking you need another bit of equipment, keep me in mind
Decent tubes are even more scarce here than the USA methinks.
So if you're thinking you need another bit of equipment, keep me in mind
Decent tubes are even more scarce here than the USA methinks.
Well, I've a few old 70's lightly used Sylvania 6L6's that were given to me back in early 80's, but sadly no JAN tubes-6L6 nor 6550
So if you're thinking you need another bit of equipment, keep me in mind
Decent tubes are even more scarce here than the USA methinks.
If they are Sylvania, they are likely the same tube as the JAN. They just were not made during the JAN run, but are likely the same exact tube.
Only way to know for sure is to test them and see if they read at the same range on a calibrated tester like my Hickok 600a or TV-7.
JAN tubes are so well regarded because they always test at the highest end of the scale for that tube model, and they are all consistent with each other right off the line. You can take a handful of JAN 12AX7s for example, and they will all spec out on the tester at nearly the same reading.
You really don't need to match preamp tubes, but when buying power tubes, if you can buy a lot of JAN power tubes that were all made at the same time, they will in esense be matched as a given.
I will be trying some HAMMOND/Amperex 12AX7s in my 100T at some point, so I will report back on how those sound compared to the ones I have in there right now.
I gigged the 100-T with my old SWR Goliath Jr II last night, as the 410 Neo hadn't arrived yet. Looked ridiculous, as you can see! Please note that the beer was only put there briefly so I could take the picture, it certainly didn't stay there while playing.
The gig is a four piece blues band, with a tastefully moderate drummer; guitarists both use smaller cabs but play LOUD when taking solos. I had the Master on 10, preamp on 4.5, 100 watt setting. I love how touch responsive this amp is - so does the singer. I did get a little carried away during 'Whipping Post', prompting a complaint to turn down from the other guitarist
The gig is a four piece blues band, with a tastefully moderate drummer; guitarists both use smaller cabs but play LOUD when taking solos. I had the Master on 10, preamp on 4.5, 100 watt setting. I love how touch responsive this amp is - so does the singer. I did get a little carried away during 'Whipping Post', prompting a complaint to turn down from the other guitarist
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Doesn't look "quite" as silly as my Super Bassman sitting on one AE112 
I know I know- no pic etc... Will snap one asap.
But, I bet ur 100T sounded great into the SWR.:thumbup:
I know I know- no pic etc... Will snap one asap.But, I bet ur 100T sounded great into the SWR.:thumbup:
Really enjoying this thread **Attention Bassman 100T owners**
For those who own the Bassman 100T. Just curious how some of you have been using this amp.
Have any of you used the preamp section only into a higher wattage power amp for larger venues?
Has anyone used/tried a different preamp direct into the power amp only?
I know it's a great stand alone amp but it does have the ability to separate the pre and the power amp thru the effects loop...Just looking for some real word feedback.
Thanks
For those who own the Bassman 100T. Just curious how some of you have been using this amp.
Have any of you used the preamp section only into a higher wattage power amp for larger venues?
Has anyone used/tried a different preamp direct into the power amp only?
I know it's a great stand alone amp but it does have the ability to separate the pre and the power amp thru the effects loop...Just looking for some real word feedback.
Thanks
Don't under estimate the 100T. It's quite powerful. I've never had the master above 5 and with any FOH at all it's usually around 4. And that's only with 2-12's or a 410. If you truly need more power than that get the super bassman. Seems to be a lot of extra weight and cost to merely use it as a pre or power amp IMO of course. For the occasional outdoor/large venue without FOH, I would think big/more cabs would work quite well.
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