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Jeff Berlin Speaks

#301
Whousedtoplay said:
Here is my third opinion o_O about this thread.

We can take about 1/3 of all comments and place them under the terrorisedw to provoke Jeff Berlin , the world class master bass player, without being BANNED from TB."
Click to expand...

I remember conversing with Jeff on The Bottom Line. If you seriously think he had to be provoked... cool.

My favorite conversation was when he made the blanket statement that ANYONE who played fretless did it because of Jaco. Period. And if you didn't admit it you were a liar. No one AFAIK made him write that.

So when I mentioned that I was into Alphonso Johnson, who I first heard with WR (and I first played fretless around the time of Mysterious Traveler)... WRONG. I wanted be Jaco too.

As an early fan of Jeff's (I bought David Sancious' solo album because Jeff was on it and originally came to Jeff through Bill Bruford (big fan of his and Yes) I was surprised at the silliness of his position. Because even folks who played fretless before Jaco was even around did it because of Jaco. I chalked it up to him having some serious Jaco issues.

Years later during a debate with Steve Bailey he grabbed Steve's fretless and sure enough... he didn't sound like Jaco. Proving at long last that he was wrong. You don't have to sound like Jaco if you play a fretless.
 
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#302
Plutonium244 said:
Thank you for the information. Please excuse the fact that I don't know many of the principal players here at TB since I have been here only since late March of last year. I do not know who John Turner is, I am assuming one of the 3 paid admins?

I can understand the side presented by John. I can also understand that maybe bygones could be bygones; at least to my eye (and I admit lacking much of the context long-time users may have).

Perhaps there is concern that run-of-the-mill users will bait somebody like Jeff Berlin into another outburst of hostility. Yes, if you're famous, and you choose to make yourself available to the riff-raff, so to speak, then "you gotta deal with it." Well, I'd suggest that if someone wants to tell Jeff or any established professional like Hadrien with a "name" that they are "awful", they should do what people who hate LeBron do-- buy an expensive ticket and yell from the seats. I am sure that Jeff or any other high-level professional will willingly allow their detractors to do just as LeBron or Kobe's detractors do-- buy a ticket and yell from the 43rd row. (Even so, fans DO get kicked out of NBA games for verbal abuse).

Where LeBron differs from the Jeff situation is that when LeBron James makes himself available to coach young or developing players, in an EDUCATIONAL setting, I seriously doubt he is subjected to verbal abuse form the students or basketball campers. I am not sure just putting the onus on Jeff, or another high-level player, to ignore that, when they are donating their time and sharing their expertise to HELP people here, is fair.

What I see here is that perhaps there are lots of reasons a Jeff Berlin, or Hadrien, or another high level professional, would NOT want to be here, sharing their knowledge. Why make that effort and take that time, to be baited and criticized on a basically personal level (such as the "awful" remarks)? And then be blamed by the staff who should be making a point to curtail bad-behaving plebian members who vebally insult the pro's on board? I certainly hope, given how rules about not mentioning politics/religion etc are aggressively enforced, that these bad actors were also read the riot act. I know the admins do the best they can, and I have no beef with them-- but IMO, worthless as that is, maybe things could have been done differently?

It's a damn shame that those of us capable of being respectful to people with advanced knowledge, even if we do not personally favor that kind of music or playing, etc, can't have that benefit because 1) angry self-righteous teens have no social graces (thanks, internet) and 2) the powers that be feel that it's the pro's fault, virtually entirely, for not taking kindly to these abuses, and letting their tempers get away from them.

I wonder what the admins did to corral or correct those who were less-than-kind? I do not know, and perhaps it was handled well, and THOSE folks got banned along with Jeff/Ken/etc. If so, then at least there is some symmetry. I certainly hope those folks were not tolerated.

This is a great website. I appreciate it and benefit from it, as-is. But maybe it could be better, too. The mere idea that the people with professional credentials many of this community aspire to can expect to be denigrated publicly here, or banned for taking exception to it, seems wrong.

Just my opinion, FWIW.
Click to expand...

The idea that a player, due to their talent, can do no wrong would seem equally wrong. But even with the multiple links you don't seem to see that. Cool.

So unless you think they should be above the rules, having no issue with telling the mods publicly to suck any body part would greatly exceed the average fan's need to cut their guy some slack. Ya think?
 
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#303
Brad Johnson said:
I remember conversing with Jeff on The Bottom Line. If you seriously think he had to be provoked... cool.

My favorite conversation was when he made the blanket statement that ANYONE who played fretless did it because of Jaco. Period. And if you didn't admit it you were a liar. No one AFAIK made him write that.

So when I mentioned that I was into Alphonso Johnson, who I first heard with WR (and I first played fretless around the time of Mysterious Traveler)... WRONG. I wanted be Jaco too.

As an early fan of Jeff's (I bought David Sancious' solo album because Jeff was on it and originally came to Jeff through Bill Bruford (big fan of his and Yes) I was surprised at the silliness of his position. Because even folks who played fretless before Jaco was even around did it because of Jaco. I chalked it up to him having some serious Jaco issues.

Years later during a debate with Steve Bailey he grabbed Steve's fretless and sure enough... he didn't sound like Jaco. Proving at long last that he was wrong. You don't have to sound like Jaco if you play a fretless.
Click to expand...

Brad,

Thank you for your response. I understand that it's boring to read all 16 pages of various comments including my own about Jeff Berlin.
Here is my main point about Jeff:
Whousedtoplay said:
I just want to get my personal opinion across that Jeff Berlin will be FOREVER the same Jeff Berlin - a very Passionate and Extremely/Superbly gifted/talented Musician with a lot of Arrogance and Impatience.
Click to expand...
It's up to you to decide if you want to talk about Jeff's "Arrogance and Impatience", or about Jeff as
a very Passionate and Extremely/Superbly gifted/talented Musician.
That concludes my comments about the World's Master Bass Player, Jeff Berlin.
Next, ANY MUSICIAN is a MUSICIAN while playing, performing, recording, etc...
When ANY MUSICIAN starts talking, that musician becomes a TALKER.
When ANY MUSICIAN starts teaching, that musician becomes a TEACHER.
(P.S. A Good Musician is NOT always equal to a Good TEACHER, or a good Talker, etc...)
When ANY MUSICIAN goes to vote, that musician becomes a VOTER.
In short, when ANY MUSICIAN is not playing, performing, recording, etc..., that musician is just a Human Being with all the regular "issues" related to being JUST A HUMAN that I or you can like it, dislike it, ignore it, etc...

Now, let's shortly get back to Hadrien Feraud - the most advanced electric bass player in the world, IMHO.

I'm still waiting for the answer from GregC about the REVISION of my comment, and also, I'm still waiting for winegamd to respond about that "Hadrien is awful", and "Jaco had a big ego, and sometimes overplayed, but Feraud takes it to a whole other level."

P.S. You are still talking who influenced you about 40 years ago to play the Fretless, but I MUST forget what was said as a Personal insult just a year ago.

Anyway, I hope you got my opinion about Jeff Berlin and about Hadrien Feraud.
P.S. I think you and some other respected and well-known TB members could EASILY recall their comments accusing me that I - WUTP was Hadrien Feraud.
Should anybody have any questions about THAT PERSONAL attack on me, please let me know and I GLADLY provide their comments.

As always, thank you for your comment.
 
#304
Whousedtoplay said:
Brad,

Thank you for your response. I understand that it's boring to read all 16 pages of various comments including my own about Jeff Berlin.
Here is my main point about Jeff:

It's up to you to decide if you want to talk about Jeff's "Arrogance and Impatience", or about Jeff as
a very Passionate and Extremely/Superbly gifted/talented Musician.
That concludes my comments about the World's Master Bass Player, Jeff Berlin.
Next, ANY MUSICIAN is a MUSICIAN while playing, performing, recording, etc...
When ANY MUSICIAN starts talking, that musician becomes a TALKER.
When ANY MUSICIAN starts teaching, that musician becomes a TEACHER.
(P.S. A Good Musician is NOT always equal to a Good TEACHER, or a good Talker, etc...)
When ANY MUSICIAN goes to vote, that musician becomes a VOTER.
In short, when ANY MUSICIAN is not playing, performing, recording, etc..., that musician is just a Human Being with all the regular "issues" related to being JUST A HUMAN that I or you can like it, dislike it, ignore it, etc...

Now, let's shortly get back to Hadrien Feraud - the most advanced electric bass player in the world, IMHO.

I'm still waiting for the answer from GregC about the REVISION of my comment, and also, I'm still waiting for winegamd to respond about that "Hadrien is awful", and "Jaco had a big ego, and sometimes overplayed, but Feraud takes it to a whole other level."

P.S. You are still talking who influenced you about 40 years ago to play the Fretless, but I MUST forget what was said as a Personal insult just a year ago.

Anyway, I hope you got my opinion about Jeff Berlin and about Hadrien Feraud.
P.S. I think you and some other respected and well-known TB members could EASILY recall their comments accusing me that I - WUTP was Hadrien Feraud.
Should anybody have any questions about THAT PERSONAL attack on me, please let me know and I GLADLY provide their comments.

As always, thank you for your comment.
Click to expand...
Please excuse my ignorance but what does WUTP mean?
 
#306
Whousedtoplay said:
Brad,

Thank you for your response. I understand that it's boring to read all 16 pages of various comments including my own about Jeff Berlin.
Here is my main point about Jeff:

It's up to you to decide if you want to talk about Jeff's "Arrogance and Impatience", or about Jeff as
a very Passionate and Extremely/Superbly gifted/talented Musician.
That concludes my comments about the World's Master Bass Player, Jeff Berlin.
Next, ANY MUSICIAN is a MUSICIAN while playing, performing, recording, etc...
When ANY MUSICIAN starts talking, that musician becomes a TALKER.
When ANY MUSICIAN starts teaching, that musician becomes a TEACHER.
(P.S. A Good Musician is NOT always equal to a Good TEACHER, or a good Talker, etc...)
When ANY MUSICIAN goes to vote, that musician becomes a VOTER.
In short, when ANY MUSICIAN is not playing, performing, recording, etc..., that musician is just a Human Being with all the regular "issues" related to being JUST A HUMAN that I or you can like it, dislike it, ignore it, etc...

Now, let's shortly get back to Hadrien Feraud - the most advanced electric bass player in the world, IMHO.

I'm still waiting for the answer from GregC about the REVISION of my comment, and also, I'm still waiting for winegamd to respond about that "Hadrien is awful", and "Jaco had a big ego, and sometimes overplayed, but Feraud takes it to a whole other level."

P.S. You are still talking who influenced you about 40 years ago to play the Fretless, but I MUST forget what was said as a Personal insult just a year ago.

Anyway, I hope you got my opinion about Jeff Berlin and about Hadrien Feraud.
P.S. I think you and some other respected and well-known TB members could EASILY recall their comments accusing me that I - WUTP was Hadrien Feraud.
Should anybody have any questions about THAT PERSONAL attack on me, please let me know and I GLADLY provide their comments.

As always, thank you for your comment.
Click to expand...

No, I don't recall accusing you of being Hadrien. "Yer" OTOH... :D

Anyway...
I laid out the points that I wanted to make. I do remember that you're willing to cut both of these bassists a tremendous amount of slack for their boorish behavior. As such I understand when I'm wasting my time. I seem to recall being asked to defend things I didn't say and that seems to be happening again.

I have musicians that I like too but when they traffic in the kinds of things I've seen... sorry, that doesn't pass muster for me. it's quite possible to be both very talented and a knob.
 
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#308
Whousedtoplay said:
We start repeating "samo, samo".
Here is a snapshot of my and your comment from September 9, 2013, posted back-to-back about the same subject.

View attachment 772090
Click to expand...

There are people, fortunately not many, who refuse to read. More baffling is when they don't even read what they quote. Back then I explained why your take on things was skewed... YOU DIDN'T READ EVERYTHING THAT WENT DOWN. The thread was HEAVILY EDITED. Meaning YOU MISSED LOTS OF STUFF. And if you understand that simple fact you should understand how you couldn't possibly have a clear picture of what happened, Yet you never stopped acting like you did.

That is really weird. Any idea why you continue to do it?


Should I accept this winegamd comment as some kind of apology?
Click to expand...

I don't know... I'm sure you'll figure out something to do with it.

TB delivers again.
:D
 
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#309
This kind of worship is cool but here's what it brings to my mind...

I hear about a party and decide to go. I get distracted and end up showing up late.

An hour before, one of the guest, a professional athlete, had been having a better than average time. This leads to some pretty unusual behavior on their part, capped off by them taking a dump on an area rug... and that rug really pulled the room together. So the guest eventually leaves, the rug is removed and when I get there people are still talking about the incident. But since I see no evidence and am a big fan of the athlete, I keep going on and on about how I can't believe how people are talking about the athlete and can't believe they would do what witnesses said he did. And I can't understand why people are looking at me like I have a screw loose. And I just become more and more agitated about it.

Yep, that's what this is like.
:cool:
 
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#310
Brad Johnson said:
This kind of worship is cool but here's what it brings to my mind...

I hear about a party and decide to go. I get distracted and end up showing up late.

An hour before, one of the guest, a professional athlete, had been having a better than average time. This leads to some pretty unusual behavior on their part, capped off by them taking a dump on an area rug... and that rug really pulled the room together. So the guest eventually leaves, the rug is removed and when I get there people are still talking about the incident. But since I see no evidence and am a big fan of the athlete, I keep going on and on about how I can't believe how people are talking about the athlete and can't believe they would do what witnesses said he did. And I can't understand why people are looking at me like I have a screw loose. And I just become more and more agitated about it.

Yep, that's what this is like.
:cool:
Click to expand...

You shoulda seen the steamer Jeff laid.
 
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#311
You don't even realize you do this, huh?

Who said you belong to a fan club? You can be a fanatic without being in a club.

You seem to be extremely enamored of st least a couple of musicians to the point where you are incapable of seeing any faults on their part. As such you can't understand why others don't feel as you do, even when pointed to the reasons.

John Turner's JB recap was far from hyperbolic. And Hadrien created a new account under the name Yer where he pointed out that he was a woman and extolled the virtues of Hadrien Feraud. You don't see the slightest problem with this behaviour and that's cool. I looked at both in disbelief that people of their stature could be that off the wall.

So there's really nothing you need to explain to me, you made what you are about abundantly clear... just like Hadrien and Jeff have over the years. The reason i mentioned my personal recollection of Jeff because you seem to be oblivious to any of this. I wish him well whichever direction he heads. Enjoy.

BTW supposedly hearing only music is also weird. Saying that after repeatedly not acknowledging what you're being told does explain things. Maybe folks should only respond to you with auto-tuned mp3s. What sample rate do you prefer?
 
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#312
Whousedtoplay said:
I don't belong to ANY FAN CLUBS!

I'm ON MY OWN!
My postings, my comments ONLY EXTOL MUSIC of MANY different Musicians.
I've posted NUMEROUS videos of known and/or barely known Musicians and Bass players.
I hear only MUSIC. As an amateur bass player, I KNOW what it takes to get to that LEVEL.
I've been blessed - I've been around EXCELLENT MUSICIANS, composers, sound engineers, etc.; therefore, after many long years, I have MY VISION, my perception of MUSIC.
That's it.

P.S. I think it's possible that some TB members DO BELONG TO SOME "specific" FAN CLUBS, and try to represent SOME SPECIFIC MUSICIANS, and I'm have no problems with it.
Long live Music:bassist::hyper:.
Click to expand...
Are you a Michael Vick fan?
 
#313
Whousedtoplay said:
Thank you for your nice respond.



I can start writing an extremely long list of bass/double bass players that I like, enjoy listening, recommend, etc., but it's possible to say that I, while growing up, was mostly influenced by Stanley Clarke, Jaco Pastorius, Bernard Edwards(!), Marcus Miller, Mark King, Verdine White, and the list could go on and on.
Click to expand...
Lol. I'm not a sports fan either but Michael Vick is the football player that got arrested for being involved in a dog fighting ring which is DEFINITELY a "pile" on the carpet but because of his "status" a LOT of people seem to think he deserves a pass.
 
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#314
Sixgunn said:
Lol. I'm not a sports fan either but Michael Vick is the football player that got arrested for being involved in a dog fighting ring which is DEFINITELY a "pile" on the carpet but because of his "status" a LOT of people seem to think he deserves a pass.
Click to expand...

Your question about Michael Vic is a perfect example how the "provocation" at TB works.
I hope I passed your test.

Anyway, what do you think about my list of bass players that really influenced me in my young years?
 
#320
A few Jeff's lessons.

(Sorry if those EXCELLENT lessons could offend ANYBODY.)


Walking Bass Line Articulation, Jeff Berlin Bass Tips: Lesson 14


Jeff's interview in Croatia.


Jeff Berlin Clinic at Guitar Center in NYC.



Jeff Berlin Bass Clinic Tour 2015 | Presented by Cort Guitars & Swee Lee Music Academy


Jeff Berlin at the thomann bass day 2015







Jeff Berlin Bass Clinic (Part 4 of 4)


 
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