Is it possible to teach "Groove"?

[Ric5]

Is it possible to teach "Groove"?

most people yes … a few people no … Some people can't play music at all

 

[Turbo Sparky]

I think players either have "natural groove" or they "do not have natural groove." IMO if players have the willingness to "let go" so to speak, that is to say "feel it" it is easier to "learn" groove, than those unable/unwilling to "let go" and "feel." After enough study just about any player can "dig it" and ultimately emulate-yes-emulate "groove." Anyone can play a single note and "groove" it, but those with "natural ability" can make it sound literally natural. IMO if one listens enough one can tell "natural" groove versus "learned" groove. I can play and groove punk, but put on some Graham Central Station...gtfooh. I am on it like white on rice. I just fall into it. Call me Mahatma LOL!

 

[Fender_Bender]

I'm sure there's people out there who absolutely have no sense of rhythm or timing. They are likely a lost cause. They may or may not be autistic or have similar issues.
I believe they are a minority though. For myself it's really been a matter of keeping my mind focused and not straying. My mind tends to wander. There is a certain herbal product out there that seems to instantly turn my grooveabilty on like a light switch though .

 

[bigboy_78]

It might be because I listened to a Jeff Berlin podcast on the way to work this morning, but I'm going to say "groove" doesn't even exist. You can't teach "vibes" man……

You can teach a person to play. You teach them to play notes. You teach them to play notes of a specific length in specific order and you get music.

Confidence = Groove. It's a natural by-product of learning music.

So no, you can't teach groove, you can only teach music.

 

[jamro217]

I think if the tiniest of sparks is there it can be fanned into a flame with patience and care.

I don't think you can instill it from scratch. Unless the person either has it, or comes to realize it on their own, theres not much you can do.

I used to think there was no such thing as a person utterly devoid of rhythm or totally tone deaf. But I've since come to reluctantly think there may be a few out there. They're extremely rare. But they definitely exist.

If they're so rare, why do I keep auditioning them?

 

[CoffeeLove]

Great thread in my book. I am going with YES, groove cab be taught/learned. For some people it comes natural, but I was not one of them. At one point I could not stay in time without a drummer, click-track, or beats leading the way, but that is no longer the case. As suggested by an amazing musician friend, I spent countless hours working on my internal clock/meter. Did this on the bass, in the car, at work, on dates with my wife, you name (tapping feet, hands, wiggling toes, all while the metronome plays in my head). While it might not be absolutely perfect all the time, I can now lay down a groove that any drummer or percussion player can jump into with ease, and that is so much fun. It can be done.

On a slightly different challenge, I had lots of trouble learning basic slap technique (striking hand, slow and inconsistent, timing issues), but that also improved with many hours of practicing/slapping everywhere I went (not just on the bass).

 

[Tnavis]

Like all forms of communication (and really, that's what music is) groove is really about listening. Some people are natural listeners, and some people have to learn to listen. It's a personality thing.

What I'd really like to see is the "No" and "Yes" answers broken down by age group. I think that those of us who have been around the sun a few times might think that groove is really just a product of more time spent listening and absorbing.

 

[elgranluis]

Lol , learn to read sheet music, and some solfegio leassons (actually clapping and singing to the sheet music).

I'm pretty sure anybody with a "basic" musical inclination will be able to groove. Those without the basic musical inclination can still learn , it will just take longer I guess. The human being is a musical animal.

 

[Blissful_Lad]

Can one be taught to pitch a baseball? Yes.
Can one be taught to pitch a baseball like Clayton Kershaw? No.

Can one be taught to shoot a basketball? Yes.
Can one be taught to shoot a basketball like Stephen Curry? No.

Can one be taught to improvise a blues solo? Yes.
Can one be taught to improvise a blues solo like Eric Clapton? No.

Can one be taught to "groove"? Yes.
Can one be taught to "groove" like Bootsy? No.

Is it possible to teach "Groove"? Depends on the level of proficiency.

Best answer: No.

Why? Because MOST suck at all of the above.



If you don't have "the stuff", you'll be mediocre at best.

 

[40Hz]

If they're so rare, why do I keep auditioning them?

Just lucky?

 

[interp]

Groove, like many skills, cannot be taught. But it can be learned.

 

[Fun Size Nick]

I had lunch today near a public 'play me!' piano and listened to the most groove-less version of 'Corazon Espinado' that you ever did hear. The person playing it had the notes down, but had clearly never been tasked with making an audience dance to it.

I think that for many musicians, they've just never been made to focus on the feel of the rhythm that they're playing, and therefore they are completely oblivious to that aspect of the music. My lunch companion had learned to play a latin song and will probably happily play it with a terrible sense of groove right up until the day when they play it with someone who actually knows what latin music is about. Whether they learn from the experience or not is up to them!

 

[Nanaki]

I said yes. If someone is born with natural ability but is lazy and doesn't practice and a second person has no natural ability but works hard, the second will become the better musician every time.

 

[Matthijs]

It can absolutely be thaught. But not everybody can teach that well. (Although that can be taught just as well) And the first step to being able to teach this is to have the ability to break it down en de-mystify groove. Imo the idea that groove is a mystical concept leads to a fixed mindset, and thats very detrimental to learning anything.

Sure there are limits to each individuals maximum level. But that's no different to any other skill.

 

[Wisebass]

I get the impression that the majority think no.

Hi mambo4

No "Carrots" option = no groove!

Music (theory) can be learned. Timing can be improved (play with a metronome and/ or a good drummer),
intonation too (you can train your ears).

But groove? What is groove?

Is it a concept with rules, that we can read, learn by heart and repeat?

Can we understand groove? Even if we can hear the difference between two musicians,

playing the same stuff it' s hard to tell why:

"This guy grooves because………….. "

and "this guy doesn 't because………….."


The only thing I know about groove is: When you can' t feel it, you can 't have it!


may the groove be with you

Wise(b)ass

 

[Joebone]

I am also in the school of Yes.

contrary to what I see as a lot of people (on this form anyhow) that seem to think it is some innate ability. and it cannot be taught, or explained. To me this discredits my hard work and I essentially I view it as a cop out..(because they cannot explain it, or know someone who they base this claim off of. 'John/Jane Doe cant groove, so s/he cant be taught, and will never learn it' kind of thinking..I digress)

I say it is teachable, because I learned it. and I did not create it from thin air. there is no "magic wand of Groove" that was waived at me. I did not pick up a Bass and say "Ima groove this thing" and proceed to lay down some serious Funk/Groove sessions. as I said in a thread of a similar nature, my folks are not musical and do not play instruments, or sing well for that matter. But I listen to a S***-ton of music, and many different styles as well.

I worked for it. It was fun, so that always helps. but I put in the work I felt is necessary for the foundation. and when I played in the cover band I grew as a Bassist even though I didn't really understand music. that is the great part of music is a lot of ways. one can sound incredible and not really know much about music in general aside from having the ability to time out notes on the fret board in rhythm. good enough to emulate music.

it takes time to internalize, so yes I had to put the work in. but my "Teachers" were not in a class lecturing me on how to 'groove'. my "Teachers" were tons of Columbia House and BMG compact disks and mix tapes/disks that I collected over the years.

the people/groups/bands/styles of music one is influenced by, indirectly, are the Teachers of Groove, at least that is how I see it based off of my experience with music.

This is one of my favorite TB posts of all time...

 

[eJake]

I'm of the opinion that it can be taught but the student MUST want to learn.

Even if said student can't clap on the one to save their life, if they want to learn, I can teach them.

 

[Oleg BassPlayer]

Like any other ability, it's a combination of genes, learning, environment, opportunities etc, and nobody can say which weights more. You can be modestly apt for music and become a decent musician through hard work as well as waste a huge potential because you're a lazy ass or just don't have opportunities. What I can say for sure from my experience is that timing, ear and groove improve over the course of time if you work on them, especially when you have the habit to record yourself, listen and work on errors.

 

[Bass'd on a true story]

It both can be taught and can be learned. There are plenty of people who have learned groove. In fact, any time you learn to play a new time signature, you are "learning groove" to some degree. Every time a person learns to play a kick drum on one beat, a snare on another, and continually hit the hi-hat, they are learning groove. Anyone who can beatbox has "learned groove" to some degree. Playing to a metronome in any capacity is learning to groove.

I would go completely in the opposite direction with the question: "can you learn to groove?". I would go so far as to say that it can ONLY be learned. Some people have a moderate natural talent for rhythm, just as some people have a better ear naturally. Those people still have to learn how to groove if they want to reach a high level. Pino didn't wake up playing the way he does and I highly doubt it came quickly, either. He played for a ton of hours and specifically focused on how he sounded rhythmically.

In the same way that anyone, with the correct practice routine, can learn how to improvise over jazz changes, anyone can learn how to groove.

 

[Mushroo]

If you truly believe you can't learn it, you probably never will.