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Low Down Sound 15/6.5 Cab

#801
1. Roughly the same, around 45hz I believe.

2. My understanding is there are no real concerns about phase between the 12 and 15 LF Kappalites.

3. I would use the same midrange as is in your other cab padded appropriately. Remember to have the baffles reversed.

4. Use Greenboy's crossover. It has the padding appropriately. Around -7.5 to -8db.
http://www.talkbass.com/wiki/index.php/Greenboy_passive_crossovers#fEarful_12.2F6_with_6ND410

Don't cheap out here.

5. If you have a variable Lpad, leave it at noon. Ralf designs his so that noon is "flat."

6. Greenboy's crossover. Honestly, the expense of having Ralf design a new crossover based on Greenboy's for your 15/6 might be worthwhile, since they ought to pair up well.

http://www.talkbass.com/wiki/index.php/Greenboy_passive_crossovers#fEarful_15.2F6_or_fEaRB15

7. As I said, reverse the baffle so the 6" mid lines up with the other 6" mid vertically and as close as possible. It's vital for dispersion and avoiding any midrange cancellations from having distant midrange sources.
 
#802
One last bit: The more I learn about them the less I want this variable Lpad in my rig :) I leave mine at noon 100% of the time and just control the midrange via EQ, which your rig is more than capable of doing.
 
#804
Thanks for that, RP!

4. Use Greenboy's crossover. It has the padding appropriately. Around -7.5 to -8db.
http://www.talkbass.com/wiki/index.php/Greenboy_passive_crossovers#fEarful_12.2F6_with_6ND410
Click to expand...

What functionality does Greenboy's crossover provide that is different from Ralf's?

6. Greenboy's crossover. Honestly, the expense of having Ralf design a new crossover based on Greenboy's for your 15/6 might be worthwhile, since they ought to pair up well.

http://www.talkbass.com/wiki/index.php/Greenboy_passive_crossovers#fEarful_15.2F6_or_fEaRB15
Click to expand...

So you're recommending replacement of Ralf's crossover in the 15/6? Depending on your other response, maybe it makes sense to go with Ralf's crossover in the 12/6 and not change the 15/6's crossover? At a certain point, it's hard to believe there would not be diminishing returns, but this is outside my zone of expertise.
 
#805
Greenboy's crossover provides a lot more power handling and the lack of any off-axis freakouts where you get cancellations and such due to the 3015LF's rapidly rising response above 800hz. Because crossovers are rarely "Clean breaks" an 800hz crossover still allows interaction of a LOT of content above 800hz, if it is anything less than 4th order. 3rd order would probably be OK too I think, based on my reading, but it's most likely that it's a 2nd order low pass.

I don't know what exactly Ralf did with his xover but since it's not published it's impossible to say for sure, but I know for virtual certainty the lack of a variable LPAD will increase power handling.

It would not be terrible to go with Ralf's crossover in the 12/6. He knows his stuff and uses better crossovers than any commercial bass cab company, so it will be GOOD. Just not optimal.

If Don/Ralf are OK with you posting a pic of his crossover, I am sure that someone would look it over and compare it to Greenboy's for you, but last I heard Ralf was pretty against the idea of sharing the design.

That said, since Greenboy's is published and approved by Passinwind and Duke, I would lean in that direction. I went with Passinwind's 15/6 crossover for my cabinet (~700hz) and have never regretted it.
 
#806
L-pad discussion:
Every cab I've ever owned that had a horn had an L-pad/attenuator.

I use amps with everything from 300 watts to 2000 watts.
I've never killed an L-pad.

YMMV of course.
 
#807
Horn L-pads and Mid L-pads are drastically different beasts; the mid L-pad will have WAY more power going through it, and any sound change from a shifting crossover frequency will be more of an impact.
 
#809
I want to be clear I'm not saying the sky is falling if you get a variable L-pad :) It's just another bit that is the weakest link in your crossover's chain. And doesn't do anything good that an EQ can't.

I have one on my cab and it works great, I hit it with tons of watts. But I wouldn't know if there was some subtle impact, and it doesn't do me any good to have it, so why bother?
 
#810
"why bother?"

Well; I guess I disagree about the L-pad and a good eq being the same.
In my case, with Walkabout and WT800B are sorta similar with the semi para eq. You can pick a freq and push it up or down. The M6 and F1 have much more limited eq.

With an L-pad, you're bringing the whole mid driver content/volume up and down, and able to set blend where you want it as opposed to pushing one frequency up or down.

A bi-amp rig would be closer to the same thing...IMO...
 
#811
Well, I think we probably differ on what we consider to be "Good eq" - I don't consider the M6 or F1 sufficient for these cabs without an L-Pad.

Ukiah, however, has a Shuttlemax, which is more than sufficient IMHO, for dealing without an L-pad.
 
#812
Chef said:
"With an L-pad, you're bringing the whole mid driver content/volume up and down, and able to set blend where you want it as opposed to pushing one frequency up or down.

A bi-amp rig would be closer to the same thing...IMO...
Click to expand...

I recall reading that two 6ND410s paired at the same time with a 3015LF and a 3012LF would be overkill, that it would be better to turn one lpad off. But it sounds like RP is recommending that both mid-drivers be left on and in the noon position.
 
#813
Actually, I think we agree;)
I wouldn't consider the M6 or F1 to be siffcient L-pad replacements either.

rpsands said:
Well, I think we probably differ on what we consider to be "Good eq" - I don't consider the M6 or F1 sufficient for these cabs without an L-Pad.

Ukiah, however, has a Shuttlemax, which is more than sufficient IMHO, for dealing without an L-pad.
Click to expand...
 
#814
I don't have anything to add to this thread other than that my LDS 15/6 showed up yesterday and I've been enjoying playing through it with my TecAmp Puma 1000 and all my basses. My fretless (with my Dr. Scientist Reverberator giving a touch of room reverb) sounded absolutely incredible.

I'm happy so far.

Pics to follow if anyone wants to see the new rig.
 
#815
Jared Lash said:
I don't have anything to add to this thread other than that my LDS 15/6 showed up yesterday and I've been enjoying playing through it with my TecAmp Puma 1000 and all my basses. My fretless (with my Dr. Scientist Reverberator giving a touch of room reverb) sounded absolutely incredible.

I'm happy so far.

Pics to follow if anyone wants to see the new rig.
Click to expand...

Should we assume that your 15/6 has one of Ralf's variable L-pads on the mid-driver? Which woofer and mid-driver are in your 15/6?
 
#816
Bluesy Soul said:
Should we assume that your 15/6 has one of Ralf's variable L-pads on the mid-driver? Which woofer and mid-driver are in your 15/6?
Click to expand...

Mine should be very similar to rpsand's - same crossover at 700Hz (passinwind's design I believe) and it has an Eminence 3015LF and 18 Sound 6ND410. Mine has the quantum shield and recessed handles.

After one hour I'm not ready to start proselytizing in earnest, but I really dig it so far.
 
#818
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