Is a College Degree Absolutely Necessary

[Lady Kayri]

I would suggest you start out working part time (perhaps in the trades in an apprenticeship in the field you're most interested in) and going to community (local) college part time as well. Many local community colleges will bend over backwards to help students who work set up class schedules that will work with their work schedule. In large part the first year or so will be classes you'll need whatever you decide to study; in the meantime, you can begin to figure out which courses of study will best help you later on in life.

I sometimes think that we do a disservice by wanting kids to go directly from high school into college. A few years working at a hands-on job of some sort would help a lot of students a) figure out where their true interests lie, and b) give them more incentive to do well in school and study. Even in the 'non party' universities and colleges, a lot of students seem to be very unfocused; a few years working at real jobs has helped a few people I know see the importance of an 'advanced' education a lot clearer.

One headhunter I once met said that a lot of companies see a college degree as an indication that the individual is smart / dedicated enough that they can be trained to perform whatever job the company wants them to work in.

 

[Pilgrim]

You make a good point - the downside is that leaving high school is a point in time when it's easy to transition to college. Once you enter the working world, it becomes more difficult to do so.

 

[jmattbassplaya]

Don`t let people tell you a degree isn`t necessary. It`s true - this piece of paper won`t guarantee you a job, however, it`s often needed to even get you in the door for an interview. What`s even more disturbing is that many employers now want MD`s if you ever plan on elevating through a company.

My brother is a bit of a computer genius and he left college early because he felt he wasn`t getting his moneys worth out of it. However, because he never even got a BS he is denied the opportunity for many jobs that he is more than qualified for because of his 12 years of in the field experience.

I hate to say it but you need a degree. It`s a standard in the world if you want to make at least a decent living.

 

[scootron]

I agree with TrooperFarva...chondro776's advice looks bad to me. A degree may not be necessary to work for a charitable organization like chondro's, but those gigs can be hard to find, especially in a bad economy.

I'm not sure if this was specifically mentioned before, but remember that college isn't like the Army. You can sign up for it, but if you don't like it you don't have to stay for the whole hitch.

Besides help in getting a job, college can help you develop your inter-personal skills, and find out who you really are. That is something that is very tough to do living at home.

I was the first from my family to go to college, so I got little advice in that regard. I couldn't be where I am now without higher education (a judge), but the college experience was more valuable for what it taught me about life, not simply as a step in the employment process.

Good luck to you. I had questions and worries about this very decision 35 years ago. I think that decision may be even harder now. If you are going to do it, though, do it now. Don't wait until your twenties or thirties. Life has a way of taking up all your time when you are older and pick up responsibilities such as family, etc.

I wish the best for you.

 

[Angus]

The BS degree is the new High School Diploma.

I'd take this a step further and say that a master's degree is the new Bachelor's. To be competitive in any decently competitive market these days, coming straight out of school you really need to have an MS to have much of a chance to get the good stuff. Bachelor's mean so much less these days, which is unfortunate.

Given that, where do you stand without a bachelor's? Well, it's tough, to say the least.

If you have the opportunity to go to college, take it. You can always go back to working in trades after you have a degree, but you won't be able to get a job as an engineer after working as a mechanic for 10 years. You need the paper.

To the OP: I worked as a machinist and mechanic on the side for a lot of my time as an undergraduate, and it's a really fun experience. I love the work. But the pay stinks, the benefits are bad, and it's not the most stable position. You talk to any of the guys working there, and they'll tell you that you are nuts for not pursuing something more...especially if you ask them how good their health care plan is.

 

[Munjibunga]

For someone with your interests, a degree in mechanical engineering would position you to do a lot more than fix cars. You could design them and incorporate your passion into things that would benefit society. The reasons you express for not attending college are generally weak and naive. I will tell you that sure, once in a while a smart person with no college degree will do well in a career, but the chances of that are muliplied dramatically with your ticket in the door ... a degree. Engineers are in critically short supply in this country, and that shortage translates into opportunity for people with the capacity and will to make the sacrifices necessary to go to college. You sound long on capacity and a little short on will. Go to college.

 

[Angus]

I am 32, work as the director of a 501c3 nature preserve and have no degree. I deliberately have no degree. I am educated, but saw no need to pay $50k to obtain information that was available (get this) for free.

I have worked in the Enviro Ed field for about 12 years now, and while it was hard to get my foot in the door, my experience is worth 2x as much as a degree IMO.

I am not a hoop jumper. I cannot buy into a system that I feel is comprehensively flawed.

Go down the list of athletes with degrees from good schools that can't put together a coherent sentence. These schools should be ashamed of themselves, but they are not.

Go down the list of people working in fields that have nothing to do with their coursework. Shouldn't that tell you something?

College is a scam. I wish it were about getting an education, (and to be sure, you can get one there, but that isn't their purpose anymore) but it isn't. In the information age, a dedicated and intelligent person has little need to go IMO.

Of course, it will help you more than hurt you, but I couldn't with a clear conscience contribute to the problem.

I also think that as a society we attend college at an entirely inappropriate age. We should go in our 30's not our 20's.

My thoughts....

Sorry man, but this is really bad advice, imo. It sounds a bit awful to say, but maybe some time in college would've told you that it isn't a scam. I don't know how you could come to such a strong conclusion without having actually gone through it.

(Looking at athletes maybe not be a great sample population. )

Besides, with the quality of education people are leaving high school with these days, I can't imagine many going straight into the workforce.

It's a nice idea and all- to "live off the grid" and "not get scammed by the man" (where man presumably equals college)...but that really doesn't fly these days. High school doesn't prepare you well for the majority of the jobs that people seek, particularly in the sciences (though I think it has an equal amount to offer the humanities of course). High school physics is a joke, and I would never hire a high school grad for any trade that required much serious calculation.

That said, there are plenty of jobs where you don't need it, or where experience really does count for a lot more than a college degree. Well, obviously experience counts for way more than a degree, because college doesn't teach you specific jobs, so experience will always trump the piece of paper. The problem is, these days, it's hard to even get your foot anywhere near the door without it.

 

[RWP]

Why would anyone want to miss out on all that drunken partying? If you have the opportunity to go, then go. Just don't let them brainwash you with a load of liberal crap, and they will try. :scowl:

 

[BassyBill]

Why would anyone want to miss out on all that drunken partying? If you have the opportunity to go, then go. Just don't let them brainwash you with a load of liberal crap, and they will try. :scowl:

Of course, some folks there could also try to brainwash you with a load of right-wing, ill-informed, reactionary, not very clever, dumbass redneck conservative crap, too. Be equally suspicious of both is the best advice.

 

[greekorican]

I sort of agree with Chondro, though it's hard to argue a point like this. The system is flawed for a number of reasons. I think colleges are more of a business, with how expensive tuition gets. I have a problem with a Masters being the new Bachelor's Degree. I can see how in some professions, extra education would pay off, such as a doctor or engineer. What I disagree with is that you can get some downright stupid Master's Degrees. My gym teacher pulls 90k a year teaching High-school PE just because she has a Masters (in PE? give me a break.). No wonder Chicago Public Schools are so broke. IMO that is stupidity. I also don't think that a college degree should trump experience. Unfortunately, my griping on the internet won't change the system, I have to play by their rules.

With that being said, I've applied to college, so I'm not ruling it out yet. I'm just examining my options. I've always been a good student, but I've also always hated going to school. It bores me to death. But I've made it 3/4 of the way, I suppose another 4 years would not kill me.

 

[TrooperFarva]

Of course, some folks there could also try to brainwash you with a load of right-wing, ill-informed, reactionary, not very clever, dumbass redneck conservative crap, too. Be equally suspicious of both is the best advice.

I see what you did there

 

[UncleFluffy]

I sort of agree with Chondro, though it's hard to argue a point like this. The system is flawed for a number of reasons. I think colleges are more of a business, with how expensive tuition gets. I have a problem with a Masters being the new Bachelor's Degree. I can see how in some professions, extra education would pay off, such as a doctor or engineer. What I disagree with is that you can get some downright stupid Master's Degrees. My gym teacher pulls 90k a year teaching High-school PE just because she has a Masters (in PE? give me a break.). No wonder Chicago Public Schools are so broke. IMO that is stupidity. I also don't think that a college degree should trump experience. Unfortunately, my griping on the internet won't change the system, I have to play by their rules.

With that being said, I've applied to college, so I'm not ruling it out yet. I'm just examining my options. I've always been a good student, but I've also always hated going to school. It bores me to death. But I've made it 3/4 of the way, I suppose another 4 years would not kill me.

I'm going to be blunt: just suck it up and get your degree.

No-one knows what the future holds, but you can make some pretty good guesses at probabilities. If you don't get your degree there's a better than 90% chance that you're going to regret it in 20 years time.

I'm an engineer (digital electronics, mainly), 20+ years experience, and sometimes I hire folks. If a resume crosses my desk with no degree and less than 5 years experience, I'm not going to even bother reading the second page. This isn't unusual.

Yes, the system is somewhat flawed, but it is what it is. You've got a choice between two less-than-perfect options. Choose the one that sucks less and gives you better choices in the future.

 

[NJL]

I think associates degrees and certifications can be just as helpful, if not more helpful in finding a job than a 4 year degree. It depends on the degree and the job.

and i agree with jive.. he gave me some advice way over a year ago.. i switched industries (after a brutal layoff from my old job) - i'm in school on a grant, i work part time for an awesome company.

the funny thing is last night with jive and I talked on the phone, he started cracking up, "man, you got into the IT industry fast!!" LOL

one thing my new boss told me is, "it's not what you have, it's what you know".. he's totally right - he's brilliant and very experienced in IT and just got the associates that i'm going to be getting. another example: another RH Engineer on our team is only 24, no college, but KNOWS what he's doing. he's brilliant, too..

just my 2 pesos..

 

[IotaNet]

... Keep your options open.

... Think of life as a long corridor filled with unlocked doors. As you grow up, the choices you make and the education you get determine how many of those doors stay unlocked. It's a subtractive, not additive, process.

Don't graduate from HS? Two-thirds (or more) of those doors will now be locked. Don't graduate from college? Half. Don't get an advanced degree? Maybe 20 percent. Commit a felony? 90 percent. Sorry for the simplistic analogy, but you get the idea ...

I can't tell you what to do but I can tell you what has worked for me.

I'm 48 years old and have managed to carve out a pretty comfortable living. I know for a FACT that the lifestyle I lead and the income I enjoy would not be possible without my degree. (There are jobs I've had that I wouldn't even have been able to interview for without a degree.)

A Bachelors degree is worthwhile if for no reason than it differentiates you from people who don't have a degree. In other words if a hiring manager is looking at 2 candidates who are equal in every way except one has a degree and the other doesn't, who do you think will get the job?

A degree is no guarantee of a job but it definitely increases your odds.

 

[L-A]

I sort of agree with Chondro, though it's hard to argue a point like this. The system is flawed for a number of reasons.

I have a boss who told me that this is what he wanted to know of his candidates. That they could navigate through, and use a system they didn't necessarily agree with. I can understand.

With that being said, I've applied to college, so I'm not ruling it out yet. I'm just examining my options. I've always been a good student, but I've also always hated going to school. It bores me to death. But I've made it 3/4 of the way, I suppose another 4 years would not kill me.

Keep in mind that a well-chosen degree directly concerns what you're interested in. Not all courses, obviously, but the ratio is much more encouraging.

 

[Angus]

I sort of agree with Chondro, though it's hard to argue a point like this. The system is flawed for a number of reasons. I think colleges are more of a business, with how expensive tuition gets. I have a problem with a Masters being the new Bachelor's Degree. I can see how in some professions, extra education would pay off, such as a doctor or engineer. What I disagree with is that you can get some downright stupid Master's Degrees. My gym teacher pulls 90k a year teaching High-school PE just because she has a Masters (in PE? give me a break.). No wonder Chicago Public Schools are so broke. IMO that is stupidity. I also don't think that a college degree should trump experience. Unfortunately, my griping on the internet won't change the system, I have to play by their rules.

You can get stupid Bachelor's degrees, too. Nobody is forcing you to get them (or get any at all, for that matter). However I would argue that there is never a downside to the workforce being better educated. You may have a problem with the bachelor's being the new master's, but it's a side effect of more and more of nation's high school graduates going to college and the work force becoming more competitive as a result. This can really only be a good thing.

And that said, I doubt your gym teacher is pulling in $90k.

Anyway, I don't think you get to complain about the "problems with the college system" until you've actually been there, because I think prior to that most high school students don't really have a clue what it's about.

With that being said, I've applied to college, so I'm not ruling it out yet. I'm just examining my options. I've always been a good student, but I've also always hated going to school. It bores me to death. But I've made it 3/4 of the way, I suppose another 4 years would not kill me.

Do it. You'll still take classes you hate and that are boring, but as you get closer and closer to finding a career that will intellectually stimulate you and motivate you, the classes you take will be more and more interesting and engaging. Usually.

 

[GregDunn]

I really had to have at least a BS degree in order to start out with any kind of engineering job in the 70s. Be that as it may, there are two separate issues here:

1) How good are you at what you do?

2) Do you have the qualifications to continue to be a success?

Some of my best friends are non-degreed folks working in technical areas, and probably know as much or more than I do about lots of teh things I studied in college. But when explaining my reasoning, I like to mention one big advantage that the college study gave me: it taught me how to discipline myself, learn, and apply what I learned.

Now maybe you're one of those fortunate people who go to high school already knowing how to do those things already. I wasn't, but after college I understood how to apply myself much more effectively. Since then,. I've taught myself a number of programming languages, some advanced RF theory, digital design (there was no such thing as a microprocessor when I got my degree), and am now becoming comfortable with the worldwide telecommunication networks as I work with supporting their architecture. I learned all thee things much later, yet I got the foundation while earning my degree. Whoever said that an employer is influenced by the presence of an appropriate degree was right - several of my co-workers and I have participated in interviews (it's common at my workplace to have a few techies in on a hiring interview) and surprisingly often, a candidate's preparation colors his proficiency. It's a package.

For less technical jobs, it's less important. But again, I think a degreed candidate has a potential advantage if they choose to exploit it in terms that their future employer will appreciate...

 

[arcaidy]

I think it depends on what you want to do. If you want to do a trade, and I consider many parts of IT a trade now, then college might not be the best route. Find a trade school and spend a year or so learning what it is you think you want to do. You can make a nice living doing a number of trade jobs.

College wasn’t there for me. I didn’t have the grades, money, or desire for it. I thought I didn’t want to continue what I was doing though so joined the military. Best decision I ever made. For 5 years of my life I learned more real world lessons than any college student could dream.

I now work in IT. There isn’t one piece of me that thinks a degree is necessary to work in this field. There are some that disagree with me though and require it. In my opinion I think a lot of this comes from trying to justify the time and money someone in management spent getting theirs… Personally I’d pick experience over training any day.

My brother has a degree and went back to what he was doing before college. He has lots of debt and some fun stories to tell.. He is plenty happy doing what he is now and in hind sight had no reason for the degree.

My sister is a nurse. She loves it and had every reason for going to college.

I don’t regret joining the military instead of college at all.

You need to figure out what is best for you. Problem is you probably won’t have a clue what that is for many years. I’m biased and say join the military. You’ll learn a tremendous amount about life in general, meet people you’ll probably stay in contact with for the rest of your life, learn a skill, and get money for college if you choose to do it later. You’ll also have a better idea on things you like and want to do.

Eighteen to too early to try and pick your life long career. I roofed houses before joining the military. In the military I worked on jets. I’m now in IT. In all honesty, I think I’d be happier roofing houses again, but monetarily I am “stuck” in IT.

When it’s all its all said and done you probably won’t know if you made the right choice till a decade or so later…

 

[casualmadness]

I’m biased and say join the military. You’ll learn a tremendous amount about life in general, meet people you’ll probably stay in contact with for the rest of your life, learn a skill, and get money for college if you choose to do it later. You’ll also have a better idea on things you like and want to do.

This is a great option. I joined the military after college but if I had it to do over again, I would have joined right after high school. It would have made college much easier in a lot of ways. But the military will teach you a job and then pay you to do it. And the friendships will last a lifetime.

 

[geeza]

This is a great option. I joined the military after college but if I had it to do over again, I would have joined right after high school. It would have made college much easier in a lot of ways. But the military will teach you a job and then pay you to do it. And the friendships will last a lifetime.

And get you out of the house.