Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0 discussion thread

[fretster]

Did a quick A/B with a Shuttle 9.0 and the Carvin BX500 last night. It was into an 8 ohm load, single 15" cab. I had the lows and low mids slightly boosted on the 9.0, and the lows and low mids slightly boosted on the bx500. (slight contour and compression) It sounded, to my ears, like the bx500 had a higher output. The bx500 was a little brighter (as reported by others) and seemed louder to me. The 9.0 seemed to be slightly warmer to me. I could dial in a good overall sound with both heads. Now it's just a matter of deciding which one to keep. Good problem to have I guess

Edit:
I had the bx500's drive at noon, master at 8:30-9:00
9.0's gain and preamp level at noon, master at noon

Hopefully your choice will not be driven by what amp sounds "louder when the volume was at noon". Some amps don't get any louder between noon and 3. Others keep getting louder all the way to the top. I think this was discussed in this very thread 100 posts ago.

 

[SteveC]

I perceive the same thing you do. 375 with my SM12 into an 8ohm LDS 15/6 sounds great. But when I use the SM12 as a preamp through a QMX, 725 watts sounds better. I prefer the FET for many applications, so now carry both in a rack.

Maybe I'm not crazy then. I'm thinking that I haven't really used all the knobs on the Max 12 like I thought I would. I may go with the 9.0 as it sounds great and is a little smaller and still wil have all the power I'd ever need.

Now to work a deal at the store to trade the Max 12 that's a couple weeks old for the 9.0.

 

[Red Planet]

I see folks compare some of these amps and I see where mistakes are made judging them.

Do not judge one amp by how you operate the other. Use your ears and your brain. Do not use the "my other amp adjusts like this" brain.


This really really became apparent to me while comparing the MarkBass LMIII and MarkBass TA-501. Off the cuff one would say the LMIII is louder and has more power. Funny thing is they share the same Poweramp. The TA-501's input sensitivity is waaaayyyyy different than the LMIII and the EQ points are waaaaaaayyyy different as well.

I just got my 9.0 and have only played it a few minutes. Right off the bat I noticed the Input is less hot than my LMIII (it takes a higher setting to achieve the same db).

Also I noticed with the 9.0 one can light up the input clip light without any noticeable hard square pop like the LMIII gets when it clips. As a side note because of the complex nature of the input of the 9.0 one can achieve a warm smooth overdrive without ever lighting up the input clip light.

Without getting any test equipment out I can tell the gain is different at the Master volume between the two Amps. If you like your LMIII's master half way up then set the master on the Shuttle 9.0 all the way up (now this does not make the volumes/loudness equal). At these setting the 9.0 is way louder than the LMIII and I mean way louder.

The best way to describe this is it's like the LMIII is wide open at half way on the master, yeah there is more knob left but when you turn it up it does not get any louder and the limiter starts kicking in really quickly.

I played the 9.0 into my 2x10 SWR Golight and cranked it. Wow, careful, I thought I was going to overexcurse. The 2x10 can not take it. The same 2x10 I can dime the LMIII into and it just squashes.

Interesting the 9.0 is not going to be making it a mystical magical wonderful experience with my 2x10 because I can see I'll end up blowing the 2x10.

Real quick, on to the tonal thing. I noticed right off the bat how different the 9.0 sounds even compared to my 12.0. For what ever reason known to Hasbeen and Aged Horse this thing is voiced really different. I can hear that clarity of the Shuttle Max 12.0 coming through but for some reason this amp is gooey and folks I mean gooooooooeeeyyyyy. It is almost not possible for me to describe how this amp sounds. Rock solid, clarity, warm, mega bottom, and gooey. The whole gooey thing strikes me as almost unbelievable. The 12.0 has the 3D clarity to it but the 9.0 is just plain ol gooey.

Anyway my Grandson just woke up from his nap so off to go play some more.

 

[bass4me]

Hopefully your choice will not be driven by what amp sounds "louder when the volume was at noon". Some amps don't get any louder between noon and 3. Others keep getting louder all the way to the top. I think this was discussed in this very thread 100 posts ago.

Yeah, I realize what you're saying, and I remember seeing the posts about that...I was just sharing what I heard with those settings. A few clicks up on the volume with the 9.0 may have changed things for sure, as I'm sure it probably would have, I'll have to a/b them further. It does seem that the Carvin is pretty hot from the get go. May not change much with further adjustment of the master.

Real quick, on to the tonal thing. I noticed right off the bat how different the 9.0 sounds even compared to my 12.0. For what ever reason known to Hasbeen and Aged Horse this thing is voiced really different. I can hear that clarity of the Shuttle Max 12.0 coming through but for some reason this amp is gooey and folks I mean gooooooooeeeyyyyy. It is almost not possible for me to describe how this amp sounds. Rock solid, clarity, warm, mega bottom, and gooey. The whole gooey thing strikes me as almost unbelievable. The 12.0 has the 3D clarity to it but the 9.0 is just plain ol gooey.

Anyway my Grandson just woke up from his nap so off to go play some more.

+1 on this (noticed this too compared to the SM12)

 

[svtb15]

The 9 gets pretty loud.. It is as Red Planet says goooeyyy. I like that. i run mine on a pair of db112s most of the time and im afraid it can kill those cabs if i turn it up too much..
I did a gig yesterday with just one 8 ohm cabs and boy am i liking the 500 watts available now.. it is thick and punchy...but a MAX18 if ever made would put a crease in the space time continuum

 

[SteveC]

Real quick, on to the tonal thing. I noticed right off the bat how different the 9.0 sounds even compared to my 12.0. For what ever reason known to Hasbeen and Aged Horse this thing is voiced really different. I can hear that clarity of the Shuttle Max 12.0 coming through but for some reason this amp is gooey and folks I mean gooooooooeeeyyyyy. It is almost not possible for me to describe how this amp sounds. Rock solid, clarity, warm, mega bottom, and gooey. The whole gooey thing strikes me as almost unbelievable. The 12.0 has the 3D clarity to it but the 9.0 is just plain ol gooey.

This is a great post. That's what I'm hearing when I compare my Max 12 and 9.0 - at least explained in a great way.

 

[Red Planet]

This is a great post. That's what I'm hearing when I compare my Max 12 and 9.0 - at least explained in a great way.

Just came up for air.

This whole gooey thing has me miffed. How can a little tiny SS Micro Amp sound more like a Tube amp than a Tube amp?

I was really not expecting this gooey thing. I am so excited and pleased by this I'm rather emotional over the whole thing.

I'm still playing with the EQ plus switches. Not used to this configuration. It's similar to the 12.0 but not. Might need to get the foot-switch for it.

 

[SteveC]

Just came up for air.

This whole gooey thing has me miffed. How can a little tiny SS Micro Amp sound more like a Tube amp than a Tube amp?

I was really not expecting this gooey thing. I am so excited and pleased by this I'm rather emotional over the whole thing.

I'm still playing with the EQ plus switches. Not used to this configuration. It's similar to the 12.0 but not. Might need to get the foot-switch for it.

It's gooey. Maybe too gooey for me. I may stick with the Max 12 and be able to blend in my gooeyness.

 

[Red Planet]

It's gooey. Maybe too gooey for me. I may stick with the Max 12 and be able to blend in my gooeyness.

No no no no no no no no no no not too gooey. It's perfect!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[agedhorse]

Just came up for air.

This whole gooey thing has me miffed. How can a little tiny SS Micro Amp sound more like a Tube amp than a Tube amp?

There's some subtle design tricks being used to emulate how the stages of a tube amp operate and overload when driven hard (part of our patent pending PHAT technology). This is why you need to experiment a little with gain structure to find your own sweetspot for each bass you play.

 

[craigb43]

I am a happy owner of this head , yes I have noticed the knob volume thing , but as said with very small bumps in the eq here and there will bring it where you need it for sure , I have also noticed that when I use my epifani cab's , well as much as I love them ( ul 115 , ul 210 , each 8 ohn ) they don't seem to be nearly as tough as my Bergintino 210 8 ohm , my Bergintino is a older model , it has the traditional speakers ( the heavy cab ) and it seems to handle way better at higher volume , and my old school heavy Bergintino ht-322 4 ohm just totally kicks , to me there seems to be weaker stronger thing going on there , maybe it has to do with the new light stuff vs. the old heavy , they both sound great , to me the bergs just sound tough , and the epi's just at higher volume seem to break up a bit and seem weak , I still love the sound of them but will be using the epi stuff a lower volume gig's , now if I had a 4 ohm 410 it would probably be a totally different thing , anyway spending the time with the head as you do with any other will help for sure , then you will find your spot ,

 

[SteveC]

...now if I had a 4 ohm 410 it would probably be a totally different thing...

This head into the 4 ohm Uber 410 is a serious rig.

I'm still undecided about which head works best with my 112 cab. I'm leaning to the Max because I am more of a FET kind of guy. I like to blend the tube just to taste. Seems to work better for me.

 

[SteveC]

I'm really torn by these 2 amps. Into a single 8-ohm cab, the 9.0 offers noticeably more oomph than the MAX12. I think there is a noticeable difference in tone between the 2 amps, but not much, and certainly not that anyone would notice in a live setting. It's easy to nit pick in your house.

With my desire to use as small a rig as possible, it seems to make more sense for me to use the 9.0 as I use a single 8 ohm cab for all my gigs. I'm guessing I'd get used to the sound.

 

[VroomVroom]

... I'm guessing I'd get used to the sound.

Steve, just my two cents, but don't let that be the basis for a purchase. The MAX12 is undoubtedly a great amp, and if you dig having the EQ options, as well as the pre-mixing, it sounds as if that may really help you get your sound. It doesn't sound as if you'd run out of horsepower for the type of gigs you're doing.

For me, and I know I've kinda-sorta posted this in other threads, but the Shuttle 9.0 has been perfect for me. Most of my gigs these days are running through one or two 8-ohm single-12" cabs. The output of the 9.0 goes great with either setting (although I still also use my 6.0-12T for rehearsals and really small venues). I also love the sound of this amp with all of my basses, which was the ultimate decision maker for me. (And I'm a simple man when it comes to EQ...the fewer knobs the better. )

Great sound, plenty of oomph, amazing portability...the 9.0 has already become my workhorse. I can't think of anything else to add that hasn't been covered ad nauseum in this thread...but if you're in the market for a small amp, I definitely recommend spending some time with this one as part of your test drive process.

 

[SteveC]

I'm sure I'll over debate and over analyze this like everything else. The my band mates don't complain. They say I sound fine with what I have. If the Max 12 sounds best in the end, I'll keep it. If the 9.0 sounds best, I'll see what kind of deal I can get. The EQ options on the Max 12 are daunting. I think I know how to work it, but sometimes I wonder if I'm over-tweaking. Maybe a simpler EQ like the 9.0 would help my sound more than the extensive EQ of the Max 12.

 

[coolrunner989]

I don't find the EQ on the Max 12 to be that daunting, as long as you don't over analyze it and spend an hour tweaking each knob. There is really just one more mid-band EQ knob on the Max than on the Shuttle 3/6/9. The Global EQ is the same, just variable. And then you have a tube/non tube option. Not too much if you break it down and see that it's really just the basic Genz Benz EQ plus a few features. That's how I see it anyway.

 

[SteveC]

If my gigs required a larger, 4 ohm cab I'd be all set. Uber 410 (4 ohm) and the Max 12 would kill. Actually that would be a great rig for my horn band gig and the pop/rock cover band. Usually I have PA support for loud gigs and my stand alone gigs are just jazz background type things. I play a little louder for the Thursday Night Jazz Jam at a local club, but the Max 12/112 handles that gig fairly easily.

 

[agedhorse]

There is really just one more mid-band EQ knob on the Max than on the Shuttle 3/6/9. The Global EQ is the same, just variable. And then you have a tube/non tube option. Not too much if you break it down and see that it's really just the basic Genz Benz EQ plus a few features. That's how I see it anyway.

Correct, the eq's are identical other than the second sweep mid band eq for those who need the additional flexability. The tone shaping filters are also the same, the 3/6/9 have the amount of the filter preset, the Max's are variable. That's about it (other than the two channels of course).

 

[5StringPocket]

Still no plans for a Shuttle 9.0 Max?

 

[DJJazzV]

There's some subtle design tricks being used to emulate how the stages of a tube amp operate and overload when driven hard (part of our patent pending PHAT technology). This is why you need to experiment a little with gain structure to find your own sweetspot for each bass you play.

I'm still trying to get the PHAT Technology to sound closer to my other bass head.