+1 Just like at work.......keep your views on these topics to yourself and you will have long fruitful relationships. Music is the common bond ......not politics race and religion.
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How important are personal beliefs in bands?
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+1 Just like at work.......keep your views on these topics to yourself and you will have long fruitful relationships. Music is the common bond ......not politics race and religion.
I can bait open-minded progressives all day long, but I know not to do it around my bandmates, it just makes people angry and accomplishes nothing.
Whatever side you may be on, keep it to yourself and if anyone starts talking about politics, kill the conversation ASAP. "I oppose democracy and want to restore monarchy" usually does the trick. Nobody wants to discuss politics with me after that.
Whatever side you may be on, keep it to yourself and if anyone starts talking about politics, kill the conversation ASAP. "I oppose democracy and want to restore monarchy" usually does the trick. Nobody wants to discuss politics with me after that.
Personally I don't think they are that important. I know I have different political views than most of my musician friends, so I just don't talk about it. But really, the question is how important are they to you? Is it just a matter of disagreeing about public policy, or is it a deeply held belief that the people on the "other side" are morally wrong? If you really feel strongly about not wanting to associate with people of a certain political stripe, then you need to be true to that.
No, you didn't. Leaving them without a bass player for a gig was immature and unprofessional. You could have told them that it wasn't going to work out at the first rehearsal.
People who get that angry over politics aren't anyone I'd want to be around for long, be it in a band or anywhere else. Irrational people are going to be a problem in the long run. Expect band drama.
I have always believed in the "Hang Factor". With bands, as with all other aspects of my life, I choose to hang with people I like. If I wouldn't hang-out with them, I don't want to be in a band with them. I have been on the road touring with people I didn't like and it is just not worth it.
This one!
I had no problems playing with very deeply believing, religious singer. We talked a lot, we both had a VERY different opinions on many things (and I'm very radical - catholic church killed in Europe a lot more people than communism and fascism together so I kinda don't like them much
Music is most important thing in being a musician. Politics and religion only distrurbs when it comes to playing music.
1. I spent decades as a gigging pro, playing with a broad spectrum of bands. As a family guy, I often found myself in powerful, meaningful musical relationships with guys whose lifestyles saddened and offended me. In the process, I learned that great art isn't always birthed in comfortable surroundings.
I also learned that music is the great leveller. For one thing, it allows you to find common ground with people you might have never met, if not for the music. For another, social concerns don't carry much weight in a strictly musical relationship- you might be a really nice guy, but if you can't play the parts, you're out.
For a long time, I found peace by learning to watch my mouth, separate my business and private life, and turn a blind eye to things that bothered me offstage. This wasn't always easy for me at a personal level, but those times were VERY satisfying musically.
However, things changed for me when I had a religious conversion in my early forties. Two things happened as a result: I started to spend a greater proportion of my time with people who shared common attitudes and beliefs, and my old gigs started getting squeezed out by stuff that matched my convictions more closely- charity gigs, church services, etc.
This merging of my musical and social lives has been enjoyable, even if I've sometimes paid a price musically. The good news, is that there are good players in all walks of life. These days, it takes me longer to find the right situations than it did when I was more broad-minded about my bandmates, but I'm currently playing great music, AND enjoying healthy relationships off the stand.
So yes, personal beliefs are important, and if you're patient, they don't have to be incompatible with making good music.
2. Yes, you did the wrong thing.
Having a hissy fit and storming out of a rehearsal after an insult is one thing. You're only human, and depending on my mood at the time, I might have done it too. But manning up and playing one lousy gig, wouldn't have killed you.
My dad taught me that in becoming a musician, I became part of a larger brotherhood. He also taught me to respect a simple code of honour amongst musicians: You never let personal issues affect the audience, and you never screw over another musician. When you left those guys in the lurch with only 3 days left before a gig, you violated both aspects of the code.
The time to give the other guy a piece of your mind, and if necessary, to advise the band that you quit, would have been AFTER the gig. IMO, anyone who tells you different, simply doesn't get it.
Now several of my fellow TB'rs have said way more than I want to know. TB is not the place for this. The OP tried to ask a question but admittedly participated in the "event", so I am for closing this as many of you have just used this to vent your own personal beliefs. Nothing will change the smell of a room like political rhetoric. As a country we have become adversarial towards others political beliefs and most seem to want to bash the other side rather than work together to improve tomorrow. In today's politics I see most politicians telling us how bad the other guy is rather than explaining there own platform. Until we can stop bashing each others views we will continue to move towards anarchy. I firmly belong in one of these groups but I am sickened by the negativity and don't want to hear about candidate A's plan from candidate B and vice versa. BOTH the OP and the guitarist were wrong. Quitting with out giving proper notice is childish and if I knew you I wouldn't want to hire you knowing you left like that EVEN IF I WAS OF THE SAME BELIEF. It shows immaturity and I would be concerned that something similar might happen if I was working with you. Find thicker skin and stay out of Dodge...
To the OP:
1. No, personal beliefs are not important in a band. One of our rules is never to discuss politics, religion or sexual orientation. Now, if the personal beliefs are directly relevant to the band, like respect for other people's property, dedication to practice, etc., then it is obviously important, but those aren't the type of beliefs you were talking about.
2. No, you didn't do the right thing. You started the incident by expressing opinions about a very volatile political situation. Then you twisted off when your bandmate disagreed. He was wrong, too, by insulting you, but it wouldn't have happened if you hadn't brought the subject up. It could have ended there, but you twisted off further by quitting the band. Bad move.
Music is too important to be spoiled by things like politics, racism, etc.
Just my opinion.
1. No, personal beliefs are not important in a band. One of our rules is never to discuss politics, religion or sexual orientation. Now, if the personal beliefs are directly relevant to the band, like respect for other people's property, dedication to practice, etc., then it is obviously important, but those aren't the type of beliefs you were talking about.
2. No, you didn't do the right thing. You started the incident by expressing opinions about a very volatile political situation. Then you twisted off when your bandmate disagreed. He was wrong, too, by insulting you, but it wouldn't have happened if you hadn't brought the subject up. It could have ended there, but you twisted off further by quitting the band. Bad move.
Music is too important to be spoiled by things like politics, racism, etc.
Just my opinion.
Sorry man, I think you got carried away. Its kinda a dont dish it out of you cant take it thing.
I can't really comment on if personal beliefs matter. It's an individual thing: if you don't mine being around people that disagree with you on some issues it doesn't. Otherwise, yes.
And no, you did not do the right thing. Assuming you left middle of the day on Monday and they had until Friday to find a replacement, that gives them three days to find someone else. That's hardly enough time to find someone and be sure that they will be ready for the gig (unless they are incredibly professional, although if that were the case they would have been booked for a Friday a week or more in advance, at least). In other words there's a very good chance you screwed them out of a gig.
The guitarist was not cool at all if what you said was true and he laughed at you as you left. However, it wouldn't have hurt to let them know you were leaving and not bother with them until the gig, and then play the gig and be done with them. Also, if the guitarist can't have argue with someone without resorting to personal attacks why would you want to let them get under your skin? Doesn't seem worth it.
And no, you did not do the right thing. Assuming you left middle of the day on Monday and they had until Friday to find a replacement, that gives them three days to find someone else. That's hardly enough time to find someone and be sure that they will be ready for the gig (unless they are incredibly professional, although if that were the case they would have been booked for a Friday a week or more in advance, at least). In other words there's a very good chance you screwed them out of a gig.
The guitarist was not cool at all if what you said was true and he laughed at you as you left. However, it wouldn't have hurt to let them know you were leaving and not bother with them until the gig, and then play the gig and be done with them. Also, if the guitarist can't have argue with someone without resorting to personal attacks why would you want to let them get under your skin? Doesn't seem worth it.
If I understand this correctly. You left the band that hired you to play because one of the members doesn't see things your way and they hurt your feelings.
I say Grow Up.
I've played gigs with people I've absolutely despised, and I'm sure the feeling was mutual.
I didn't have to like them or hang out with them. All I had to do was rehearse and play on stage with them. We never became friends, but when it came to the music, all personal beliefs went out the window.
It's called professionalism. Being a true pro doesn't just mean you get paid to do something.
I say Grow Up.
I've played gigs with people I've absolutely despised, and I'm sure the feeling was mutual.
I didn't have to like them or hang out with them. All I had to do was rehearse and play on stage with them. We never became friends, but when it came to the music, all personal beliefs went out the window.
It's called professionalism. Being a true pro doesn't just mean you get paid to do something.
Ric5
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I told my wife this story ... She said "Good for you!"
Life is too short to be in a band with people who don't respect you.
Not picking political sides here. I've been in a similar situation where I simply couldn't abide a loudmouth ideologue bandmate, but in the circle that I run in, showing up to a scheduled rehearsal with no gear will earn you the reputation of being unreliable. Word gets around. The good gigs will become harder to get.
I think a more reasonable way to deal with your ideological differences is to follow the advice of the many who've posted here: 1. Leave it at the door; 2. If the other person can't leave it at the door, work it out personally, not publicly; 3. If you feel the need to leave the band, make an arrangement to leave the band so that you're respectful of everyone's time and commitment. Be big about it, agree to disagree, then part ways in a civil manner, leaving the other person to ruin their professional reputation.
I think a more reasonable way to deal with your ideological differences is to follow the advice of the many who've posted here: 1. Leave it at the door; 2. If the other person can't leave it at the door, work it out personally, not publicly; 3. If you feel the need to leave the band, make an arrangement to leave the band so that you're respectful of everyone's time and commitment. Be big about it, agree to disagree, then part ways in a civil manner, leaving the other person to ruin their professional reputation.
Ric5
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Why spend time in a band if you hate each other ... quitting bands like that leads to pure joy!
you made a stupid uninformed comment, expect people to call you on it no matter where you are. This has nothing to do with a band, its all about you man. It would be one thing if you were making a valid point about OWS, but thats not the case. I play with people far left and right of my political viewpoint. We talk about things we disagree about all the time, and i find it a lot better than 'dont ask dont tell'
that is a lame way to rock my friend
that is a lame way to rock my friend
The money was good, and like I said, I didn't have to hang out with them. And when you have a gig that pays a minimum of $200 a night per man in a market where most BANDS are lucky to get $250 for a weekend, and play 2-3 nights a week, it was a good income to have.
Just because we didn't see eye to eye on life outside the band doesn't mean we carried it over to the stage.
Purely for the sake of getting data out there, not making a political point (my personal feelings about OWS are very mixed, there's all sorts of people and opinions under that particular tent) ... there's a survey documented Invalid Link Removed that gives a number of findings about the protesters. In particular:
So, to your original point: your comment was, strictly speaking, uninformed. But the guitarist still sounds like a d**k.
So, to your original point: your comment was, strictly speaking, uninformed. But the guitarist still sounds like a d**k.
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