OK the second thing I totally get it... BUT the impedance thing, I'm totally lost....
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Jule Amps Monique part 5
- Thread starter Chef
- Start date
OK the second thing I totally get it... BUT the impedance thing, I'm totally lost....
The easiest solution would be a small headphone amplifier that accepts either line or mic level signals. An Apogee One or similar interface with direct monitoring connected to an iPhone would make a small portable solution with the ability to play backing tracks and record great ideas.
The apogee one is a really cool piece of equipment, I own one as well as a quartet. I do agree it's a great piece of gear to do what you are suggesting, But that's a lot of dough to drop just to monitor Monique for fun.
What kind of headphones are you intending to use to monitor Monique?
- Dec 10, 2006
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- Owner and creator of Jule Amps: Monique and Simone and Bass Amps
I'd go for something like this that has XLR input and a headphone amplifier. http://www.furmansound.com/product.php?id=HR-2
These go for about $50. Then you can run it directly from the Balanced Output of Monique. I do some of the final testing of each Monique with a Behringer Powerplay Pro-8 Headphone amplifer, but that is overkill for your purpose.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
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- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
That's the headphone amp/distro I use for recording, Jule. Not the best sounding unit, but you can find them new for 100 bucks and feed 8 sets of headphones. Its noisier the closer you get to the power supply.
- Dec 10, 2006
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- Owner and creator of Jule Amps: Monique and Simone and Bass Amps
OK the second thing I totally get it... BUT the impedance thing, I'm totally lost....
Everybody is confused. I've met people with EE degrees that didn't really get it, so don't let it bug you.
For our purposes it is just like a speaker hookup.
A good working rule is that both the device and what we are connecting it to should be the same impedance value. If they are not, we can lose audio quality and/or audio volume.
I've investigated adding a headphone amplifier in Monique and it ended up being a bit silly cost-wise compared to the very low pricing of add-on headphone amplifiers.
Anyone ever try one of these with their setup?
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Not sure if it would handle the input of a guitar or a preamp, but really light and compact. I read some good reviews on it when using it with a smartphone, iPod, etc. Obviously you would have to get a cable to interface as well since it's a 1/8th input connection.
Looks pretty cool if it would work. I figure someone here must have tried it once?
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Not sure if it would handle the input of a guitar or a preamp, but really light and compact. I read some good reviews on it when using it with a smartphone, iPod, etc. Obviously you would have to get a cable to interface as well since it's a 1/8th input connection.
Looks pretty cool if it would work. I figure someone here must have tried it once?
Yup, if the impedance doesn't match, audio quality is lost. The old formula, not sure if its still used today, was divide your headphone impedance by 8, which would provide you the impedance your headphones want to see for optimal performance. As the impedance gets higher and above what your headphones are rated at, you start to lose bass and the highs tend to bump up as well, therefore coloring the sound. Sometimes this can work for you or against you depending upon the tonal characteristics of the headphones you are using, or if you want a totally flat response.
I'm no theory specialist on this, and perhaps today's headphones are more forgiving and compensate for this. I've always had a few sets of headphones to cover myself. I have the AKG K240 which are good for line level outputs (600 ohm high impedance). However when plugging these into a low impedance output they won't be as loud as lower impedance headphones. You really need to drive them. Thats why I also have the AKG ATHM50's (38ohm) and a collection of 16 ohm ear buds as well.
Hope that helps a bit. I'm going to try plugging in my 600ohm headphones tonight into the balanced output of Monique. I'll let you know how it sounds.
- Dec 10, 2006
- 1,338
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- Owner and creator of Jule Amps: Monique and Simone and Bass Amps
That's the headphone amp/distro I use for recording, Jule. Not the best sounding unit, but you can find them new for 100 bucks and feed 8 sets of headphones. Its noisier the closer you get to the power supply.
Yes, I don't vouch for the audio quality of the Behringer. The Behringer (or any other decent headphone amp) for me, is the best way to make sure there is no 120 cycle (or harmonic) noise coming from Monique or any other piece of gear.
Test cycle is to run Monique (or whatever gear you want to test) wide open, full ON, and listen while playing on the Balanced channel. Then we run each Monique dialed OFF, with no input, and with the headphone amp full ON. As long as there is zero hum in both cases, life is good.
The above test procedure came from working with a wonderful customer who was kind enough to help me work to eliminate hum in a very early Monique. (I have much to be grateful for). Without the above test, hum can be difficult to detect in a noisy shop environment.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
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- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
That makes sense. Also, having a 100$ unit kicking around the shop is probably safer than having a high dollar pristine sounding headphone amp that you won't be able to appreciate in that atmosphere anyway. In my case, we use it for demo'ing and it's 'good enough' for everyone to hear what they're doing.
OK the second thing I totally get it... BUT the impedance thing, I'm totally lost....
Hey GuzBaas,
I just looked up the impedance of the line out of Monique and found that it is 10k. This impedance is way high to drive headphones, so that will not work well, unless you insert a component inline to step it down, which in turn will probably effect the tone, and which I believe you were trying to avoid happening in the first place.
Prob the best thing to do as Jule said is to use the Balanced XLR out which is 600 ohm. This is much more manageable. As I wrote earlier, I have not tried it yet, but in theory, if you have 600 ohm headphones, this should work, I'm just not sure how loud it will be. I'm curious now, so I'm going to check this out tonight.
Obviously having a headphone amp will provide you with extra gain and may wind up being the only alternative, but I'm focusing on your initial question. To keep this as simple and as tonally pure as possible with no other equipment required.
BurningSkies
CRAZY BALDHEAD
- Feb 20, 2005
- 27,956
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- Endorsing artist: Dingwall Guitars
I've shared my Monique rig with a friend who's a keys player and uses his Moogs (customized down an octave) through my Monique fueled rig at LOUD gig volumes with no problems.
^ "While we were digging around with the HBP1- 800D, we decided to sneak in a bonus look at the Minnie 800D. If you are looking for a power amp, this may just fit your need. As a power amp, the Minnie 800D is one of the most insanely flexible amps that I have come across with regard to mating to a preamp or other input source. I threw signals a the Minnie 800D from a few mVrms to over 10 Vrms, and with a slight tweak of the single gain control, I was able to pull the input signal in clean as a whistle (well under 1% THD+N). Kudos, here.
Without the tube preamp of the HBP1-800D, I held the Minnie 800D to a stricter standard for output power. At 8 ohms, I measured 530 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz-20kHz; 930 mVrms 1kHz sin Input. Burst power hit 610 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz-20kHz; 1kHz CEA 2006. At 4 ohms, I measured 775 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz- 20kHz; 800 mVrms 1kHz sin Input. Burst power hit 970 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz-20kHz; 1kHz CEA 2006. Allowing the distortion level to creep up to 2% THD+N, I measured about 810 watts, with burst well over 1,000 watts.
In this regard, the gentle compression of the tube preamp of the HBP1-800D helps eek out just a tad more power. Then again, the difference is for all intents and purposes negligible.
As Fig. 19 illustrates, the Minnie 800D also features thermal protection. However, the time to recovery varies from under 1 second to just over 2 seconds. Also, note that the time that the signal remains active can vary from under 0.5 seconds to tripping. Again, I want to stress that this test is conducted under extremely stressful bench conditions to see if the amp has thermal shutdown and whether the amp properly recovers. In each instance, not only did the amp recover, it was able to supply burst power in excess of its steady state maximum output power with no artifacts.
Referring to Figs. 20-22, the Minnie 800D exhibits stable gain, but note that the drop off is a harder edge, compared to the HBP1-800D. This is due to the gentle compression of the preamp tube in the HBP1-800D. Fig. 21 demonstrates that the Minnie 800D is extremely linear in matching input level changes to output level changes. Fig. 22 shows that the Minnie 800D is extremely clean, with distortion levels well under 1% THD+N until reaching the limits of steady state maximum output power."
Without the tube preamp of the HBP1-800D, I held the Minnie 800D to a stricter standard for output power. At 8 ohms, I measured 530 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz-20kHz; 930 mVrms 1kHz sin Input. Burst power hit 610 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz-20kHz; 1kHz CEA 2006. At 4 ohms, I measured 775 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz- 20kHz; 800 mVrms 1kHz sin Input. Burst power hit 970 watts; 1% THD+N filtered 20Hz-20kHz; 1kHz CEA 2006. Allowing the distortion level to creep up to 2% THD+N, I measured about 810 watts, with burst well over 1,000 watts.
In this regard, the gentle compression of the tube preamp of the HBP1-800D helps eek out just a tad more power. Then again, the difference is for all intents and purposes negligible.
As Fig. 19 illustrates, the Minnie 800D also features thermal protection. However, the time to recovery varies from under 1 second to just over 2 seconds. Also, note that the time that the signal remains active can vary from under 0.5 seconds to tripping. Again, I want to stress that this test is conducted under extremely stressful bench conditions to see if the amp has thermal shutdown and whether the amp properly recovers. In each instance, not only did the amp recover, it was able to supply burst power in excess of its steady state maximum output power with no artifacts.
Referring to Figs. 20-22, the Minnie 800D exhibits stable gain, but note that the drop off is a harder edge, compared to the HBP1-800D. This is due to the gentle compression of the preamp tube in the HBP1-800D. Fig. 21 demonstrates that the Minnie 800D is extremely linear in matching input level changes to output level changes. Fig. 22 shows that the Minnie 800D is extremely clean, with distortion levels well under 1% THD+N until reaching the limits of steady state maximum output power."
I noticed that too. Hmmm....
Maybe Jule is finally releasing his own poweramp. I have been talking to him about this for well over a year and he has built some different things (I know nostatic has one of Jule's prototypes, as an example), but nothing official.
I really like my Minnie, but I would be surprised if Jule can't do something as good if not better at a much better price point.
I bet Jule will chime in soon anyways.
- Dec 10, 2006
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- Owner and creator of Jule Amps: Monique and Simone and Bass Amps
Yes. The combination of Monique and the awesome talents of James Demeter and the 800-D amplifier are not going away. Minnie has always been available directly from James. The Rack Mount and Tardis will always be easily converted to De-Moniques by James, as they have been. Yes. I have a new amplifier coming within a couple of weeks that will also convert Rack Mount and Tardis Moniques to complete amplified versions. In addition, there will also be a stand-alone (much like James has already delivered) combination of Monique and the amplifier called the Monique 700. And a standalone amplifier only. Details to follow . . . 
Luke Sheridan
Commercial User
- Dec 30, 2004
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- I build guitars and sell them. Strings, too
