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GK Combo Shootout...MB210 vs. MB212
- Thread starter tallboybass
- Start date
For those that have done it (and there seems to be a few here) have you found your MB212 able to provide all the low end and volume needed when things get loud?
I used mine at an outdoor gig recently and it was stellar, but it was a fairly mellow affair volume-wise so I never had to really lean on it.
I still have my Carvin B1500 and BRX10.4 neo and that's what I would typically bring for an outdoor gig. The last 2 were LOUD and I found the rig was breathing pretty hard to keep up.
Would the MB212 fare well in this setting? It's just spoiled me for the weight/portability thing so I would prefer to bring that over the 410.
I haven't done what you could call scientific testing, but my gut reaction is that the MB is just as loud and strong in the lows as the Carvin rig.
Am I delusional?
I used mine at an outdoor gig recently and it was stellar, but it was a fairly mellow affair volume-wise so I never had to really lean on it.
I still have my Carvin B1500 and BRX10.4 neo and that's what I would typically bring for an outdoor gig. The last 2 were LOUD and I found the rig was breathing pretty hard to keep up.
Would the MB212 fare well in this setting? It's just spoiled me for the weight/portability thing so I would prefer to bring that over the 410.
I haven't done what you could call scientific testing, but my gut reaction is that the MB is just as loud and strong in the lows as the Carvin rig.
Am I delusional?
Ive gotten to play on my MB212 for awhile, and I think it should be more than enough low end for you! Its actually kind of terrifying what the amp can do... My head hurts if I play for too long; that's how intense the low end is, or at least, IMO
I did some testing with the MB212 against a Bergantino AE410 powered by half a PLX1804 (900 watts) and 'in my house' it was close. Out in the wild it would be the 410 hands down if you're really pushing it. If you don't typically wring out your 410, the MB212 will cover it just fine. (I sold the 410)For those that have done it (and there seems to be a few here) have you found your MB212 able to provide all the low end and volume needed when things get loud?
I used mine at an outdoor gig recently and it was stellar, but it was a fairly mellow affair volume-wise so I never had to really lean on it.
I still have my Carvin B1500 and BRX10.4 neo and that's what I would typically bring for an outdoor gig. The last 2 were LOUD and I found the rig was breathing pretty hard to keep up.
Would the MB212 fare well in this setting? It's just spoiled me for the weight/portability thing so I would prefer to bring that over the 410.
I haven't done what you could call scientific testing, but my gut reaction is that the MB is just as loud and strong in the lows as the Carvin rig.
Am I delusional?
IMO, IME and all that.
I had my 410 for sale for a while, but didn't move quickly and now I don't have room for anything bigger than a 1x12 and head.
So not in the club like I thought. I'll be pounding on the 410 this weekend. Maybe later, we'll see. Still none in locally.
So not in the club like I thought. I'll be pounding on the 410 this weekend. Maybe later, we'll see. Still none in locally.
Eons ago as a young musician just starting out I was recurrently buried by LOUD guitar players who forced me to choose between playing 'phantom bass'.., or blowing drivers... 
In spite of the statistical improbability of this befalling any other bassist
, what size of cranked guitar rig do you recon an MB212 could tonefully inter--if need be? A Super Reverb? A 50 Watt Marshall/4 X 12? A Fender Twin?..
In spite of the statistical improbability of this befalling any other bassist
, what size of cranked guitar rig do you recon an MB212 could tonefully inter--if need be? A Super Reverb? A 50 Watt Marshall/4 X 12? A Fender Twin?..
Eons ago as a young musician just starting out I was recurrently buried by LOUD guitar players who forced me to choose between playing 'phantom bass'.., or blowing drivers...
In spite of the statistical improbability of this befalling any other bassist
Man, that's an unanswerable question in my opinion. Too many variables.
To illustrate.....I used to play in a trio where the GP used a Fender Deluxe (1-12" and 22 watts i think) and I had to bring at least 500 watts and a 410 just to keep up.
I'm seriously considering an MB210, I have major concerns though, especially after reading some posts regarding the flimsy cabinets. I played through one of the older GK Neo 212 1001 combos a while back, and that thing rattled and farted like crazy if you went past 3. I've experienced the same thing with other GK combos and was told by a GK repair person who that it had something to do with the cabinet construction. The old 212 combo seemed a whole lot more tightly put together than these too.
Am I kidding myself is I think the 210 will handle anything more than the smallest club with a laid back drummer?
Can it go to 5 or more (with an active bass - a warwick corvette to be specific) without farting and rattling? My corvette is usually set pretty close to flat, as are my amp controls.
I'm considering the Carvin micro amps too. If anyone can answer the above 2 regarding them also, or offer a comparison that too would be helpful. Thanks.
Am I kidding myself is I think the 210 will handle anything more than the smallest club with a laid back drummer?
Can it go to 5 or more (with an active bass - a warwick corvette to be specific) without farting and rattling? My corvette is usually set pretty close to flat, as are my amp controls.
I'm considering the Carvin micro amps too. If anyone can answer the above 2 regarding them also, or offer a comparison that too would be helpful. Thanks.
Yo, Advocate!
I'll keep this response as simple as possible:
All your concerns are unfounded.
I have an MB212. That one box is going to represent a pretty small statistical sampling but it's tight as a drum, there's nothing remotely fragile or flimsy about it, and far from being able to "keep up with a laid back drummer in a small club" it will bury a loud drummer and a drunken guitarist with a Fender 410 combo, with a Hammond B3 thrown in for good measure, in a LARGE club. I can say that from very recent personal experience.
I also owned the Carvin rig you mentioned, i.e. a BX500 head and their 210 neo cab. Very nice little rig, but not in the same league as the MB combos IMO. In fact I just sold mine because it's too similar to the GK and I prefer the GK on every level.
I hope that helps.
I'll keep this response as simple as possible:
All your concerns are unfounded.
I have an MB212. That one box is going to represent a pretty small statistical sampling
but it's tight as a drum, there's nothing remotely fragile or flimsy about it, and far from being able to "keep up with a laid back drummer in a small club" it will bury a loud drummer and a drunken guitarist with a Fender 410 combo, with a Hammond B3 thrown in for good measure, in a LARGE club. I can say that from very recent personal experience.I also owned the Carvin rig you mentioned, i.e. a BX500 head and their 210 neo cab. Very nice little rig, but not in the same league as the MB combos IMO. In fact I just sold mine because it's too similar to the GK and I prefer the GK on every level.
I hope that helps.
Thanks sparky. But not sompletely unfounded just yet. Was just reading the musicians friend reviews and saw this gem:
It rattles Posted by Sergio Z from San Jose, CA on May 5, 2010
Experience w/product: I have used it
Reviewer's Background: Recording composer (kbd, bass, drums)
Reviewer's Play Style: Rock, fusion
I played this amp for about two hours in Guitar Center. Delightful. This was the only amp able to reveal the amazing sound of my Music Man 25 Anniversary Edition bass -- very transparent, great low end, hi-fi high end, very little hiss. So I bought it, and after playing in my home studio for about a week (with master volume never past 2 o'clock), it started to produce some horrible sounds - first the grill, responding to F, and then the amp (to G). Lifting the combo and putting it on it's back immediately revealed that there is a couple of runaway bolts rolling inside. I removed the grill, opened the amp, put the bolts back and carefully reassembled, but no luck - the box still resonates and rattles on G. My previous combo, SWR WorkingPro 12 used to rattle the whole house, but never behaved like this. I guess, "Made in China" doesn't really work, and you can't make a too light bass cabinet without sacrificing quality. What a disappointment. Returned it today, and will think long and hard where to go next.
Can't help but to be concerned. I'd love for the 210 to be loud enough for an average bar gig, and be able to add a 15 to that for anything bigger. But I don't want to have to go through the buying and returning process if this thing is a rattle fest when it starts getting a little cranked. Thanks for the response. I'd like to hear others experience too.
It rattles Posted by Sergio Z from San Jose, CA on May 5, 2010
Experience w/product: I have used it
Reviewer's Background: Recording composer (kbd, bass, drums)
Reviewer's Play Style: Rock, fusion
I played this amp for about two hours in Guitar Center. Delightful. This was the only amp able to reveal the amazing sound of my Music Man 25 Anniversary Edition bass -- very transparent, great low end, hi-fi high end, very little hiss. So I bought it, and after playing in my home studio for about a week (with master volume never past 2 o'clock), it started to produce some horrible sounds - first the grill, responding to F, and then the amp (to G). Lifting the combo and putting it on it's back immediately revealed that there is a couple of runaway bolts rolling inside. I removed the grill, opened the amp, put the bolts back and carefully reassembled, but no luck - the box still resonates and rattles on G. My previous combo, SWR WorkingPro 12 used to rattle the whole house, but never behaved like this. I guess, "Made in China" doesn't really work, and you can't make a too light bass cabinet without sacrificing quality. What a disappointment. Returned it today, and will think long and hard where to go next.
Can't help but to be concerned. I'd love for the 210 to be loud enough for an average bar gig, and be able to add a 15 to that for anything bigger. But I don't want to have to go through the buying and returning process if this thing is a rattle fest when it starts getting a little cranked. Thanks for the response. I'd like to hear others experience too.
I have a MB210, and I've not experienced any rattling.
But, honestly, in a bar, with a loud guitarist and a crowd of people talking? I'm pretty sure that the 210 might not cut it. (So far, I've only played smaller, fairly quite gigs, on upright only, and a medium-loud rehearsal with upright and electric).
But the good thing is that you have an option for an extension cab.
But, honestly, in a bar, with a loud guitarist and a crowd of people talking? I'm pretty sure that the 210 might not cut it. (So far, I've only played smaller, fairly quite gigs, on upright only, and a medium-loud rehearsal with upright and electric).
But the good thing is that you have an option for an extension cab.
I have two MB210s. I exchanged one early on because the horn was noisy. Turns out, the horn's just noisy on these. I leave the horns off.
No other problems. I bought covers but don't always use them, and both amps have dealt with going to rehearsals and gigs with no problems. I'm careful not to bump the knobs is all. No dents or any marks beyond normal wear. This amp would make terrible cover in a gunfight, but I'm OK with that.
Lately, I've pushed them. I get lazy sometimes and just bring one. So the last couple of times I cranked it. Passive bass, but through a pedal board, and into the active input. I get loud, and deep, and no rattling, and it still works at the end of the night.
YMMV.
--Bomb
No other problems. I bought covers but don't always use them, and both amps have dealt with going to rehearsals and gigs with no problems. I'm careful not to bump the knobs is all. No dents or any marks beyond normal wear. This amp would make terrible cover in a gunfight, but I'm OK with that.
Lately, I've pushed them. I get lazy sometimes and just bring one. So the last couple of times I cranked it. Passive bass, but through a pedal board, and into the active input. I get loud, and deep, and no rattling, and it still works at the end of the night.
YMMV.
--Bomb
In my experience with the MB210, you have to be careful with the lows while getting loud. The speakers do fart out on the low E and below if you push it too hard. Back off on the low bass and it will do OK. I have had no rattling of the cabinet or any other parts on my amp yet. If screws are coming loose, I would think a little thread locker should do the trick. I'm thinking of adding an extension, either the 2x10 or 1x15 that GK seems to be dragging their feet on. Maybe that will help to carry the large rooms a bit better.
OK, we had a loud jam at my house last night. Guitar player played through my Marshall 412 with his Vox AC30 head, drummer puts the OOO in LOOOUD. The MB212 sounded kinda small....then I turned it UP. With the master approaching noon (actually 11:00) it was shaking the house with big lows, but not sounding as defined as usual. So I nudged the pickup blend on my JO5 back toward the bridge pickup and....drum roll please....turned ON the tweeter! I've never liked the tweet on this thing but that did the trick. The MB212 was roaring like a big ol' stack, only with plenty of definition.
At this point it's hard to imagine the MB212 not being enough for anything I do. Lots of you out there play a LOT louder than I do however, so YMMV. I was reading on another thread about someone considering TWO MB212s...1000 watts, 4-12s. My advice would be to get ONE and break it in thoroughly. (they DO get louder after break-in) If that's not enough, you should probably be using ear plugs.
At this point it's hard to imagine the MB212 not being enough for anything I do. Lots of you out there play a LOT louder than I do however, so YMMV. I was reading on another thread about someone considering TWO MB212s...1000 watts, 4-12s. My advice would be to get ONE and break it in thoroughly. (they DO get louder after break-in) If that's not enough, you should probably be using ear plugs.
Semi-humorous sidenote:
Last night I heard some 'scurrying around' like a mouse or something. Well, I've had good luck with treating rodent problems with PLENTY of low-end. (At my old house I found a closet with a bunch of wires and stuff that had mouse droppings. This was right around the time I joined TalkBass, so I started testing bass amps VERY loudly. No more mice.)
So I wheels out my MB212 and my Lakland 55-94 (preferable for its pre-amp). Volume CRANKed on the amp and lows cranked on the pre....long story short, it's been quiet today. (I found a nice F# on the 14th fret of the E string that would sustain f-o-r-e-v-e-r)
I DID hit the end of the headroom and the limiter kicked in. The whole house was literally vibrating in sympathy with every note resonating a different part of the house.
This may be a new business venture.
Last night I heard some 'scurrying around' like a mouse or something. Well, I've had good luck with treating rodent problems with PLENTY of low-end. (At my old house I found a closet with a bunch of wires and stuff that had mouse droppings. This was right around the time I joined TalkBass, so I started testing bass amps VERY loudly. No more mice.)
So I wheels out my MB212 and my Lakland 55-94 (preferable for its pre-amp). Volume CRANKed on the amp and lows cranked on the pre....long story short, it's been quiet today. (I found a nice F# on the 14th fret of the E string that would sustain f-o-r-e-v-e-r)
I DID hit the end of the headroom and the limiter kicked in. The whole house was literally vibrating in sympathy with every note resonating a different part of the house.
This may be a new business venture.
I used my MB212 yesterday at an outdoor gig on the Malibu pier. As you know it takes a ton of volume and low end to make bass work outdoors because there's nothing to bounce off of, the sound just dissipates into the air.
I have an "outdoor" rig I would normally use for such gigs, it's a Carvin B1500 pushing 1250 watts into a Schroeder 412 BMF. This thing works a lot like an 810 rig, pushing a massive column of air off the stage.
Well, for this one I also had to bring an entire PA system AND my guitarist and his rig, so space in my van was tight. I decided to take a chance and leave the big rig at home in favor of the MB212.
I had to turn up the Gain and Master Volume higher than I ever have in a club, same with the Bass (which I normally have to cut) but it still wasn't maxed out. Settings were: Gain - 1 o'clock, Master Volume - 2 o'clock, Bass - 2 o'clock, Low Mid - 12 o'clock, High Mid - 1 o'clock, Treble - 1 o'clock.
The band wasn't stupid loud, but again, being outdoors, the guitarist and keyboards were cranking pretty good.
My amp sounded great! This little guy just amazes me every time I take it out.
I have an "outdoor" rig I would normally use for such gigs, it's a Carvin B1500 pushing 1250 watts into a Schroeder 412 BMF. This thing works a lot like an 810 rig, pushing a massive column of air off the stage.
Well, for this one I also had to bring an entire PA system AND my guitarist and his rig, so space in my van was tight. I decided to take a chance and leave the big rig at home in favor of the MB212.
I had to turn up the Gain and Master Volume higher than I ever have in a club, same with the Bass (which I normally have to cut) but it still wasn't maxed out. Settings were: Gain - 1 o'clock, Master Volume - 2 o'clock, Bass - 2 o'clock, Low Mid - 12 o'clock, High Mid - 1 o'clock, Treble - 1 o'clock.
The band wasn't stupid loud, but again, being outdoors, the guitarist and keyboards were cranking pretty good.
My amp sounded great! This little guy just amazes me every time I take it out.
I was just stunned by how well it did outdoors. The gig wasn't super-loud though, and PA support was abundant. Still, I just turned up the gain to 2:00 and it fattened up nicely. I was glad the DI was noisy because the miked sound was just perfect to me...big, well defined, lots of character, lows-mids-highs all represented nicely.
I got my 2x10 last week to complete my stack.
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I tried it last Saturday at an outside practice and it didn't work right. I disconnected the 2x10 cabinet and the MB210 combo held it's own easy. Lots of power by itself.
I took the combo and cab to GC Sunday and a guy checked it out and it seems to be fine now. I had one of the 1/4" plugs going into a speakon adapter and the speaker cable/adapter connection caused some phasing problems. We hooked it up with a double speakon cable and it kicked in.
When I tried it at practice it sounded weak and the speakers sounded like they were crackling and popping. I actually had a bigger sound with just the MB210 by itself. A couple guys on here said it may be a phase problem. It works fine now but I'm not sure about the speakers until I play it in a better environment than my house. It shakes the windows along with everything else in here. I'm hoping, and pretty confident the phasing caused the "speaker problem". I'll know more after this weekend. I know when I add the 210MBE to the combo now it has some serious punch! Keeping my fingers crossed that everything is fine...I think it will be. I'll keep you informed.
I tried it last Saturday at an outside practice and it didn't work right. I disconnected the 2x10 cabinet and the MB210 combo held it's own easy. Lots of power by itself.
I took the combo and cab to GC Sunday and a guy checked it out and it seems to be fine now. I had one of the 1/4" plugs going into a speakon adapter and the speaker cable/adapter connection caused some phasing problems. We hooked it up with a double speakon cable and it kicked in.
When I tried it at practice it sounded weak and the speakers sounded like they were crackling and popping. I actually had a bigger sound with just the MB210 by itself. A couple guys on here said it may be a phase problem. It works fine now but I'm not sure about the speakers until I play it in a better environment than my house. It shakes the windows along with everything else in here. I'm hoping, and pretty confident the phasing caused the "speaker problem". I'll know more after this weekend. I know when I add the 210MBE to the combo now it has some serious punch! Keeping my fingers crossed that everything is fine...I think it will be. I'll keep you informed.
