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Fender Rumble V3 100 speaker up-grade ?

#101
T
katonart said:
Hi Little Rock,

Sorry it took me so long to reply. Here's what I did.

I wanted to keep the bracing very light, so I bought a number of strips of 1/2" x 2" lumber at Lowe's (of course the real dimensions are slightly smaller). I think it came in 3 foot strips.

I took the driver out of the amp, and then I cut pieces of the 1/2 x 2 to stiffen each surface on the inside of the cabinet. I glued them into the cabinet - no metal was added in this project. I did not have any way of clamping the wood in place, so each night I would turn the cabinet in a new direction and attach the bracing that would be on the 'bottom' in that position. I glued it in with Monster wood glue. I taped the glued pieces in place with gaffers tape and let them dry for 24 hours. The next night I repositioned the cabinet and glued in more pieces. Most of the pieces are glued with the their edge against the cabinet wall because I think this provides the most resistance to flexing.

The pictures show the finished bracing. Every surface has some bracing. There is also a brace between the baffle (just below the driver) and the back, and another between the two sides behind the driver.

This is looking from the top of the cabinet towards the bottom,
View attachment 4324362
The next picture is looking toward the inside top of the cabinet. (The two tee-nuts hold the handle in place). The diagonal brace is on the back of the compartment that holds the electronics. You can see the top of one of the side braces.


View attachment 4324362 View attachment 4324364

Based on what I heard from this amp, I also put in some good old fashioned cheap fiberglass insulation. initially I stuffed the cabinet pretty full, but then it sounded muffled. So I took a bunch out, you can see the final amount in this picture:View attachment 4324381

After these modifications, the sound of the amp is much clearer and more controlled. I'm much happier with it than before. It's still loud and light.

Picture below shows settings I've been using at rehearsals. Bass is dialed back due to the general boomy tendency of the amp. I've been getting a loud and clear sound that is pretty satisfying.

View attachment 4324452
Click to expand...
Thank you, sir!
I bought a second hand R100, a new Basslite S2012 and some quilt batting.
I will start with the quilt batting, then the speaker upgrade and finally the bracing, if i feel it is necessary.
I will let you guys know the results...
 
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#102
iagtrplyr said:
Thanks to those who wrote about this mod for the 100. A combination of being a curious science teacher and an avid cheapskate brought me to purchasing the 1/2" foam padding and trying it with both my 100 and Ampeg BA108v2 stock speakers. If I don't hear much difference and still feel like I can do more I'll get the better Eminence driver for the Rumble. It seemed like everyone who's modded went in with both improvements and I want to see if there's any difference at all with the insulation only.

Back in my younger days, and after reading GK left the Gen I MB-series cabs bare inside, I decided to do what I thought was the right thing and bought polyfoam and glue and cut the standing waves. To my ears, all I ended up doing was choking the cab to death. There was no depth of sound coming out that 210 and I couldn't stand it and it was literally like all life out of the speakers had been drained. It was a waste of money and effort. I'm hoping this update to the Rumble 100 won't end with the same result and according to this thread, it won't. Thanks again for the detailed instructions and images.
Click to expand...

Hi, iagtrplyr!
Based on your comment, i decided to try the quilt batting only, before replacing the speaker, and was really surprised with the amount of improvement. I can clearly notice an improvement in the boxyness, boomyness and even distortion. It also became a little bit punchier, but still not comparable to my other combos/cabs (GK MB115, Traynor SB112 and Acme Low B II).

I tried quilt batting in different locations, but ended up preferring the results with lining only on the top, bottom and sides.

I can share some audio files i recorded before and after, in case someone is interested.
 
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#103
Little Rock said:
Hi, iagtrplyr!
Based on your comment, i decided to try the quilt batting only, before replacing the speaker, and was really surprised with the amount of improvement. I can clearly notice an improvement in the boxyness, boomyness and even distortion. It also became a little bit punchier, but still not comparable to my other combos/cabs (GK MB115, Traynor SB112 and Acme Low B II).

I tried quilt batting in different locations, but ended up preferring the results with lining only on the top, bottom and sides.

I can share some audio files i recorded before and after, in case someone is interested.
Click to expand...

Why thank you for the mention, LR! I'm so happy to hear you hit the right lining-to-cabinet ratio. After posting that comment, I realized the sound was way drier than I wanted it to be, so my advice is to give it some time and listen to see if what you're hearing right now still makes you happy a month from now. I ended up pulling out much of the foam lining until I got it to where I was most happy. You may have hit it just right the first time, but don't feel bad if you end up altering it a bit. Your ears' happiness is most important.

Thanks again for the props! :thumbsup:
 
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#104
FWIW, I just swapped out the stock speaker in my Fender Rumble 100 and put in an Eminence Legend BP 122. A bit heavier than the stock, but in my opinion it has added some additional low end clarity. I also can push the amp about 1 1/2 notches louder before the distortion becomes unbearable to my ears. (I am essentially a jazz player looking for a clean, warm and not terribly loud sound.)

My current bass collection consists of 4 early 1990s Ibanez SR 885s and a pair of late 1980s Ibanez RB885s. After purchasing a pair of Phil Jones amps I noticed that -- despite being similar models -- each of my basses had a more distinct individual tone than could be heard when running through the stock Fender amp. It seemed to color them all pretty similarly.

The new speaker in the Rumble has given me the ability to hear those differences a bit more -- though still not as distinctly as the Phil Jones amps do.

I did put some fiberglass on the top and sides of the Rumble during the swap --leaving the back and bottom bare wood. I also plugged one of the ports. I may do some additional tweaking, but so far, I'd call the combo "improved."

At $115 bucks for the new speaker, I fully understand that the amount of improvement (20% or so overall in my estimation) might not be worth the money to many folk. I had a Hartke 12" cab go bad, so I was buying a replacement speaker and had the idea to put the new one in the Rumble and move the old to the Hartke, which I rarely use.
 
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#105
I owned a rumble 100 v3 a couple years ago, then sold it and bought a markbass 121P. But I find the fan noise and piezo tweeter hiss an annoyance when using it to just practice. After a few months of waiting, a Rumble 100 v3 showed up on craigslist for $200, so I grabbed it after literally a 30 second check out.

My mistake. It is very buzzy at certain frequencies. I tightened all the screws but the buzzes remain. They are definitely coming from the rumble itself, not just things in my room rattling. If I lift out the speaker and play, of course the tonality and volume are wildly different, but there is no buzz. That would seem to mean the speaker is OK (visually it looks fine too), so it must be that the plywood case is buzzing at certain frequencies.

I know cabinets have resonant frequency points, but in my understanding, that should just affect the peaks of the frequency response and not result in buzzing, right? If I glue in some bracing struts I'm afraid I'll just waste time and end up with a buzzing braced cabinet.

Has anyone else experienced this with their Rumble combo? If so, do you have any suggestions about how I should proceed?
 
#107
I did the upgrade using the Beta-12A-2. Since the holes didn’t line up, I made new holes. I was able to re-use the original t-nuts. To remove them from the original holes, I partially threaded the screws into the nuts and used a hammer to lightly tap down on the screws. After removing the t-nuts, I cleaned off any pieces of wood still stuck on them.

Having had good results in the past for minimizing resonances and standing waves inside speaker cabinets, I used 2 inch thick compressed polyester to line certain surfaces inside the box. These surfaces were the top, the back under the amplifier section and the two sides. You can find compressed polyester at a place that sells fabrics. It is usually used to make cushions but also makes an excellent sound absorber. One of its advantages is that it will not break down or rot over time. I glued it onto the wood of the box using water based contact cement.

I plugged up the old speaker mounting holes using plastic wood then used flat black paint to hide the plastic wood.

I had measured the size of the new holes needed and marked where they should be by lying the amp on its back and placing the new speaker as centered as possible in the hole. I used a smaller drill bit to start drilling and mark where the holes should be then removed the speaker to complete the drilling. I then used the correct drill to increase the size of the holes to fit the t-nuts. A note of caution, make sure that your drill bits are sharp and only use light pressure to drill. This will help keep the wood from breaking up at the bottom of the holes. Once the holes were completed, I cleaned up any bits of wood still hanging on and then inserted the t-nuts from the back and used a one handed clamp to push them in the rest of the way.

After installing the speaker and putting the grille cloth back on, I tested the amp. There was a significant difference in the sound. The bottom end is noticeably more full and balanced. Before doing the upgrade I noticed that certain notes I played sounded louder than the rest. Now every note sounds the same loudness. Overall, the amp sounds like it got bigger, cleaner and more powerful.
 
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#112
Miles_ONeal said:
For any of you who tried the speaker upgrade or the filler alone, but also tried them both together, how much of the improvement do you think the one alone made vs both together?
Click to expand...
The lining and the speaker upgrade accomplish two different things, IMO.
I lined my two R100s first, and found that it reduced the boominess of the cab. Instead of having to set the bass eq at 9 o'clock avoid muddy sounds at my practice space I could set it at 11 o'clock. It gave it a tighter tone. One R100 was lined with foam padding from Walmart, and the second was lined with a denim sound insulation material from Amazon. I think the latter is a little better, but maybe it's because I didn't line the bottom with it. There was an earlier post in this thread where somebody removed the lining from the bottom to make the cab more alive. I think I agree with that.

I upgraded the drivers in both R100s to the ceramic beta 12-2 a few months ago. My rumbles weigh a whopping 23.6 lbs now!
At low volumes the new drivers sound about the same as the oem drivers to my ears. The basslite neo driver spec shows more response in the 2500 - 4000 hz range, so I expect they would give you a crisper tone. I kinda wish that I'd have sprung for the neo drivers, oh well.

This past week I had an opportunity to dime the new driver, and boy does it make a huge improvement. When I dimed the oem driver in the past I got quite a bit of clipping. At the time I thought the clipping was from too much preamp gain , but now I think it was from exceeding the mechanical limitations of the oem driver (which is rated at 70 watts). With the upgraded driver I got clean tone with the master dimed and the gain at 3 o'clock. It sounds REALLY good, and loud!
So I recommend the driver upgrade if you want to get the most out of your R100. It's not worth it if you are just going to use it as a practice amp at home, but if you are going to use it in a band situation I think it is worthwhile.
The new driver also gives you an additional 6dB in volume from the increased efficiency. A second R100 gives you another 6dB. I am now confident that my R100 mini-stack will meet my needs. Light weight, flexible, plenty of volume if needed, great Rumble tone, and no fan noise ever.
 
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#113
CraigL said:
The lining and the speaker upgrade accomplish two different things, IMO.
I lined my two R100s first, and found that it reduced the boominess of the cab. Instead of having to set the bass eq at 9 o'clock avoid muddy sounds at my practice space I could set it at 11 o'clock. It gave it a tighter tone. One R100 was lined with foam padding from Walmart, and the second was lined with a denim sound insulation material from Amazon. I think the latter is a little better, but maybe it's because I didn't line the bottom with it. There was an earlier post in this thread where somebody removed the lining from the bottom to make the cab more alive. I think I agree with that.

I upgraded the drivers in both R100s to the ceramic beta 12-2 a few months ago. My rumbles weigh a whopping 23.6 lbs now!
At low volumes the new drivers sound about the same as the oem drivers to my ears. The basslite neo driver spec shows more response in the 2500 - 4000 hz range, so I expect they would give you a crisper tone. I kinda wish that I'd have sprung for the neo drivers, oh well.

This past week I had an opportunity to dime the new driver, and boy does it make a huge improvement. When I dimed the oem driver in the past I got quite a bit of clipping. At the time I thought the clipping was from too much preamp gain , but now I think it was from exceeding the mechanical limitations of the oem driver (which is rated at 70 watts). With the upgraded driver I got clean tone with the master dimed and the gain at 3 o'clock. It sounds REALLY good, and loud!
So I recommend the driver upgrade if you want to get the most out of your R100. It's not worth it if you are just going to use it as a practice amp at home, but if you are going to use it in a band situation I think it is worthwhile.
The new driver also gives you an additional 6dB in volume from the increased efficiency. A second R100 gives you another 6dB. I am now confident that my R100 mini-stack will meet my needs. Light weight, flexible, plenty of volume if needed, great Rumble tone, and no fan noise ever.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the thorough review, Craig!
 
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#114
Hey guys !
I bought my Rumble 100 V3!
I already have my eminence S2012!

Originally it has 2 - 3" x 5 cm ducts.

Using WinISD I came to the conclusion that it would be good with 2 x 3" and 15 cm ducts (best for eminence S2012 )
I plan to use light "acoustic dampening"

For those who have already made this change, do you agree?

Sorry about my English. Thanks !
 
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#115
Hi Regis, Your English is Perfect! Congratulations on your purchase and brave modification.
I put the Eminence S2012 in my R100 and originally added acoustical dampening. The cabinet sounded dead to me so I took out all of the material except for the bottom. Another poster on this thread confirmed my fears that the added material kept the cabinet from sounding lively. I like the sound MUCH better now and it is my gigging amp at 20.5 lbs. I'm 71 and my back thanks me. I did NOTHING with the ports because I had no idea how to change them. Please tell us how you do that.
I play big band bass in South Florida and it easily drives a 16 piece band...and is SO portable. The Rumble 200 on the right sounds fabulous but just sits in the bedroom......
 
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#116
KenPompanoBeach said:
Hi Regis, Your English is Perfect! Congratulations on your purchase and brave modification.
I put the Eminence S2012 in my R100 and originally added acoustical dampening. The cabinet sounded dead to me so I took out all of the material except for the bottom. Another poster on this thread confirmed my fears that the added material kept the cabinet from sounding lively. I like the sound MUCH better now and it is my gigging amp at 20.5 lbs. I'm 71 and my back thanks me. I did NOTHING with the ports because I had no idea how to change them. Please tell us how you do that.
I play big band bass in South Florida and it easily drives a 16 piece band...and is SO portable. The Rumble 200 on the right sounds fabulous but just sits in the bedroom......
Click to expand...
FYI: There's a knowledgeable person on this thread called Astrosonic who has commented on what the ports SHOULD be. Check him out on this thread.
 
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#117
A while ago I calculated the resonant frequency (or whatever it is called) l for the original ports, and came up with 60 hz. If you lengthen the ports I think the frequency will be lower, but you might lose volume. (Low, light, loud - you only can have two of the three). Please report back on the outcome of extending the ports.
 

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