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Missing out by not being able to read music?

I'm catching up with this thread after a long day at work yesterday and a rehearsal last night.

Someone suggested that people who don't read aren't musicians. That is utter nonsense. People who make music are musicians. It doesn't matter whether the source of the music they're making is a sheet of paper.

With that said, non-readers are musicians who lack a skill that readers have. That skill is absolutely essential to many areas of music, and less essential to others.

Along the same lines, the answer to the question, "am I missing something by not being able to read" is clearly and unequivocally "yes." This is not a gray area, or an unanswerable question, as some have suggested. If you don't learn to read, you are lacking a skill that readers have. Period. Will the lack of that skill ultimately prevent you from making the type of music you want to make? That's a harder question and one that is ultimately going to depend on each individual and what he or she wants to be able to do as a musician.

People keep mentioning Paul McCartney as an example of someone who has succeeded without being able to read. The inability to read was a limitation for McCartney; it is well-documented that the inability to read music made it difficult for McCartney to communicate with many of the session musicians that the Beatles hired. Moreover, without the help of people like George Martin, songs like Yesterday, Eleanor Rigby, She's Leaving Home, For No One, Strawberry Fields Forever, etc. would never have been possible.

Finally, with respect to comments like, "in my experience, people who read music can't play as well as people who don't" or "in my experience, people who read music don't play with as much feel": I don't doubt that you are accurately reporting your experience, but keep in mind that if you do not read yourself, you are probably not working with the musicians who are the better readers, so your experience is not necessarily representative.
 
@jeff: You are right. Apologies to tbplayer. But teachers can do their bit in changing the way things are!
Work time now for me. Not sure if I've heard of JTG - will look him up.

@Fergie: Which episode of 'Seconds from Disaster' was it where hundreds of people died because of a badly-executed key change?

Ohhh i see now you think that doing wrong has to have consequences....sorry to say but when something is wrong it is wrong no matter the scale of the consequnces.
Aeroplanes can crash because of the failure of the smallest component....as usual in these matter its about the detail and how much can be done to minimise disaster by qualified personal ......and i have see, and been part of many shows and gigs that were disasters......but that is just a word used to describe a wide range of things from a cooking disaster to a make up disaster.....But i like your thinking.:)
 
I'm catching up with this thread after a long day at work yesterday and a rehearsal last night.

Someone suggested that people who don't read aren't musicians. That is utter nonsense. People who make music are musicians. It doesn't matter whether the source of the music they're making is a sheet of paper.

With that said, non-readers are musicians who lack a skill that readers have. That skill is absolutely essential to many areas of music, and less essential to others.

Along the same lines, the answer to the question, "am I missing something by not being able to read" is clearly and unequivocally "yes." This is not a gray area, or an unanswerable question, as some have suggested. If you don't learn to read, you are lacking a skill that readers have. Period. Will the lack of that skill ultimately prevent you from making the type of music you want to make? That's a harder question and one that is ultimately going to depend on each individual and what he or she wants to be able to do as a musician.

It's already inhibiting me, to be honest. And I don't even gig anymore.

I learned to read music when I played trombone in high-school (late 70's/early 80's) and was pretty good at it after 4 or more years of playing in band. But I did my entire gigging career as a bass player until it ended in the early 90's sometime without learning to read for the bass.

There were definitely times there where reading would have been a big help.

But even now, there are songs I'd like to learn that are very difficult to do by ear. If I could read and had access to the sheet music (like I did in HS), it would be a hell of a lot easier, if my experience with the trombone was any guide.

So that's one of my projects even though I'm no longer a musician (now I'm a bass player) is, ironically, to pick it back up and transfer it to the bass finally.

Speaking of that, does anyone know if there's any sheet music for Eric Johnson's "Fat Daddy" anywhere? Thats one where the bass part is almost impossible for me to figure out fully by just listening to it, but would be good practice for me to learn to read along with learning that bass part.

Anyway, my .02 on reading. I'm all for it and intend to get back to it ASAP.

LS
 
LOL sorry i thought you were a civil engineer and our work paths would never cross, now i learn i am a civil engineer...for the past fifty years of cutting the grass, digging the garden, making flower beds, altering the look of the land, defines me as a Civil Engineer, i can dig holes , i have no idea how to read drawing, plans etc...but i am civil engineer it seems.



So can you imagine the senario at a profesional level where i keep telling you and other Civil Enginners how things are and how things work based on the my civil engineering experience?.........i think i would not be taken serious and laughed out of the room.;)




As has been said, Paul knows how to write music, so also read it to a degree that suits him, he started as a song writer and a guitarist, he is now also a composer, and has all the time and money to waste on his musical projects of he so chooses.....remember he picked up the bass because no one else in the Beatles would play the bass after Stuart Sutcliffe left..... please do not confuse anyone fame with what they are.
Rather than waste Ringo's time i will mention it the next time we met if you want.:)

Anyone and everyone has an opinion, everyone is a critic, so i am used to being analysed, critiqued, pulled a part etc it goes with the job....none of it i take personally, again one of the job skills of being a musician.....never take anything personal. What i get criticised for others get praised for and visa versa......music is subjective, as are the skills of those that play it.

Like i said, i find out now i am a civil engineer..... but who will hire me and on what grounds?........just sayin':)....

from a Civil Musician to a Civil Engineer

Thanks for keeping the conversation civilized! ;)
 
Someone suggested that people who don't read aren't musicians. That is utter nonsense. People who make music are musicians. It doesn't matter whether the source of the music they're making is a sheet of paper.

+1

Finally, with respect to comments like, "in my experience, people who read music can't play as well as people who don't" or "in my experience, people who read music don't play with as much feel": I don't doubt that you are accurately reporting your experience, but keep in mind that if you do not read yourself, you are probably not working with the musicians who are the better readers, so your experience is not necessarily representative.

I think that was well stated.
 
A shame, because having read your posts in this thread I've entirely changed my mind. I now agree that those who can neither read, nor write, are extremely unfortunate, and should make their best efforts to learn.

You obviously took things rather personal. Shows your intent in this thread. Obviously I never said anything like that.

Trolls suck.
 
@jeff: You are right. Apologies to tbplayer. But teachers can do their bit in changing the way things are!

Apology accepted. My original point was that when someone has a limited context in which to fit an idea, it's difficult to get them to understand the reasoning behind an argument. Believe me, teachers try and make subjects relevant to young people. Algebra is just a stepping stone to more advanced math, and other subjects like physics, chemistry, engineering, economics, computer programming, etc. But, they don't know what those things are beyond the introduction they've had in school. Further, when they hit the job market in 10 years, it's going to be a radically different world with radically different jobs.

That's why I brought it up. Life will take you down many paths. There are more opportunities available to you if you have more and varied skills. Some here argue that they haven't ever needed reading skills to this point in their life, so therefore, they will never need them. I just saw a parallel between that argument and those of some of my math students.
 
I've been struggling with this question and perhaps there are more bass players with the same concern. Am i missing too much out by not being able to read music fluently? I feel like i am, i feel like if i did id be able to grab anything in any style and "rock the world" o.O
Any thoughts?

I would say yes for for all the reasons you got here from others posts.

One important thing to evaluate is : how good is your ear!!!
I know a lot of great pro musicians that can't read but have ears to die for. So they can get work because they rely on their ears.

I would suggest you to learn reading and develop your ear at the same time if you don't have golden ears! You'll work on 2 very important aspects that will make you a much better musician and not just a better bassist.

Good luck with it and try to find a teacher if it is possible.
 
Life will take you down many paths.

100% true!

There are more opportunities available to you if you have more and varied skills.

I strongly agree with that statement. And in my opinion, having the skill of reading music will provide more opportunities for a musician (assuming of course that those are the types of opportunities that the person wants).

Some here argue that they haven't ever needed reading skills to this point in their life, so therefore, they will never need them.

I raise my hand here as being a person who can honestly say that I will never need the skill of reading music. Why? Because of what I love doing, which is, playing by ear. It's what gives me pleasure, and is how I have fun playing music. I have done it that way for 40 years of playing bass. I turn 57 this Saturday, and I can, in all honesty and sincerely, speaking from my heart, say that I have no desire to learn to read music. It would be like trying to get me to like lima beans. Sure, I know they are good for me, but no matter how much someone tells me how good they are for me, and no matter how many other people eat lima beans and love the benefits, Sactobass will never ever eat them! Ain't happenin!

So, I will enjoy the remainder of my years having fun playing bass by ear, and avoiding lima beans at all costs. (Peas too, and beets, and brussel sprouts.......GRRRRRRROSS!!!!) And I will be "missing out" on the health benefits, which is, of course, my choice as an individual.

:D
 
You're right and I have serious issues with the school system. I just don't think it's very fair to go after individual teachers for the failings of the system. You ever read John Taylor Gatto? He has some interesting observations.

Had a read of 'The 7-Lesson Schoolteacher' (http://www.newciv.org/whole/schoolteacher.txt). I think his criticisms of education are wider in scope than mine would be even, but his line "each action justifies itself and illuminates the past and future" resonates with me as the way it should be.

I feel that kids should be taught a lot more engineering, a lot younger. It would put into context a lot of the maths and science that can seem very abstract, and there'd be less of this "ok, you're not old enough to need to know this, but learn it anyway". Also, we'd be able to fix more stuff and become less of an 'If it doesn't work perfectly, throw it away' culture.
 
I'm perfectly happy to admit that some people may not need to read music, at least in certain genres - there have been far too many successful musicians who could not read to argue otherwise. What I hate is people who can't read who try to rationalize it by arguing that it would actually hurt them in some way - as though reading will ruin their creativity or something. Not one single musician who CAN read has ever claimed any such negative side effects. SO, if you don't need to read, don't want to read, fine, but please don't rationalize it with such absurd claims.
 
I will make the claim that reading has ruined more good weekends than I care to think about. I could have been with my wife or friends or puttering in the garage, but no, I was off gigging or rehearsing for gigs that evening. At times it was seriously depressing, and I am serious about that. Too much work, regardless of how you feel about the work in general, is not good for your mental health.

It is a good part of the reason why I live where I do now and don't take many new gigs. There is more to life than gigging.
 
I will make the claim that reading has ruined more good weekends than I care to think about. I could have been with my wife or friends or puttering in the garage, but no, I was off gigging or rehearsing for gigs that evening. At times it was seriously depressing, and I am serious about that. Too much work, regardless of how you feel about the work in general, is not good for your mental health.

It is a good part of the reason why I live where I do now and don't take many new gigs.

LOL - I don't think you can blame sight reading for that. ;)