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how do you play behind the beat

I think playing behind the beat at 200 doesn't make sense. This is an energetic speed so I suspect that the drummer wants to tell NOT TO PUSH THE BEAT !!
Best thing to do is practice with a click at that tempo and be aware of your timing. You might notice that you'll find the tune slow ;-)

Good luck and play with a click may be even with your drummer if you can !!
 
well technically if you check any sheet music you will realise you dont actually play ahead or behind a beat but always on the beat the only thing is you have rests in between which create a false perception of skewed time.
 
I am going to call upon an old example of ahead and behind the beat, that is fairly popular.

Ever heard of Pink Floyd's Money? The song starts out with a laid back bass with the sound effects, later into the song I once heard someone comment that it sounds like they sped up, but they didn't. They went from behind the beat to in front

In my experience it is a more laid back feel, less staccato sounding and more legato.

Just try it out with your drummer, ahead and behind and see what works.
 
sudarshan89 said:
well technically if you check any sheet music you will realise you dont actually play ahead or behind a beat but always on the beat the only thing is you have rests in between which create a false perception of skewed time.

Sheet music doesn't tell the whole story. Where a person places or interprets the beat, usually a drummer or bassist is all about feel. Its hard to explain but even harder to type.

The only way I can think to explain it in writing is this:
If you're counting one, two, three........
Ahead of the beat would on the O as in O-n-e.
On the beat would on the N as in o-N-e.
Behind the beat would be on the E, o-n-E.

If you've ever cut and pasted a digital track, there is a range where you can slip that sucker in and still be on time....

John Bonham is among the most famous back beat drummers, his feel is a prime example of playing behind the beat.
 
What we do is we move the beat so the representation is miss matched to the reference. So if I play behind the beat for a whole song, if you isolate my playing every note will have the same time frame.
So am I playing everything on the 1 or the 2 or the 3 or the 4?
Without another reference all you hear is the four accents in time and in tempo to themselves.

Try this exercise in the link. The hard part is the change overs, but once in it becomes easy. The more you practice it the easier it becomes, so it then becomes a case of application, finding ways to use the exercise till it no longer becomes an issue.

 
What we do is we move the beat so the representation is miss matched to the reference. So if I play behind the beat for a whole song, if you isolate my playing every note will have the same time frame.
So am I playing everything on the 1 or the 2 or the 3 or the 4?
Without another reference all you hear is the four accents in time and in tempo to themselves.

Try this exercise in the link. The hard part is the change overs, but once in it becomes easy. The more you practice it the easier it becomes, so it then becomes a case of application, finding ways to use the exercise till it no longer becomes an issue.




Very interesting exercise Fergie. Thanks for posting. Just one small point on the clip itself......the volume could be increased a bit. :)
 
Very interesting exercise Fergie. Thanks for posting. Just one small point on the clip itself......the volume could be increased a bit. :)

The clip is an out-take. Use the exercise as a framework, the C scale just makes it easy for all to relate to! So once the idea is learned it can be applied to any practice. This one is the third of a trilogy, so may by check out a 1 & 2 for the previous exercises that support this one.

The Trilogy exercises will sort out and put in perspective a wide range of issues for players, those three exercises are an excellent foundation for players.
 
I know this is going to sound a little smart aleky or new agey but I find my playing posture effects my playing in regards to the beat. If I lean ahead a little physically then my playing tends to be a little ahead of the beat. Whereas if I lean back a little more on my heals then my playing naturally goes a little further back on the beat.

I'm not sure if that's any help or makes any sense to you but it seems to work for me.

Stay Brown,
Rev J
 
I guess it's fairly easy if you're tight to begin with. Personally I struggle a bit with timing in general, and it's not like I can control if I'm slightly too early or slightly too late.

Of course you can control it and you can change it, but it's a mental thing not a physical thing. If you have to be able to change it in your head, in other words hear it.

As I mentioned before, in the exercise I posted you can learn to play one and in-between the beats...that part is easy. But changing between them, now that's a different matter.

In part one we learn to keep tempo and learn that just because the notes come round earlier as we sub-divide the changes, the feeling is the exercise gets faster, but it does not, its just the changes come round earlier.
This exercise accustoms the brain not to panic about changes but just play.

In part 2 we learn about making a decision on when to play. Using mutes we have to make a conscious decision to play or not. We also learn how to control the mute in relation to the right or left hand.

In exercise 3 we learn to sub-divide the beat in eight different places, and make a choice on playing or mutiing within the sub-divides.
The reality of this exercise is about being in time to yourself, but playing against the count.

So in reality if the strong beat is one and three, but you play strong beats on two and four, the reality is it is the same time, tempo, and physical process to play each, but there relation to a count in is different. Once the idea is understood and accepted then it's application can be anything, but understanding it is the most important thing. Once you understand how to brak down a count it becomes internalised, this leaves you free to play, not count or worry about tempo...that just relates itself back to what you are playing and what you hear in your head.

Pt.1