Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Why does everyone keep referring me to the wiki?!?
I'm familiar with the info there - all VERY well done.
But the EQ and effects graphs there ONLY show the frequency response tailoring in the preamp, but do NOT address the effect on the "room sound" of the various Rumbles, in actual use.
For that, dORSY's linked video above is GREAT, JUST what the doctor ordered!
My last post above was about my curiosity about whether the tonal effect of the Vintage button could be reproduced using just the EQ controls, shooting for the same tone, but avoiding the compression effect. Turns out the Vintage button changes the EQ the same as setting the controls to 3 3 12 9.
By the way -
I ALSO did a similar "experiment" to see if I could use the EQ and level controls get my Rumble 100 to sound reasonably close to the sound of my R200.
I use my R100 occasionally when our group practices at an alternate location (another guy's basement), but I can't help but notice that the two amps sound noticeably different.
The Bass Channel video, linked above, shows the difference in tone.
I found that I can get the tone of my R100 close to my R200 (tweeter off) simply by setting the R100's EQ controls to 9 12 12 9.
The R100's output level is almost exactly -6dB lower than the R200, but this can be compensated for, if desired, by increasing the R100's Master control by about 30 degrees clockwise. Like from noon to about 1:30.
The two amps sound close enough to each other using that setting, with or without the Vintage effect in use.
Last edited:
'cause EQ is EQ.Why does everyone keep referring me to the wiki?!?
I'm familiar with the info there - all VERY well done.
But the EQ and effects graphs there ONLY show the frequency response tailoring in the preamp, but do NOT address the effect on the "room sound" of the various Rumbles, in actual use.
For that, dORSY's linked video above is GREAT, JUST what the doctor ordered!
My last post above was about my curiosity about whether the tonal effect of the Vintage button could be reproduced using just the EQ controls, shooting for the same tone, but avoiding the compression effect. Turns out the Vintage button changes the EQ the same as setting the controls to 3 3 12 9.
By the way -
I ALSO did a similar "experiment" to see if I could use the EQ and level controls get my Rumble 100 to sound reasonably close to the sound of my R200.
I use my R100 occasionally when our group practices at an alternate location (another guy's basement), but I can't help but notice that the two amps sound noticeably different.
The Bass Channel video, linked above, shows the difference in tone.
I found that I can get the tone of my R100 close to my R200 (tweeter off) simply by setting the R100's EQ controls to 9 12 12 9.
The R100's output level is almost exactly -6dB lower than the R200, but this can be compensated for, if desired, by increasing the R100's Master control by about 30 degrees clockwise. Like from noon to about 1:30.
The two amps sound close enough to each other using that setting, with or without the Vintage effect in use.
You could basically do the same w/ an EQ (pedal) in the send/return chain. The 15" in the r200's cab is quite more mid-forward than the r100's 12". You can spot this in the comparison video. Or in this one not rumbles, but same principle:The vintage button does an overall volume bump and a gradual high cut, that's why You can kind of replicate it w/ lows/mids @3 and highs rolled off.
Last edited:
FYI- not aimed at anyone in particular, but to all curious of this topic: as you probably know- one thing to keep in mind is once you bring "room sound" into the equation, all bets are off as far as settings, watts, EQ, speaker size etc....Why does everyone keep referring me to the wiki?!?
I'm familiar with the info there - all VERY well done.
But the EQ and effects graphs there ONLY show the frequency response tailoring in the preamp, but do NOT address the effect on the "room sound" of the various Rumbles, in actual use.
For that, dORSY's linked video above is GREAT, JUST what the doctor ordered!
My last post above was about my curiosity about whether the tonal effect of the Vintage button could be reproduced using just the EQ controls, shooting for the same tone, but avoiding the compression effect. Turns out the Vintage button changes the EQ the same as setting the controls to 3 3 12 9.
By the way -
I ALSO did a similar "experiment" to see if I could use the EQ and level controls get my Rumble 100 to sound reasonably close to the sound of my R200.
I use my R100 occasionally when our group practices at an alternate location (another guy's basement), but I can't help but notice that the two amps sound noticeably different.
The Bass Channel video, linked above, shows the difference in tone.
I found that I can get the tone of my R100 close to my R200 (tweeter off) simply by setting the R100's EQ controls to 9 12 12 9.
The R100's output level is almost exactly -6dB lower than the R200, but this can be compensated for, if desired, by increasing the R100's Master control by about 30 degrees clockwise. Like from noon to about 1:30.
The two amps sound close enough to each other using that setting, with or without the Vintage effect in use.
No two rooms sound alike, and will respond different to a myriad of factors.
Venue/room size, amp placement, listing distance, volume, temperature, humidity etc... all play a factor. Let alone bass type, strings, technique, musical style...
Yes, there are ballpark setting to get you close, but it's such a moving target that the best way is to just experiment and get experience with the gear you have. As time passes you get better at assessing what may work in a particular situation.
I'm still learning stuff after 45+ years in the "biz." No one learns all this stuff at once.
And, who knows what happened to the guy that promised to measure stuff with his "good mics"
Those kind of people have an ax to grind, and will argue to prove their process and methods are best...
YMMV
Anyhoo... As you were...
Replacement 100V3 should be here Tuesday. Let's hope all is well with this one!
Well, at home my low knob never goes above 9 o'clock. Sometimes even less (when practicing a tad bit louder). You should compensate for the room. Always.
Room acoustics can be very complex. The acoustics vary with how many bodies, what size, location, dress to an extent, and more. Different spots in the room will sound different. Before you judge the job a soundperson is doing, wander around the room and listen.
Your wish is my command, Miley. I added a link to Ken's post under the Bright, Contour & Vintage graph on the Freq Wiki. Check it out and let me know if that works for you, or if you have something else in mind. Ken is this OK with you? Or does anyone else have a different suggestion?
OK with me!
The frequency response curves (basically a low-pass filter of -6dB/octave @ 400 Hz) were matched using my R200, taking the measurements from the Effects Send output.
So the 3 3 12 9 setting should simulate the Vintage curve for any of the "regular" V3 Rumbles.
Just remember that you won't get the Vintage compression effect when you dig in!
My toughts are: Speakers/cabs! Speakers/cabs!
And we are not even touching what happens when You stack'em!
The 10's, 12, & 15 all sounded good, there is just a bit of difference in the frequency range that was emphasized.
I'd be relatively happy with any of the three, but the 12" kind of seemed like the more balanced sound and reinforces my leaning toward the R100c.
It is all about personal preference and to some extent what we're used to hearing.
I was suggesting Ken add it but obvs this works. I had nothing more specific in mind.
Wait, why are we trying to reproduce tone presets with tone controls again?
Brandon Shea
Commercial User
If for no other reason than to try to avoid the compression said preset adds.
Simple - I almost always use my R200 with the Vintage effect on.
The “classic” bass tone suits my playing style (fingers only) and the music our group plays.
Over the last two years we played two gigs (one outdoors) where my R200 was operating at the “hairy edge” of its capabilities. I like a nice, round tone, with as little distortion as possible, and I was hearing some very unpleasant (to me) “raggedness” on the lowest notes.
I thought the problem could be the “stacking” of the Vintage effect’s compression and the Delta limiter built into the power section.
It turned out that the REAL problem was that the E string on my JMJ (a well-broken-in D’Addario Chrome flat) had gone just TOO dead, definitely beyond ITS capabilities. A new string, a bit of Eucerin, and a little time fixed the tone problem.
But I digress…
To address my initial theory that the “stacked” compression effects were the problem, I wondered if it would be possible to set the EQ to get the low-pass tone of the Vintage effect WITHOUT the compression.
The 3 3 12 9 setting did the trick. (Didn’t fix the “raggedness” though. BAD string! BAD!)
btw,
The reason for my trying to match the tone of my R100 to my R200 was simply that when I would have to occasionally use my R100 for practice I “missed” the sound of my R200. Setting the EQ of the R100 to 9 12 12 9 simply makes it sound more familliar.
Soundperson!? Wuzzat? We are our own soundperson(s). We also never have the opportunity to do a sound check-most of the the time we get to the gig in time to set up, tune, and start playing. No place around here has a backline.
I have a basic setting for my bass amp [usually R100] and only have to add(or delete)BRIGHT, which I use as PRESENCE [on old school amps] depending on the room. Likewise on my PA mixer, I have each guy's vocal settings dialed in and only have to change the master EQ and VOLUME, again depending on the room. Normally the only changes made are to overall levels.
My guess would be that a real soundperson would cringe, but since we barely make enuff $ for ourselves, paying a sound guy is outta the question.
Valid question, rat. And a well reasoned response, Ken. I've added a link to it.
And, by linking it to our oft-referenced Rumble Freq wiki, it gives new Rumblers (and the rest of us, too) yet another option for chasing that tone in our heads.
Many thanks to all participating in this, and other, topics here! I believe it is the forum's raison d'etre.
Last edited:
At the risk of seeming too possessive I've added the request at the top of my most cherished wikis to "Please PM your requests for additions or corrections to G-Dog". I've experienced bad results from others editing them in the past. But I'm very happy to work with requestors toward their desired goals.
If you play at lower levels, the Rumble baked-in tone stack is not too far off a flat FR (barring room acoustics and listeners’ hearing quirks).
