Doug Parent
Supporting Member
I was playing my Warmoth PJ 5 equipped with Classic series Barts all the way around. Fat grind but refined and punchy. No gaps tonally. It's a hammer.
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
New Bergantino Neo Line; Pt. 2
- Thread starter Chef
- Start date
- Status
I was playing my Warmoth PJ 5 equipped with Classic series Barts all the way around. Fat grind but refined and punchy. No gaps tonally. It's a hammer.
Doug Parent
Supporting Member
Doug Parent
Supporting Member
Thought I would report back on my CN212. I didn't end up using it at Antone's. They have a house rig, and for a short set with bad pay, I decided to just make things easy on myself.
I did use my CN212 on a gig last night. It was an outdoor restaurant, vox only in the PA. Used my jazz with flats, and Thunderfunk amp (set flat for the most part). Plenty of volume, very nice strong punchy tone. I thought the bottom end was very tight. Didn't have that huge bottom end bloom thing going on (it may open up a bit as it breaks in). Reminded me a bit of a sealed cab in some ways. Very nice strong mids, but nothing ganky, or honky, or unpleasant.
The load in was crazy, gravel, a little downhill stone walkway, stairs, and just about everything else. I was able to put my bass on my back, carry my amp in my left hand, and one hand the CN212. One trip in and out. Amazing.
I did use my CN212 on a gig last night. It was an outdoor restaurant, vox only in the PA. Used my jazz with flats, and Thunderfunk amp (set flat for the most part). Plenty of volume, very nice strong punchy tone. I thought the bottom end was very tight. Didn't have that huge bottom end bloom thing going on (it may open up a bit as it breaks in). Reminded me a bit of a sealed cab in some ways. Very nice strong mids, but nothing ganky, or honky, or unpleasant.
The load in was crazy, gravel, a little downhill stone walkway, stairs, and just about everything else. I was able to put my bass on my back, carry my amp in my left hand, and one hand the CN212. One trip in and out. Amazing.
I have no idea. What I do know is that he rolls the passive tone control way back, and uses old flats. That sounds just awful to me personally. But again, he gets better gigs than me
I did hear him live with Herbie Hancock (subbing for Tal), and it really did sound awful. Pure mush, no note definition at all.
That is a pretty good example of how 'it is NOT all in the hands', since he is one of the greatest pop bassists alive IMO. I wanted to run up on stage and turn that passive tone control up, but alas, I didn't. It wasn't the venue either, since the bassist before him sounded magnificent.
It's funny, I saw Sting last night at an outdoor venue north of Chicago (Ravinia) and I was in the18th row dead center. I think he was using those Meyer PA cabs and he had a whole stack of them. Of course he was using his old P-bass and I kept wishing that he could capture the tone he had on all of those studio recordings but it did sound a little mushy and muffled. I think part of it is his touch though as he uses his thumb as a pick and it looks like he plays with a very soft touch. Great concert though and the cat can still sing. I can't imagine Pino using that P-bass tone with Herbie Hancock. That is almost un-called for
I can still remember seeing Paul Jackson with Herbie back in the day using that P or Tele or whatever it was and I could hear the bass notes perfectly. Sorry for the derail.
Not to get too far off track, but I heard Sting last summer. Long story, but I ended up with front row seats. I was so close I could actually hear him singing off mic. Anyway, I also heard his stage rig loud and clear. No mush there. In fact I thought it might have been the best stage sound I had ever heard. Farther back, being even 18 rows, may have been affected by the FOH sound.
Yeah, this close:
And now, back to CN212.....
Yeah, this close:
And now, back to CN212.....
Doug Parent
Supporting Member
For sure. I'm a pretty big guy at 6'2", and during load out, I did put it down to rest / re-adjust. I wouldn't want to do it all the time, but it is manageable.
I can't even imagine what that load in would have been like with my old Aguilar DB212. Would have been a 2 man job for sure.
Finally got a chance to check out a Bergantino CN212 in person!
I was finally able to play, hear and compare the CN212! Thanks to my TB friend "Capt Wally" for bringing his CN112 cab to the Shop. The shop had an HD112 in stock, so I was able to compare the Bergantino CN212 to a modular stack consisting of a Bergantino CN112 & HD112. VERY interesting day of shootouts!
1. CN212 = All kinds of awesome! Very impressive. I now understand the correlation to the AE series of Bergantino cabs. In my opinion, the CN212 behaves with the quickness, focus and punch of 10's, but has more fullness and low mid punch. It handles the B string with finesse., It growls and offers authority along with sweetness. The transition from low frequencies to mid-range and highs is very fluid and seamless. The CN212 cab handles boosting EQ with equal grace and finesse. (If you need to punch up the low end for a more supportive bass sound which I sometimes do.) I don't typically bump the bass EQ on my Nordy up more than 10%. That's PLENTY and gives more low end fullness to create a bigger, more supportive low-end that works well in the current/top 40 music mix I play. When I bumped the Low-end a little, I was rewarded with a full, punchy and focused low bass range without becoming overly bloomy, round or pillowy. It maintains a very articulate voice. (My preference!)
2. The HD212 overall sounded a little better and was meatier slightly in the lows and mids, but the CN212 takes EQ so well, I could get very close to the same tone, but without the calories! Didn't spend much time on the HD212 since lighter weight is one of the primary features compelling me to consider a CN212.
3. The CN212 compared to a CN112 / HD 112 stack was the most intriguing. You could make a case to love either and you wouldn't be unhappy either way you went. Overall, the CN212 is just so good, it makes more sense financially and in terms of ease-of-set-up. But if a modular rig is important or if you might gig with just a single 1x12 cab, a pair of Bergie 1x12's is certainly a great choice. I wished they had another CN112 so I could compare the whole stack. But I worked with what was available. I briefly compared the CN 212 to a pair of HD112's stacked and I actually preferred the CN212! AI felt the CN212 had a slightly more complex midrange and I suspect it might actually carve out its frequency range better in a band mix.
4. Single CN112 and HD 112 solo'd and compared. Neither the CN112 or HD112 would compel me to use just a single cab. IME/IMHO a single 1x12 Berg cab is just not full enough for my needs and tonal/performance goals. So a "modular rig" holds no value over a single 46 lb 2x12 cab like the CN212. And the Modular rig is a lot more $$$.
5. Baer ML112 compare to a single CN112 or to a single HD112. The Baer ML112 buried a single CN112 or the HD112 in my opinion. The Baer ML112 was sounded and played deeper, fuller, and was surprisingly as articulate in the treble/slap tone region. Simply wonderful. For my 1x12 needs, the Baer ML112 will always get the call. I will say however, I was surprised at how well the Baer ML112 top end compared to the Bergantino CN212. The Baer does not have a Tweeter. The Bergantino does. But both had wonderful presence in the upper frequency ranges.
6. Baer ML112 cab compared to the Bergantino CN212 cab. ...just to hear the difference. I knew it was not a fair comparison, but I wanted the data point. The CN212 has so much more sound, punch, fullness, authority. Definitely not an apples-to-apples comparison and simply proved what I expected; a 2x12 cab like the Berg CN212 will easily outperform even the best 1x12 cab. (I consider the Baer ML112 to be one the best 1x12 cabs available) All dissimilar contrasts aside, the CN212 plays sweetly at low volumes. For the times when the band gets pumping, sometimes I need a little more punch, fullness or bigger support than a single 1x12 cab will offer. So I might actually use a CN212 for smaller gigs for two reasons; A. the CN 212 Footprint is no larger than Baer (with the Baer vertically oriented), and B; the height of the 212 cab gives better near-field (near my ears) performance.
Basses:
I used my Nordy Ash/Maple VJ5C for most testing. Also used and F Bass BN5 and tried an Alleva Copollo LG5 as well as a Roscoe Century fretless bass.
Amps:
Demo'd the BRAND NEW GK MB Fusion 800, Aguilar TH500 and Orange Bass Terror 500.
This F Bass Freaking KILLS! (Macassar Ebony FB)
I was finally able to play, hear and compare the CN212! Thanks to my TB friend "Capt Wally" for bringing his CN112 cab to the Shop. The shop had an HD112 in stock, so I was able to compare the Bergantino CN212 to a modular stack consisting of a Bergantino CN112 & HD112. VERY interesting day of shootouts!
1. CN212 = All kinds of awesome! Very impressive. I now understand the correlation to the AE series of Bergantino cabs. In my opinion, the CN212 behaves with the quickness, focus and punch of 10's, but has more fullness and low mid punch. It handles the B string with finesse., It growls and offers authority along with sweetness. The transition from low frequencies to mid-range and highs is very fluid and seamless. The CN212 cab handles boosting EQ with equal grace and finesse. (If you need to punch up the low end for a more supportive bass sound which I sometimes do.) I don't typically bump the bass EQ on my Nordy up more than 10%. That's PLENTY and gives more low end fullness to create a bigger, more supportive low-end that works well in the current/top 40 music mix I play. When I bumped the Low-end a little, I was rewarded with a full, punchy and focused low bass range without becoming overly bloomy, round or pillowy. It maintains a very articulate voice. (My preference!)
2. The HD212 overall sounded a little better and was meatier slightly in the lows and mids, but the CN212 takes EQ so well, I could get very close to the same tone, but without the calories! Didn't spend much time on the HD212 since lighter weight is one of the primary features compelling me to consider a CN212.
3. The CN212 compared to a CN112 / HD 112 stack was the most intriguing. You could make a case to love either and you wouldn't be unhappy either way you went. Overall, the CN212 is just so good, it makes more sense financially and in terms of ease-of-set-up. But if a modular rig is important or if you might gig with just a single 1x12 cab, a pair of Bergie 1x12's is certainly a great choice. I wished they had another CN112 so I could compare the whole stack. But I worked with what was available. I briefly compared the CN 212 to a pair of HD112's stacked and I actually preferred the CN212! AI felt the CN212 had a slightly more complex midrange and I suspect it might actually carve out its frequency range better in a band mix.
4. Single CN112 and HD 112 solo'd and compared. Neither the CN112 or HD112 would compel me to use just a single cab. IME/IMHO a single 1x12 Berg cab is just not full enough for my needs and tonal/performance goals. So a "modular rig" holds no value over a single 46 lb 2x12 cab like the CN212. And the Modular rig is a lot more $$$.
5. Baer ML112 compare to a single CN112 or to a single HD112. The Baer ML112 buried a single CN112 or the HD112 in my opinion. The Baer ML112 was sounded and played deeper, fuller, and was surprisingly as articulate in the treble/slap tone region. Simply wonderful. For my 1x12 needs, the Baer ML112 will always get the call. I will say however, I was surprised at how well the Baer ML112 top end compared to the Bergantino CN212. The Baer does not have a Tweeter. The Bergantino does. But both had wonderful presence in the upper frequency ranges.
6. Baer ML112 cab compared to the Bergantino CN212 cab. ...just to hear the difference. I knew it was not a fair comparison, but I wanted the data point. The CN212 has so much more sound, punch, fullness, authority. Definitely not an apples-to-apples comparison and simply proved what I expected; a 2x12 cab like the Berg CN212 will easily outperform even the best 1x12 cab. (I consider the Baer ML112 to be one the best 1x12 cabs available) All dissimilar contrasts aside, the CN212 plays sweetly at low volumes. For the times when the band gets pumping, sometimes I need a little more punch, fullness or bigger support than a single 1x12 cab will offer. So I might actually use a CN212 for smaller gigs for two reasons; A. the CN 212 Footprint is no larger than Baer (with the Baer vertically oriented), and B; the height of the 212 cab gives better near-field (near my ears) performance.
Basses:
I used my Nordy Ash/Maple VJ5C for most testing. Also used and F Bass BN5 and tried an Alleva Copollo LG5 as well as a Roscoe Century fretless bass.
Amps:
Demo'd the BRAND NEW GK MB Fusion 800, Aguilar TH500 and Orange Bass Terror 500.
This F Bass Freaking KILLS! (Macassar Ebony FB)
+1 Nice review Gary. Glad you finally got to try one. As a former AE410 user, this cab is 'the next step up' from that amazing box (more similar to the AE410 than the AE212). Smaller (by quite a bit), lighter (by quite a bit), just as loud, a touch more balanced, still nice grind, and more open low end. Definitely the best single cab solution I've come across in my 40 years of playing!
Edit: +1 to your Baer ML112 comment versus most other 112's. That is an impressive cab. It's output and low end push is more similar to the AE210 than a more typical high quality 112. The tone of the ML112 is also quite similar to the AE210 (the 'v' updated version). If I didn't have an AE210v (which has that nice revoicing versus the original AE210), I would definitely consider the ML112 as my small gig cab. However, as you pointed out, the CN212 has an even smaller (slightly) footprint than the ML112, and isn't much heavier, and will do ANY gig imaginable. Kind of eliminates the need for a small cab all together!
Edit: +1 to your Baer ML112 comment versus most other 112's. That is an impressive cab. It's output and low end push is more similar to the AE210 than a more typical high quality 112. The tone of the ML112 is also quite similar to the AE210 (the 'v' updated version). If I didn't have an AE210v (which has that nice revoicing versus the original AE210), I would definitely consider the ML112 as my small gig cab. However, as you pointed out, the CN212 has an even smaller (slightly) footprint than the ML112, and isn't much heavier, and will do ANY gig imaginable. Kind of eliminates the need for a small cab all together!
Man, I bet that sounds good with the CN! I just picked up a Roscoe (go figure
... well, it was trans orange and that was that!), with the Barts and it is just a punch monster. Sounds great with the CN. It sounds very good with the TH500 and the Glockenklang, but it really seems to shine with the F500 (which I somewhat similar to the FET channel of the Shuttle Max).
I totally 'Get it.' ....My AE410 is for sale. Nuff said.
and the TH500 with the Bergantino CN212 is a delightful balance of old school chewy Aguilar sound with the very clear articulate Bergantino. They like each other a lot.
I wound up playing Wally's Roscoe Fretless at the end of the day through the TH500 into CN212. I forgot about the gear entirely and just played music. The gear gets out of the way. You know?
You got a Roscoe? what did you get?
I totally 'Get it.' ....My AE410 is for sale. Nuff said.
and the TH500 with the Bergantino CN212 is a delightful balance of old school chewy Aguilar sound with the very clear articulate Bergantino. They like each other a lot.
I wound up playing Wally's Roscoe Fretless at the end of the day through the TH500 into CN212. I forgot about the gear entirely and just played music. The gear gets out of the way. You know?
You got a Roscoe? what did you get?
Used trans orange Century Signature V with all the fancy upgrades. The Trans Orange just grabbed me
Totally different from anything else I own in every way. About as far from vintage as you can get in look, feel and tone. Fun to have that flavor and that super fast, super thin muli-lam neck thing in the otherwise 'vintage copy' stable
Never owned a Roscoe before. Beautiful, top of class woodwork and finish, and that massive B string tone. Didn't need it, but there you go
Doug Parent
Supporting Member
Man, I bet that sounds good with the CN! I just picked up a Roscoe (go figure
"trans orange and that was that"
Damit life is too short to not play orange basses if that moves you, rock the orange for all it's worth.
I'm still keeping my AE410 for now. Although the fact you moved on Ken does inspires confidence in my new CN212. I just haven't had it long enough but I have a feeling I'll probably follow suit. There are some nice open upper mids happening in the CN212 that I don't get from the Ae410,...... ya never know.....
@Ken: COOL! The Fretless I played was a Roscoe Century and Damn if it didn't make me feel like I could actually play fretless! I really enjoyed it. Roscoe's play really sweetly.
@ Doug, you own both the AE410 and now have a CN212? I was gonna take my AE410 to compare, but decided I didn't want to schlep it. (Another reason why I want to let it go. Tired of carrying it) ..But curious how they sound side-by-side to you? CN212 versus AE410?
and while I know Ken, you aren't a fan, I found an Ash F Bass BN5 with Macassar Ebony Fretboard that spoke to me. Stunning tone and playability. I picked it up and suddenly played better than I had all day! It hblew me away. It dispatched my Ash/Maple Nordy VJ5C in short order. ....
That is a beauty. Had one for a while... missed the bite of a 'true J' in the mix, and just never could get used to that unusual way the BN's 'hung' on the strap... WAY over to the left. Just always felt very strange to me. Beautifully made instruments though, and one of the most relaxed, transparent preamps on the market.
- Status
